Electricity meters
Comments
-
I like the cut of your jib sir! (ie +1)
0 -
The figure I gave was for the cruise part, on climb and especially on the approach the fuel used could be be doubled (to overcome all the extra drag of flaps and wheels). You don't 'freewheel' when landing you actually use a lot of fuel.
so a 737 will use 10 times the amount of fuel per passenger on the cruise part than a car (22 litres per hour per passenger v 2) but travels about 10 times faster. It evens out.
0 -
Of course the club could install all these meters and charge more for the electric to recoup the costs
They can't, its illegal to resell electricity at more than cost. The cost of the infrastructure is not part of the cost of the electricity.
0 -
good point, a pilot has to know the weight of the aircraft as that determines the take off speeds (V1, Vr, V2) so while the aircraft is fuelled in litres that is converted into weigh to make the calculations easier.
Side point google Gimli glider, when B767 ran out of fuel in flight and had to glide from 41000 feet as the crew and ground crew had put in the weight of the fuel calculated in pounds instead of kilograms. No one was hurt.
0 -
I think there’s a more sinister reason for the drive to smart meters. These meters are very smart and can differentiate between the type of appliance being used, (cooking, heating, washing machine, T.V. etc.).
I don’t think it will be too long before the cost for the electricity of say, using a washing machine will be cheaper through the night than through the day. This will all be in an effort to reduce peak demand where the country’s current supply infrastructure is struggling. Oh and by the way the supply company can switch off your supply remotely via a smart meter.
You have been warned.
1 -
You wont need to, thats Ofgems duty. (but i doubt they will get round to it).
0 -
I don’t think it will be too long before the cost for the electricity of say, using a washing machine will be cheaper through the night than through the day.
Err...........like the Economy 7 we've had for over 30 years then....?
0 -
Not really, could economy 7 charge you one rate for using a washing machine, (that could be considered essential), and a different rate for using a tumble drier, (that isn't considered essential), at the same time of day? Smart meters have this capability,
0 -
Well I agree that choice is a good thing, BB, such as the choice to use a club site/CL/commerial site and accept their booking conditions and individual arrangements when I do.
BTW, talking of booking coditions, I notice that Crealy offers the option of saying "no" to electricity and saving £5 a night. Pretty good at this time of year, but maybe you overlooked that when you booked?!!
3 -
The purpose of charging differing rates throughout the 24 hour period is to penalise people at times of high demand to encourage them to move that demand to times of low demand, as you say, to reduce the capacity required on the electricity supply network.
Tariffs available have reflected that since long before electricity privatisation. Domestic tariffs are obviously quite crude with historically only normally a day/night rate but commercial tariffs have always had numerous rates for times of day, days of week etc.
Whilst I think there are tariffs to encourage/discourage very heavy industry to use or not use very capacitive or inductive loads (and install pf correction etc) I cannot see that percolating down to the domestic market, where the typical consumer will not see or understand any difference between different appliances...
As for "essential" who is going to decide that, and why.....
0 -
Indeed you are correct re industrial tariffs, and some very heavy users are incentivised to provide load shedding when the grid almost reaches capacity. Smart meters are a method of introducing this to domestic users via incentives or penalties.
I think you are wrong to say…. typical consumer will not see or understand any difference between different appliances…. I’m sure they will know the difference between a washing machine or a tumble drier or a fridge!
An analogy could be made of waste disposal. A few ago all household waste went in one waste bin for disposal, now through a programme of education most household have around four separate bins for different kinds of waste that the householder sorts out. Just equate different tariffs to different kinds of waste.
0 -
I think the government and the Electricity Supply Industry has more than enough on it's plate at the moment than to begin trying to preach to customers that it's ok to wash the kids school uniforms ready for school the next day but you can't tumble dry them "because that's not essential" or will it depend on how big your back garden is "you could fit a clothes line in there madam" or "yep, you live in a flat, you can have a tumble drier". Or perhaps it will depend on the weather forecast...?
Trying to tell householders what appliances they are allowed to use is a battle I don't see anyone wanting to fight - ever.
Best to use the old economic model of pricing for that I suspect.....
