The Planet in Peril
Comments
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I'm truly not seeking to be provocative, but feel that given that the club's magazine is basically a lot of advertising with articles added, sometimes advertorial articles, it can't help being, in effect, a lobbying organisation, though that's not a word I used.
It's big, it reaches a lot of people in the caravan/MH world, it sells things. So it's influential. Hence my feeling that it has a certain responsibility, and so my post in the other topic.
I hope that putting it this way doesn't sound too red-raggish
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The advertising in the magazine is paid for by advertisers. It is not the club giving sponsorship.
I think you’ll find that mags such as MMM and Practical Caravan are far bigger.
Btw, it’s the being told how to post and having opinions quoted as absolute fact that riles me. We are all entitled to state our opinions and debate issues but a few people tend to preach with a 'holier than thou' attitude.
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So, to get back to the OP, 'What shall we do about it' ,seems there is little choice but to refrain from caravanning, motor-homing, camping, going on holiday by plane, nipping down town to go shopping by car etc.
Perhaps we should all stay at home and grow veg in our back gardens - except that I am not a veggie, will need to go down town to get meat and am therefore unlikely to be the saviour of this planet.
I agree that ice ages come and go, so the opposite is that global warming also comes and goes.
I shall try not to panic!
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I’ll be doing nothing to change my lifestyle. My Diesel driving is here to stay. Being dictated to by anyone in an ivory tower does no favours for their honesty or credentials. For every climate changist there is a naysayer. When there is 100% agreement between the climate folk I will stop & listen. In the future I may get a hybrid👍🏻
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I agree entirely.
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again +1
I have considered a hybrid but only to save money on fuel and its cheaper to run - nothing else.
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The club is a organisation for caravaners and motor-homers, funded by us and it should use its 'influence' on matters relating to that, and not on issues such as this. The subject of global warming has divided opinions in the 'real world' as well as those already shown on here, why should it use resources when there is no real consensus from members?
Would you expect the club to start using its influence on political issues or which party to support? Of course not. There are other organisations for that and if you feel strongly then get them to do the lobbying.
Also perhaps when you personally lead by example, give up holidays with a van and use a bike and tent you might get more credence.
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But the reason why hybrids are now increasingly available, why diesels are becoming increasingly expensive to own and run, why so much is being spent on developing lighter vehicles and less polluting technologies is purely down to the 'evidence' being presented. What technology is available to us and those choices we make in the future is already being driven and determined by the global warming agenda. For all those protestations and folk in denial I'm afraid 'it' is already being 'done' to us. Like it or not, the agenda appears to be unstoppable and irreversible, unfortunately and possibly just like global warming itself.
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It's unlikely that hybrids will prove to be as efficient as EVs, EV development is increasing rapidly but a small hybrid battery won't get you very far and you're still left with polluting emissions. The club are no doubt aware of the changes coming to the vehicle industry and it's in all our interests that they are, particularly the development of EVs which can tow or maybe the non fossil fuelled motorhomes of the future.
No doubt the caravan, motorhome and tow car industry will be working on the various possibilities and infrastructure needed in the future whether or not anyone on here opts for something different at present.
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I don't deny that the world is warming up but what concerns me is that the reasons may not be that clear and that some 'reasons' are put forward by those that have a commercial interest in certain products, eg battery manufacturers.
Over millions of years there has been a natural cycle of the world cooling and warming. Only 10,000 years ago I believe Britain was under a very thick ice sheet. I don't think any inhabitants at the time would have made any difference by lighting bonfires to try to fend off the inevitable cooling. And it will happen again. Not in our lifetime but it will happen.
Burning fossil fuels will undoubtedly have a negative atmospheric effect but so do many other things. The massive deforestation around the world probably has a far greater global effect, these forests being described as 'the lungs of the earth'. The trees have been replaced in the main by 'a new kid on the block', palm oil plants so that we may enjoy cheaper food and cosmetics.
On the other side of the argument, the absolutely massive herds of larger herbivores that at one time roamed the African plains have been almost wiped out. But it was these herds that produced enormous amounts of methane gas, well before fossil fuels were being used so globally 'greenhouse gasses' have been produced naturally and in enormous quantities for millennia.
So whilst changing our driving styles such as not going quite so far on holiday or changing to an electric vehicle will probably make a difference, in the overall scheme of things these may make virtually no appreciable difference, even if we all did it.
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Whether you agree or disagree that Global Warming is fact or fake news it would seem to me that one fact that stands out is that we are polluting our planet and have been since the Industrial Revolution and we can do something about that. If 40000 people in the UK die where pollution is a contributory factor we have a big issue. I appreciate that people will say that it was as worse 50/100 years ago before the clean air act but none the less we are still pumping poison into our atmosphere. Even if you ignore the fact that our Climate might be warming there are things we can do to reduce the adverse affect on ourselves. The problem is coming up with solutions which can be supported by the majority and I think there needs to be a lot more education on the subject so we understand. Governments have got to be prepared to have a carrot and stick approach to persuading people. That might include taxing cars that use petrol/diesel more but subsidising to a far greater extent electric cars. Another option would be to subsidise solar panels on all houses. Just plant more trees.
David
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It is certainly a complex issue. The flap of a butterfly's wing and all that.
