UK sites with metered electricity
Comments
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I would have though a motorhome or campervan with decent cab heating would not need much warming up if any on arriving at a site. Mine certainly does not, I even arrive with hot water because the engine is fitted with a heat exchanger which uses engine heat to drive the Aldi system. I suppose I could warm it up before setting out on a journey but I don't because it does not take long for the cab heating to be effective before assisting the heat exchanger and spreading to the rest of the van.
My motorhomes have had far more effective heating systems than any of my caravans in fact i traded in my first caravan because I wanted a better heating system.
peedee
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well I would disagree, there appears to be a difference between insulation in the two which slows down the loss of heat and therefore needs less power for the same volume and warmth? And therefore is relevant in my view.
MH appear to need, or people like to have them, these insulating screens at the front which a caravan doesn't.
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With blown air heating (where air heats up and cools quickly) it's better to have the unit placed centrally where each of the four pipes can be kept as short as possible yet service all corners equally. With ALDE Hot water heating, the heated water which circulates to the radiators retains its heat so boilers and radiators can be placed less strategically.
our Combi is pretty central, and the outlets are numerous (3 in the cab, two in the lounge, one near the door (so being a front lounge van, that's effectively 6 in the habitation area), one in the bathroom, a long pipe that completely surrounds the bed (with multiple smaller outlets) and one in the garage...so plenty of heating points throughout the van, and with all the pipes running under the floor, feet are warm, as are water tanks and batteries..
smaller, cheaper, lighter vans (including ours) probably wouldn't see the benefit of an ALDE system that adds weight, complexity and cost.
we have a double skinned thermal blind that rolls down to cover the windscreen and blinds to all the side windows, but I made some extra thermal sections which fit neatly between the factory blinds and the side windows, creating a very warm cab area.
back to the OP, even if we all insulate our vans to the nth degree, it won't give us a saving if we can't benefit by using less fuel...but the club will.
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No, not tried the blinds as well as Silver Screen, will have to give it a go. Our seating area is at the front, utilising the cab seats and the vents are concentrated at this end. This makes the bedroom end somewhat cooler which is good. We do let some heat bleed into the garage through the vent there. It means there isn’t a cold void under the beds and the walking boots are not stone cold the next day.😀
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I think I've agreed with you before on this and even asked why the unit is mounted where it is on caravans (usually right at the front) apart from what you say about heat distribution I assume it's heavy even empty and weight wise would might more sense to move it to the middle?
Another in my view stupid thing to do is that the air ducts on mine (and I remember a few others have mentioned this) actually goes underneath and outside the caravan to bypass the cassette toilet, only a foot or so but still! Mine wasn't even insulated although I got it asap.
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Very good advice I will admit
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With a single floored van, you would think a designer would place the Combi on the side opposite the door...otherwise the pipe work has to go under the door (outside) to get from back to front... my own Swift did this...not good.
some converters even use narrow bore pipe to run behind fridges etc rather than making the opening large enough for the normal sized tubing...more poor design.
it cant be rocket science to design in the heating system and let the fixtures be built around it, rather than treating it as an afterthought.
of course, a double floor provides space for heating pipes (and plumbing and electrics) to be routed to best serve the heating design rather the furniture design which isn't impacted.
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We have had two caravans of different makes both had heaters that were in stupid places that made keeping a vehicle warm was impossible ?
When I contacted the manufacturers of both heating systems at the Birmingham shows ,they both said we give advise to those who ask where to place the heaters/run warm air pipes and a few follow what we advise, as long as it aestheticaly fits in with their designs
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I recall with my caravan that there was a shortish run of heating duct under the van for which I fabricated a wooden box which I lined with 1" polystyrene. Not sure if the improvement was real or imagined.
Corners wrote "We have always had a large 6 six berth caravan and after warm up 900W is more than enough. In fact the heat thermostat is often at 3 out of 5 otherwise we're too warm"
Members should remember that this individual is a Geordie and we know that they are given to wandering round in shirtsleeves in two feet of snow. Us 'southern softies' may find our mileage may vary.
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Reminds me of the situation in the shipbuilding industry in the 1960s. The fitting out of hulls was not planned in any detail. It was a case of whoever got there first when installing items. So if the electricians had run a bit of 1" conduit somewhere and the plumbers came along later fitting a 24" steam pipe they had to fit 90 degree bends and go around it. All jobs and working practices stoutly defended by a multitude of Trade Unions.
We lost the business of building ships as we were not competitive.
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that really made me chuckle
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In our caravan the heater is right at the front of the van on the off side, so the tubes run down that side through the food cupboard (boxed in) under the wardrobe and into the bathroom. It also crosses the van (inside) at the front where the middle chest is, then runs down that side under the seats, behind the fridge and vents out under the cupboard next to the fridge. The only place in the van that isn't cosy warm is the bathroom.
