Driving to Italy
Hello All,
After driving to Italy this summer, and paying a fortune in French tolls and tunnel charges (and then the first Italian toll after Mont Blanc of over 80EUR), we decided to return, toll free, via Switzerland, Germany and Belgium.
We've just booked a site near Rome for next summer and would like advice on the best route from Calais. I've posted a suggested route map with this discussion. We are anticipating the Swiss vignette this time and I believe that's around 80CHF (car&caravan). Please can you let me know if there are better options than the one I've posted?
Comments
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I would use your route and pay for the Swiss vignettes if I had time to spend in Switzerland - as we love the mountain scenery although not too keen on the solemn Swiss lifestyle.
Your alternative route would be via places marked on your map as Stuttgart, Tirol and Trento - it's actually via Innsbruck and the Brenner pass motorway.
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We have been to Italy many times and I have to say it has never entered my head to go via Switzerland. That may well be because we have tended to head towards Garda and Venice. We have only driven as far south a Rome once and on that occasion we went via the Fern and Brenner passes. There is a modest toll for the Brenner and you will need a Vignette for the car but you can buy them for different lengths of stay so much cheaper than the Swiss system. I suppose there should always be a health warning attached to recommendations as there will always be a debate viz a viz cost of tolls and distance so you need to do your homework as what seems to be a cost saving on tolls might mean more fuel.
David
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Have you thought of Harwich to Hook of Holland. It may be cheaper than to Calais if using the club booking service, it was last year. You can then use the free autobahns through Germany to Austria and on to Italy. It is not many miles more
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Have a look at viaMichelin and it will give you an accurate costing. It also now gives a breakdown showing toll cost per section, vignettes fuel etc.
We have done most routes and last week compared prices for a Roscoff to Peschiera route and a Hook to Peschiera route.
The France route costs are very high, if you go via Switzerland even higher, and the Italian section near Milan also now costly.
As Harry suggests take a look at Harwich-I did two dats ago and got a price for June of £158 for car and van.
We will probably use the Fern/Reisa Pass route, then via Landeck and this is toll free till Bolzano.
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MAM I went to Italy using the same route as your planned one French tolls were over £80 (one way) and Swiss vignettes were £64. I return through Switzerland (as vignettes were valid for a year) then through Germany and Holland to Harwich
I would not use France again.
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Good evening MAM. This subject has been discussed a few times on this forum. I will add my tupeneth. We have been to Italy many times and our route is Calais, Belgium, Germany, Fern Pass, Reisenpasse (Landeck) or Brenner into Italy. The first tolls you pay will be for the Brenner and then in Italy. If you go via Landeck no Austrian Vignette needed, but Austria is such a beautiful country we like to spend a few days there. Get an afternoon crossing and spend your first night at one of the many sites just east of Calais, you are then able to hit the roads having regained the hour lost. Fuel is cheapest in Austria and Germany (Luxemburg of course if you go that way but not worth a massive diversion) so ensure you enter Italy with a full tank! There have been road works in the area of Karlsrue for a number of years so you should get an update nearer your trip. Having said that we have not been too badly held up there BUT we travel out of season and try to plan to avoid the area on a Friday to Sunday. There are plenty of night stops on route and it is best to stop reasonably early to ensure you can get in.
P.S. We paid over 100 euros one way in French Autoroute tolls for a trip to Provence last year!
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Hi, quick look at viamichelin gives the figures below, one from Calais, as per you map, and one from the Hook via Fern/Reisa passes which also would mean no €9.20 for Austrian vignette.
Fuel costs are based on a luxury vehicle at €1.40 a litre but of course the difference would be pro-rata for any type of vehicle
CALAIS ROUTE
€364.06
Time: 19h23 (17h41 on motorways)
Distance: 1069 mi (1011 mi on motorways)
Costs: * €364.06 (toll €58.10 + consumption €232.96 + vignettes €73.00)
*The fuel costs takes into account the fuel consumption of your vehicleHOOK ROUTE
€279.95
Time: 18h58 (14h08 on motorways)
Distance: 1027 mi (866 mi on motorways)
Costs: * €279.95 (toll €52.50 + consumption €218.25 + vignettes €9.20)
*The fuel costs takes into account the fuel consumption of your vehicle0 -
The quickest way from Calais is to use the French autoroutes - Reims, Metz, Strasbourg- then through Switzerland at Basel. The autoroutes are better roads and have better stopping places (Aires) and are free after Strasbourg so the tolls are far less than going down to the Mont Blanc tunnel. Really though it depends what you want to do and see on the way down. A mad dash to Rome does not seem very worthwhile.
