Mirror Extensions?
Comments
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Perhaps someone could explain what happens when the view required by "the law" is impossible too obtain for instance when the car and caravan are turning right and the n/s mirror is basically rendered useless and ofcourse on a left turn the same happens to the o/s mirror ?
peter.
The field of view requirements only apply when car and caravan are in a straight line. "The law" makes no mention of any requirements when turning.
Like Boff says, look in your mirrors before turning.
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Perhaps someone could explain what happens when the view required by "the law" is impossible too obtain for instance when the car and caravan are turning right and the n/s mirror is basically rendered useless and ofcourse on a left turn the same happens
to the o/s mirror ?peter.
The field of view requirements only apply when car and caravan are in a straight line. "The law" makes no mention of any requirements when turning.
Like Boff says, look in your mirrors before turning.
So "the law" is only effective in straight lines.I just find that a bit of a nonsense to be honest.
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So "the law" is only effective in straight lines.I just find that a bit of a nonsense to be honest.
For a start, unless you are on a particularly winding road, driving in a straight line is about the most common situation. Secondly, the same difficultly in seeing what is directly behind you in at least one of the two mirrors exists when making a turn even when not towing and thirdly to set any sensible field of view requirements when turning would require the mirror glass to rotate with the steering wheel angle and ridiculously wide mirror arms, too, even for a non-tower, so that's totally impractical. The only solution in that case would be to require a camera at the back of the vehicle which would probably also need to turn with the front wheels. I've never heard of a call for that, though.
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I totally agree.But you only have too look at the diagram on page one of the thread and its obvious that the "required field of vision" according to "the law" is just impossible too maintain unless you are in a dead straight line.I also find that in a right
hand turn the most vulnerable part of the van is the rear n/s corner that is moveing outwards and is totally impossible too see
peter.
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I thought the diagram on page one represented mirrors for overtaking and ensuring the observance of traffic around and as far as practically possible, behind you. Obviously overtaking is usually done on a straight(ish) road where these mirrors and that diagram comes into play.
As for manouvering or tight corners you just as well rely on your passenger, your own mirrors, skill or luck as the extension mirrors or the diagram has no use, and is not meant for an aid in this.
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Thanks for that but how can someone be prosecuted if there is no specific legislation and therefore surely no offence to commit.
Vulcan, it would be under section 33 of the Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986 as amended. To work out what mirrors you need under the regulations look at the chart at the bottom of the first link I include. Go to the first column and
identify which is your vehicle (date of first use etc). Go across to column 2 which tells you what mirrors are to be fitted. Then go to column 3 which will give you the requirements of those mirrors. If you don't comply with any of these then that's the offence.
Basically if the mirrors fitted to the vehicle by the manufacture don't meet the requirement for example because you are towing you then need mirrors which do comply. We call them towing mirrors the law calls them quite simply mirrors.Having towed for over forty years always with extra mirrors I would not advocate anyone towing a van without extra mirrors no matter how wide their tow vehicle is. The point I am making is not regarding the construction of the mirrors,it is the fact that
it appears to be down to the opinion of a roadside official wether or not you can see behind you, backed up by a diagram that has no official backing as far as i can see.Sorry about the delay in responding.
With regards to 'adequate' it is opinion based on the regulations mentioned. The decision as to 'adequate' would normally be make by a police officer who is an authorised vehicles examiner or a government vehicle inspector. Both of these are likely to be
classed as an 'expert witness' by a court. Being an 'expert witness' they will be able to give evidence of both fact and opinion. To counter this the defence would probably have to employ another 'expert witness'.It is not only a fixed penalty notice or a summons there is another consequence based on the opinion of the official. If unfortunately stopped by a police authorised vehicle examiner or DVSA government vehicle inspector (previously
VOSA) and the mirrors did not comply with the legislation they can issue a prohibition notice. There are different types of notice such as a delayed notice where the vehicle must be fixed within a certain time or an immediate prohibition notice preventing
the vehicle from being driven until fixed. The DVSA guidance for mirrors is for an immediate prohibition notice to be issued if 'the view to the rear is inadequate'. This would mean:If 'towing mirrors' are available the vehicle, fitting them, or
If no 'towing mirrors' available unhitching and going to get some.Once the vehicle complies with the legislation the problems are not over. The driver/owner then needs to arrange for the prohibition notice to be removed. To do this an examiner would have to say that it is 'fit for service' and issue a form PG10.
Do the police have road checks with the DVSA? Just search the Internet and there are many examples.
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Fair comment, but it is fairly easy, even for the unitiated, to be able to check whether towing mirrors are necessary or not. Just park car and caravan in a straight line, stand behind the caravan and look exactly down the side from a position where its
front corner is exactly behind the corresponding rear corner and assuming a flat side panel you should be able to see the whole of the car's exterior rear view mirror. If you can't, you need towing mirrors. It's as simple as that.0