1 -
Best to use the old economic model of pricing for that I suspect.....
Thats exactly what can be done via a smart meter, the drawback at the moment is that not everyone has a smart meter but when that goal is achieved...........
0 -
To get back on topic, i wonder how a smart meter could be used to incentivise / penalise when connected to a caravan or motor home.
Heaters and awnings come to mind.
0 -
Thats exactly what can be done via a smart meter, the drawback at the moment is that not everyone has a smart meter but when that goal is achieved...........
Now I agree with you there......!!
0 -
Done some more homework DD and quote:
Using the averaged data, two people in a car emit roughly the same amount of carbon as they would by flying. If you have three people, driving is about 15 percent more efficient. A family of four in a car cuts their carbon footprint in half over air travel.
https://thinkprogress.org/no-flying-is-not-greener-than-driving-7de8d53959ab/
According to the paper, if we focus just on the impact over the next five years, then planes currently account for more global warming than all the cars on the world's roads – a stark reversal of the usual comparison. Per passenger mile, things are even more marked: flying turns out to be on average 50 times worse than driving in terms of a five-year warming impact
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/blog/2010/sep/09/carbon-emissions-planes-shipping
The simple answer is that driving in a relatively fuel-efficient car (25-30 miles per gallon) usually generates fewer greenhouse-gas emissions than flying. In assessing the global warming impact of a trip from Philadelphia to Boston (about 300 miles), the environmental news website Grist.org calculates that driving would generate about 104 kilograms of carbon dioxide (CO2)—a leading greenhouse gas—per typical medium-sized car, regardless of the number of passengers, while flying on a commercial jet would produce some 184 kilograms of CO2 per passenger.
https://www.thoughtco.com/flying-driving-which-better-for-environment-1203936
There you go
2 -
To get back on topic, i wonder how a smart meter could be used to incentivise / penalise when connected to a caravan or motor home
How about with this British Gas Electricity Tariff.....??
"About your tariff
HomeEnergy FreeTime (Sun) July 2017 prices are fixed until 31st July 2017. You’ll pay a daily standing charge and
unit rate for each fuel. The unit rate for your electricity will be zero between 9am–5pm on Sunday. During that
period you will still pay your electricity standing charge as well as the standing charge and unit rate for your gas.
You can see the prices on our website: britishgas.co.uk/tariffrates"Should make weekends on CC sites even more popular......
1 -
Every type appliance has its own electrical “signature” so in simple terms for example a washing machine can be detected by how it operates for example, firstly a small motor (the pump) will run for a short time, then a valve will open to allow water in, then a larger motor (in modern machines this will be invertor driven), will operate and at the same time a heater will come on to heat the water, the motor will then operate to tumble the washing before the small pump motor empties the water and the drum goes into spin cycle. All these components can be detected by the meter by spikes, different harmonics etc. they put back on to the supply.
There are several groups throughout Europe (and no doubt other countries) that are currently mapping these signatures. I work with someone who is currently part of a group looking at a couple of different domestic appliances. They get dozens of different makes and models and map the signature to come up with a common signature for that type of appliance.
Some domestic energy providers, I think OVO is one, already break your electricity bill down into cooking, entertainment (T.V.s games consoles, etc.), cleaning/ironing washing etc.
0 -
Correct ET
0 -
I know exactly what you mean........
We have our dishwasher, washing machine, tumble drier and immersion heater all on timeswitches to use them overnight.....
Also everyone in the house has to have breakfast before 8.30am in the summer and 7.30am in the winter......(the night rate times of Economy 7)
I'm not very popular in our house but as I pay the bill, hey ho.......
When we get a smart meter I will be looking for an App so I can disable various household appliances when we are away in the van and we've left the kids in charge.....
Until then I will just have to keep taking the fuses out.....
0 -
So mile for mile, flying is less polluting.
For a short trip, most likely that would be by car, but flying is much easier for those long haul destinations like New York, where getting there by car is rather difficult.
Are people not going to more long haul destinations these days, so travelling more miles and causing more pollution than nipping off to a nearby campsite or hotel for a long weekend?
So many things to consider.
0
