Charging electric cars on Club sites.
Comments
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If the club is happy for us to use electricity as we wish 24 hours a day and a risk assessment done then there is no more to say from the club point of view.
As for the owner of the vehicle, it seems that the salesmen have different advice because this Is new and they don't really know. Reading online gives conflicting information, so I suppose it is down to the owner to ensure that what they are doing is safe and that no risk to fellow caravanners, and that their insurance company are happy.
As for the cost we will wait and see.
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Personally I don't like the attitude, I've paid for it, it's mine so I will just use/abuse the planets resources. Common sense tells most of us that energy is a finite, expensive and precious resource so most of us don't misuse it because we can
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Surely that would be against your own ethos which isn’t you being you, it’s tantamount to a hissy fit, I doubt very much that is the real you☹️
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When it is being said by he club that there seems to be no problem with the use of electricity for other than originally intended,then I am inclined to agree with you,we have normally turned the heating /hot water either off or down low when out,but now the EV being charged,and the awning heaters heating the sky, then we need not be uncomfortable when returning to the LV
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Personally I don’t like others expecting me to be like them OP, we are all different with different ways. I don’t travel the Country depleting precious resources to then decry others for using these same resources. We are all guilty of wasting resources, best not add hypocrisy to our failings☹️
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In September the club opened up a discussion about "alternative" vehicles in the tow car section. It was made a sticky so it's at the top of the page and they're looking for your feedback on the subject. Owners of hybrids have commented on there and it's quite an interesting read.
Just to allay fears EVs are safe and the development work that has gone into them has been advanced year on year.
I was asked why our EV with a range extender couldn't be used on site to charge the battery but I should point out the RE only works when the engine is running.
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Very good post there R2B and you have hit the nail on the head.
It appears that some have this idea that they can justify to themselves driving either a MH or caravan using up far more fuel than without such a LV, arrive on site and then connect up to EHU. Somehow that is OK, (isn't that a case of I have paid for my outfit so I'll use it?) but then start to pontificate to others beyond that point?
If these posters maybe give up their high mpg outfits and start cycling and camping (without EHU of course) then perhaps they could be given more credence?
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well I don't see staying in my van for a holiday as any differently to staying in a hotel. I would be very annoyed if I came back to a cold hotel room, why should my van be any different? Now if you are happy with that boot camp approach then by all means carry on, but I'll keep my heating on while I'm out and during the night if necessary. That is not misuse, it is use to enable me to have an enjoyable stay,
btw, you appear to have a motor home so it may be different- I have no idea never had one - but my van keeps toasty warm on the 0.9Kw setting, and of course it has a thermostat as well which means it's not actually using that all the time.
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It is unlikely that you'll wait until it's totally empty before you recharge as there would be a risk that you would run out if power before you got back. You would usually recharge once it's down to a quarter and that would only take 6 hours.
When we stayed at Baltic Wharf club site, the site fees averaged over £32 a night. Are you trying to tell me that this is not enough money to cover the cost of an overnight charge for an EV?
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They are not subsidising anything because other electric appliances are switched to make power available to charge the EV. On the contrary, EV users are subsidising others who are using their Alde heating, hot water fridge/ freezer, electric kettle etc. etc. on electric.
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Not at all! All the power I have used has been within the 16 amp allowed. I cannot use any more than anyone else because if I did the bollard would trip.
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That would not be practically feasible. Yes there are many EV charging points off site that let you plug in for free. My car dealer is an example of this. However, it means having to wait around for two and a half hours. So you would have to have time available to do that. Far better to charge from your caravan to save having to spend so much time away that could be used for other things, like catching up on sleep!
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If you think that, then perhaps you should be charged £3 a night for using your electric kettle or your electric heating etc.
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Yes, Moulesy has met me and so has Oneputt.
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It would not be sensible to introduce metering because the site fees cover the cost of the use of electricity up to 16 amps. Many people might perceive a further charge to be unacceptable and perhaps choose to stay elsewhere.
I met an elderly couple the other day who are members of the club but don't use club sites because they cannot afford the cost on their pension. They use CLs and are able to find places to stay for £5 per night.