Whilst much is made of the switch to EVs, they are not impact neutral. Manufacturing and use of rare minerals in batteries plus their eventual disposal all have an impact.
We are forever being bombarded with figures for economic growth, balance of payments etc. but is perpetual growth either desirable or feasible? One country's surplus is another's deficit.
Our western society is predicated on continuing consumption, so in many ways we are authors of our own destruction. Perhaps we should be thinking about walking this earth with a lighter step rather than just focusing on what is under the bonnet.
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Over the millennia there have indeed been significant variations in temperature. However, these have generally taken place over much larger time scales than the present rise. This allowed a certain amount of adaptation by the earth residents of the time.
Of course they didn't have large cities to protect, or relocate above rising sea levels. Or the huge population densities, many of which exist barely above survival level currently.
True there have been some rapid changes as a result of volcanic activity. Or going further back a massive metorite hitting the earth and wiping out much of the life on the planet. Unfortunately we are not currently advanced enough to do much about those eventualities. However, we do have the capability and technology to limit the amount of carbon dioxide and other pollutants we put into the atmosphere.
We managed to avoid a Third World War in the latter part of the 20th century. If we get it wrong, this has the potential to be equally devastating to the world as a whole.
Even if there are other reasons, beyond our control for the rapid rise. Surely it still makes sense to mitigate it by changing what we can.
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I would like to point out that there were no records kept over the billions of years that the Earth has been in existence until very recent time. During those billions of years, the Earth has fluctuated from cold to hot in natural cycles. Therefore to say that the earth is becoming warmer in a much shorter time now, as against the other times is IMO quite simply wrong. Where is the proof ? , there is none. --------There are only personal opinions based on semantics trying to put fear into the world's population to subscribe to highly profitable Green Energy products ----------------nothing else.
K
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Things can be lighter but it has to be designed in. It's not just a case of reducing the size/thickness of things. Back in my dinghy racing days, I managed to build a hull that weighed less than a friend's centreplate(keel) on his dinghy.
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If we in Britain all changed to electric vehicles tomorrow, what impact would it have on the planet? Very little. When you consider that Britain is about as large as a couple of US states, ditto China, then until both of them commit to reduce their carbon footprint on this planet, nothing we do will make much impact.
Getting rid of Trump and bringing USA back into the Paris agreement would be a first step, but until then, they'll continue to drive around their roads in their big V8 gas-guzzling trucks, whilst the rest of the world stare in disbelief. Proof, if it were needed, that the oil companies billions of dollars rule this planet.
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In terms of immediate planetary impact, indeed, a UK change to electric vehicles might indeed have relatively little impact, you're quite probably right.
But as David K and others rightly point out, each of us doing what we can does add up. And almost as important, such moves foster the climate (no pun intended!) of acceptance that this is the intelligent and positive way to go, rather than all waiting for someone else to make the first move - that way nothing happens and we continue to pump out the pollutants.
It's hugely encouraging that so much is already happening. Even in the USA there is increasing movement in the right direction. China's a big sinner, but it is vastly increasing its solar energy output, whatever its motivation for doing so.
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each of us doing what we can does add up
Excellent so please tell us what you personally are doing as a caravaner/MHer?
Are you taking less trips in your 'gas guzzling' (your words) car and van? Are you giving up towing (hence using less fuel producing less harmful emissions)? Are you even giving your present holidaying with a car and van and changing to a bike and tent?
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I am not sure we need to concerned with billions K, but for the last 500 million years or so there is a fossil record, that can be used to show the speed of environmental changes. For more recent history there is dendrochronology (tree rings) which have proved very useful.
However, to some extent the speed might be irrelevant. If sea levels rise to the degree predicted. Several island nations will cease to exist. Perhaps they have a bit more to loose.
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I think the idea in the UK just now is that we start making changes so that we can make our remaining fossil fuel supplies last a bit longer so that we're not dependent on supplies from other countries. We'll gain from having less particulates in the air if we change to non fossil fuels and we gain if other countries agree to do the same. At present China is not the most polluted country, that record goes to several other countries, have a look on google, anyone who might be interested will probably be surprised.
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but what? are you suggesting less trips away?
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Well, as we've got an EV I think we've made a big change and we're not away in our MH just now and frankly I'm happy to leave it at home this time round.
Edit...and Oops I don't want to appear "holier than thou" do I?
So I hope to see more discussions in the future about EV ownership, EV towing etc and that will no doubt show that things are changing in a positive way?1 -
Hence my original post to ask what the CAMC might do to help promote the equipment, or even just improve awareness of what's already there, so that I and others can continue to enjoy trips away without increasing the problem.
We've personally taken other steps in our daily lives, yes, but that isn't the concern of this discussion. What I'm hoping for is more momentum towards more eco-friendly ways of holidaying. If we could run to an EV now, we'd have done so - though yes, there is still the problem of the battery production to be solved.
Discussing ways and means here seems like a great idea, so more of us can find out what's already happening and what progress can be expected.
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Strange that our EV is also 95% recyclable with a carbon fibre structure etc. But I've said that before on a vehicle thread so I'll let others have their say now on the OP rather than divert it to cars. How about more walking and less driving?
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