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A&J
your workings out just back up what I gave said to people about the Hook of Holland route. It is often overlooked by people when planning a crossing especially to the east side and as you've shown, considerable savings can be made. Living in the Midlands, Harwich is a much easier journey thzm battling with the horrors of the M25 and much congested route to Dover.
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Thank you for all your responses. I’ve booked the Eurotunnel already (if the new Club booking system is working) so I’ll definitely be travelling both ways through Calais. This year, we travelled down through France and back through the non motorway roads in Switzerland, stopping for a few days in Zermatt. I enjoyed the Simplon Pass and a couple of other similar climbs (1st gear round the hairpins) but that meant it took all day to get through Switzerland. I’ll look into Austria as an alternative to Switzerland. We’re booked onto a Friday evening train and plan to arrive on the site near Rome on Sunday afternoon so I’ll get a lot of the Journey done overnight on Friday night. For the journey back, we’re going via Duinrell in NL so we’ll just follow the Dutch home.
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We loved Zermatt when we stopped there about three years ago. Fabulous views on the Gornergratbahn railway up to the top. Hope the weather stays fine; we were extremely lucky to have a clear blue sky.
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Hi Harry,
As I mentioned we have used most routes over the years and cost has always been a factor.
However that has changed in its importance as the years have passed and having endured the 'drag it to Dover' experience we started to look at other routes and this led to the variety.
Ironically we joined the club to be able to get Red Pennant insurance and use the Roscoff route for our first ever crossing which, with site fees, left little from our holiday savings.
We started to use Dover when going to Italy and then looked around when it became a pain and are now paying less, for a BF crossing than on that first trip in 1991.
The Harwich route came up in 2015, when looking at a route for us and our MH buddies to Italy, and it suited as we have friends in Holland that we could visit and its the closest to our Daughter in Northampton so worked for a visit there as well.
We stayed overnight on the check in lanes, there was loads of room and Stena confirmed this was OK, and then got a day cabin for the trip out.
We sought advice on CT and looked at the Fern Pass route for the trip to Garda and discovered that the Austrian vignetted is required if you use tunnels, even though some also have a toll, and avoiding the Landecker Tunnel meant the route from Hook to Bolzano was toll free.
We found the drive a very nice change from the usual motorway monotony and would not hesitate to use it again and having decided on a stop at Prutz and liked the site so much we stayed for 4 nights.
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Hi MAM, let us know what route you use as its around a 1000 miles, whichever way you go, from Calais to near Rome and a day and a half seems quite ambitious!
Also interested in the toll free route across Switzerland as we have only considered one and that was via St Moritz to travel from Austria to Italy.
If you are going to Duinrell you are less than 25 miles from the Hook so may still be worth considering if your shuttle booking can be changed without penalty.
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Hi MAM, let us know what route you use as its around a 1000 miles, whichever way you go, from Calais to near Rome and a day and a half seems quite ambitious!
I agree even at 400 miles a day that's 2 1/2 days driving plus going over mountain passes I imagine is gong to slow things down a bit?
We live 20 miles from Harwich but never used it as the cost is prohibitive. With only 2 or 3 week holiday to sit on a boat for 8 hours is a waste of a day so only an overnight crossing would work for us but by time you get cabin, food etc. compared to a 2 hour drive to Dover, cross over and a night in Calais ready for off the next day its a no brainier on the cost and time front. Plus we do not make a definite decision on where we are going till we get off the Ferry, look at the weather map and find the sun in summer or no/less rain in spring and autumn.
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Hi, As I said above it suits us as it fits with other things, the price is good and we can travel from home in the evening and, if lucky, get around the M25 with nerves still intact.
As a MHer it may be different but my recollection is that our friends 8m Autotrail was a reasonable price-cant remember detail but he would not have used it had it not been!
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We live under 50 miles from Harwich so that is our normal choice 95% of the time, both day and night service. For day crossing we always use the Stena lounge and rarely if ever buy food on the ship. We do use the crossing as part of the holiday. We use the night crossing if we want to go a fair distance the next day. Never buy food just a coffee from the purser then we stop at a service station and eat breakfast in the van. Booking through the club is usually the cheapest option.