In the MH the heater is at the rear of the van on the drivers side, its a rear lounge. The heating runs down that side of the van, first to a vent inches from the heater (it gets very hot) it runs under the seating to a vent under the fridge, its good. Another tube runs along the outside wall under the seating, splits into 2, one feeds the bathroom, (nice and warm) the other vents out under a cupboard opposite the big sliding door (it is the weakest vent) the heater would be best placed forward of the rear axle.
With it placed under the seating it makes that area very hot (shortest run) but the front of the van chilly (longest run) the thermostat is at the rear of the van so its very difficult to get the front of the van warm without making the rear of the van boiling. I've given in now and take a small oil filled radiator with me in winter to 'sit' at the front of the van. With this on low and the Truma on 900w the vans heating feels more balanced.
Having experienced Alde heating if I was to buy another caravan I would certainly look at it having Alde. Once its warmed up its a much more even heat.
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Because blown air really does not make it to the washroom I've installed there an electric towel rail. Makes towels nice and warm as well as heat the space.
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As corners mentioned, with weight balance being an important element of caravan design, you'd think the heater (usually full of water) would be placed centrally, then enter able to give a more even heat distribution.
with many caravans being front lounge and rear washroom, with the heater placed at the front, it's a long run to the washroom..heated towel rails at the ready..
conversely, with a rear lounge MH and the heater under your seat, as TG notes, it's great at the rear (very hot) then a long run to the cab end (less heat in the coolest part of the van) and thermostat control can be tricky.
there's no doubt that, for even heat distribution, a wet system is better able to maintain its purpose wherever the unit is sited but a cheaper, lighter warm air system can still be more than adequate especially in smaller vans and if a little thought is given to its siting in relation to the layout of that van.
Occupants at one end and the heater at the other, especially in a larger van might make life a bit more interesting...however, using gas/mix certainly does give even the distant outlets some real puff...
interestingly, the Combi started out as a gas only product with electric options being introduced to suit particular markets and inclusive electric options.
however, 900w or even 1800w doesn't deliver the same impact as a 6kw (or even 4kw) Combi on full chat.
I wonder how many converters test their systems on all power supplies (especially the 'weaker' EL settings) to asses the effectiveness of their (considered?) install?
or do they just whack it in where there's space and let the customers do the real life testing? Surely not?
stay warm everyone👍
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I have noticed that the Truma thermostat is connected by two wires. It would be a simple job to relocate the thermostat somewhere else in the caravan that makes more sense in relation to the actual usage of the inhabitants. I have been meaning to shift it in my caravan as it is at carpet level and right opposite the outside door so does not react to the tropical heat at roof level but to anyone opening the door.
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I meant to mention that on the back of the Truma heating unit in my caravan there is a diverter flap that can be used to send more of the hot air in one of the two directions. As the two front outlets are only a couple of feet from the fire I have it set to send most of the air through the cupboards and under the bed to the sleeping area.
Adjusting this flap, if present, may help others avoid the cold zone.
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We do seem to be drifting away from "metering" to thermal efficiency of outfits.
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CY, you're right, of course...
I couldn't decide from the OP if they were looking for sites that metered leccy because they wanted to visit them for fairness reasons, had a curiosity for the different charging methods employed or do we like them or not?
probably a bit of all....
I think we've had plenty of debate on like/not and whether/how the club might do it but not many comments on other sites doing it, other than overseas where it's quite common.
not sure there's much more to dig out that's directly relevant to the OP, just more of us rambling a bit OT...and for that I apologise, lol.....tis the way...😉
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"With the price of electricity rising year on year, and the recently announced major increases, many CL sites have now chosen to meter the use of EHU and charge visitors for EHU per kWh at cost price in line with the OFGEM regulations."
posted by a CL owner on this CL thread where I asked how CLs could make this change and maintain prices....the metering being, presumably, to detach the fast rising electric portion from the rest of the price components.
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I don’t know about “many” sites, we have yet to come across one. But then we are not likely to visit anything that costs us more than £20 per night anyway. With or without metering.
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Just came across an article in the December issue of the Camping & Caravanning Club Magazine (page 16) featuring a futuristic design for a new solar powered motorhome. It's self-sufficient for power, both on the road and on-site.
If the design can also be adapted for caravans, we won't be needing EHU in the future - we will just have to chop down all the trees so that pitches aren't shaded from the sun
There's more info at https://solarteameindhoven.nl/
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Can't see it catching on in Britain for all year round travel with the lack of sunshine, especially in late Autum and through winter. Would make for a very expensive way of touring over here, even if one could afford to buy one in the first place.
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Today with wind on again it is still supplying one gigawatt.
As the country becomes more and more dependent on wind, wave ( which is wind dependent) and solar there will be a shortage of a back-up power supply. Nuclear is just too expensive as lifetime costs of the clean-up of the first reactor are not yet known, and coal and gas will not be available to fire power stations. We should be starting to educate the populace now about there being power-cuts in the future. Electricity is no longer an always-on power in a green world.
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