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It is up to the individual to decide on their own needs, not for the individual to dictate others needs
Unfortunately the dictation is already there. As this new usage of electricity increases over the next few years with the enforced swing to electric vehicles (of whatever kind) the sheer amount of electricity required is also going to increase.
The way electricity supply is designed to work, both nationally, on site, and for that matter in your home, there is a limit to the amount that can be physically delivered - regardless of how it is generated and who is paying for it. This design is based on the premise that any given user will not draw the maximum possible all the time (with the exception of certain industrial users with continuously running plant).
The figure used in the design is that any given user will be running at maximum demand for one quarter of the time, which to make the sums simpler can be assumed to be the same as everyone using one quarter of the power all the time.
What we are discussing about the scenario on a caravan site is actually a great small scale model for what will happen nationally before long. It will not be possible to pass these extra thousands of kilowatt hours (let's not confuse further with the technical terms for these big units) through the existing national wiring even if they were made available. There is a safely factor for the rating of any cable, and that could be reduced although that alone will give only about a 10% increase in maximum capacity.
So what the outcome might be is a contentious issue. Some of us remember the Three Day Week when supplies of electricity had to be shared in a sort of equitable manner as the amount that could be generated was being restricted. Perhaps something similar will be required so that anyone can have their equivalent of the site 16 amps supply - but only for six hours of each day.
As this would be complicated to implement I suspect the alternative of substantially increasing the price per unit to the user will be used to force everyone to self ration their usage. The government (small "g") is not going to sit back and loose the revenue from fuel duty, and the VAT charged on that duty, so could just tax ALL electricity usage instead.
Keep watching the skies.
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Bring in metered electricity, this would be the fairest way pay for what you use.
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Good post, Nav. I think you’ve made the point, as have National Grid, that our electricity infrastructure will not be able to cope with massive EV use.
People want EVs yet object to the likes of Hinckley C. It doesn’t make sense.
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I need a pitch for my caravan 365 days a year because I only use my home address to collect my mail. So I have to pay a huge amount more in site fees than someone who just stays for one or two weeks per year. So I'm surely paying my fair share, especially as I cannot use more than 16 amps same as anyone else.
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My view is very similar to Navigateur's in that the government (small g!)
will have to charge for the additional volume of electricity being used in the future as EV's become more prevalent as there is no way they will not recover all the revenue from current fuel duty and the VAT.
This loss will have to be recovered or would you all like the thought of a major hike in other taxes to recoup the lost revenue?
In essence, it WILL have to be paid for in some shape or form!
Eye's to the skies!!!
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I think you are kidding yourself if you believe that you will not be using more electricity Malc. At this time of year 1kw will keep our caravan warm overnight and will be off more than it is on as opposed to 2 kw full time for maybe 4 hours. Cost to all others on site? Probably less than 2p. Nothing to beat anybody up over.
In the Summer very little night time power consumption for heating with most caravans. Effect of a couple of vehicles charging on most CC sites not significant for other users in my view. Over time with more hybrids and some EV toads that may well change.
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This might make interesting reading, if not already posted.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jul/26/treasury-tax-electric-cars-vat-fuel-duty
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That's nonsense. EVs are not running on stolen electricity because the electricity used within the 16 amp outlet is included and paid for in the site fees.
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Who are you kidding now fella? In winter I believe that you have a seasonal CC pitch. Was it Steve who calculated that to run out at £5 a night for an (almost) full time usage, within the rules? You should have no trouble burning that off each day Malcolm smile
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If the club did charge extra for EVs, many EV owners will feel that they are being discriminated against, so the club would need to consider the loss of business from customers owning EVs who feel unhappy about the extra charge.
Members of the club have other options available. They could choose to stay on a CL with no EHU at £5 a night and use a power generator, for example. They may choose to do this if the price their being charged is higher than others who plug in for toher purposes.
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The Club WILL charge for the electricity in the future, it won't have a choice!
If I was you I'd just enjoy the use you will have at the price you pay now cos it ain't going to last. My guess would also be that the "free" charge you can get at the stealers will not be "free" for that much longer either.
Better get yourself a genny and move onto a £5 site while the going is good and save some money!
(generators need fuel too, but you would have taken that into account
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