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Hi AllanandJean,
I do enjoy long drives so I've traveled this kind of mileage a few times - to Barcelona last year and to Lake Garda this summer. This year, we traveled on the Saturday evening Eurotunnel and arrived at Lake Garda on Monday afternoon - and that was with a 24 hour stop-over in Chamonix (Sat noon to Sun noon). So next year, without the long stop-over, we should be able to cover more distance. My aim is to get the bulk of the driving out of the way over Friday night (through the less scenic parts of Belgium and Germany) while the family sleep in the back of the car - fortunately, they are good travelers. And then hit the Swiss motorways and northern Italy through Saturday, with the last leg on Sunday morning. I've allowed two nights stop-over for the return trip to Duinrell.
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Also interested in the toll free route across Switzerland as we have only considered one and that was via St Moritz to travel from Austria to Italy.
We hit the route through Switzerland by using the non-Toll option on the sat nav. It led us over two very interesting mountain passes, travelling from Zermatt to Basel. At one point, we got to over 2,000 metres altitude and the kids were playing in the snow.
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MAM, we’ve used the route you’ve highlighted from Calais to Rome on a number of occasions and its certainly cheaper than others through France and relatively quick. It’s not just the cost of tolls through France, fuel prices have escalated exponentially in the last year or so. The road surfaces in Belgium have improved of late. We normally use the St Gottard tunnel route through Switzerland and have rarely encountered any significant delays at the tunnel.
Which site are you planning to stay on in Rome? It’s an amazing city and I’m sure you will enjoy it.
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We've driven to Italy several times, but never directly. We've always taken in Italy as part of a longer tour and gone via France (the Rhone) and have spent time in Provence. When we came back the last time we used the Frejus tunnel and stayed in the French side of Geneva, before heading back up through France.
David
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MAM, I have been following this post with interest. We have been to Italy many times on holiday visiting the Lakes, Venice, Tuscany/Umbria and as far south as Sorrento and the Gargano peninsular. It is our favourite European country for holidays. As we are retired we can spend 5 - 6 weeks on these trips and always go out of season. However, a few years ago we decided that the best way to see Rome was to fly and stay in a city centre apartment within walking distance of the main attractions. With the crowds trying to get into the main sites and the security checks, you will spend a considerable time just waiting to enter. We have now done this twice and still feel there is much more to see in this fascinating city. Appreciating that you are used to driving long distances it is a long way to Rome at 50mph for most of the way. Not sure there is much opportunity to use kayaks etc in Rome
. Many do what you plan so have a great trip; for us though, it is flying there. Have a great trip and don't forget the sun hats
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Also just out and back to the Black Forest for half term. Avoided tolls, got cheap fuel in Luxembourg but as Deleted User User says the traffic in Germany was horrific. We came back through France, cost about £30 in tolls, still did Lux for fuel.
Avoid the major junctions (A8/A5) and Karlsruhe.
Have fun, looks like a great trip.
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Duinrell is awesome - some of the pitches are tight though.
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We used to caravan to Italy every year upto about 15 years ago and at that time used the Belgium, German, Bremerton route and thought it was an economical and pleasant route. However, we went that way in September this year to get to Tuscany and never again. The traffic and road works were horrendous all the way and road conditions were very bad, especially Belgium. We were both worn out just getting to Metz on the first day.
We came back via Epinal early October as there was limited camp sites open. We are going to Garda next June for a month but will use the French toll roads down to Basel. As someone has already pointed out, the quality of the roads and Aires are worth the extra cost and there are some stretches where the autoroutes are toll free.
Because we have a MH over 3500kgms I got hold of the Swiss Via app from App Store and purchased my Swiss toll ticket via the app. I paid £25 for 10 days of travel over the year, so can use it again next June. Vignettes are not available for vans over 3500kgms.
BillC
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We have to travel to Milan for work in early February and am trying to provide an estimate of cost based on using the route you've described and using toll roads for speed. Do you know, approximately the cost of French and italian tolls I'm likely to pay, 3.5 tonne motorhome.
Am struggling to input a motorhome on the Via Michelin app! So any help is hugely appreciated.
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French tolls to Basel are class 2 for your Motorhome as for car and caravan - try various routes on Via Michelin website after ticking the box for Caravan - that will give you prices and comparative times for each route.
It looks like 77 euros for the route suggested via Reims, Metz and Strasbourg, but I always went from Calais via Lille and Luxembourg - mostly free motorway, cheaper and not much slower.
Swiss vignette is 40 Swiss francs or about 37 euros.
Italian tolls for the short stretch to Milan will only be about 5 euros.
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