Pricing
Comments
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Ian - as you've so rightly pointed out many times before, the club will only start listening and acting if folk stop using their sites which, increasingly we're doing. How about you?
..Increasingly some are doing? but the ocupancy figures seem to show figures going up every year
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Seems there are several ostriches posting on here.
Anyone who cannot see that continually increasing prices above the competition with no improvement in the offering, must have little or no business experience and refuse to see anything wrong in their favourite company.
Even the stalwart M&S customers have started to see reality eventually......
Ostrich? Can't be me 'cos what I see is improvements, vision for the club ethos and very competative price increases to that seen across the industry in general! Mind you that's just my experience and my opinion!
Yes, I'm sure that is what you see, Micky
But I clearly state when points of view are my opinion, my assumption, my belief. Others just suggest that their personal thoughts are hard facts!
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Do the club produce figures for each individual site to show which ones are profitable and which are not?
..Not for public/members consuption but all sites have their individual profit/loss,sheets ,I have seen several, and they are an eye opener
JV, are you not a member of the public/member?, if you are then the sheets are obviously open to all
...you wish,,I did not "see" them
JV, you said you'd seen them, come on tell Uncle Rocky. . . .Were you fibbing?
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Do the club produce figures for each individual site to show which ones are profitable and which are not?
..Not for public/members consuption but all sites have their individual profit/loss,sheets ,I have seen several, and they are an eye opener
JV, are you not a member of the public/member?, if you are then the sheets are obviously open to all
...you wish,,I did not "see" them
JV, you said you'd seen them, come on tell Uncle Rocky. . . .Were you fibbing?
...No, but was I supposed to "see" them
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Apparently no if you're a member/public. This is very intriguing, did Q supply a 'pen phone' for you, do you have copies to sell to competitors?
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It'll be those warden friends of JV's but don't tell.
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Seems there are several ostriches posting on here
continually increasing prices above the competition
once again rather than insult your fellow posters post some figures to show this. I can and have in the past shown that for every club site there are sites cheaper and sites more expensive within the same area. The club is really middle of the road. Most
of the full sites in peak and even by your own admission half full sites in November seem to indicate that people has happy to pay. You included!0 -
Seems there are several ostriches posting on here
continually increasing prices above the competition
once again rather than insult your fellow posters post some figures to show this. I can and have in the past shown that for every club site there are sites cheaper and sites more expensive within the same area. The club is really middle of the road. Most
of the full sites in peak and even by your own admission half full sites in November seem to indicate that people has happy to pay. You included!Write your comments here...+1
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CS, I dont think that Ian was intending to Insult anyone. Although I do also understand where you are coming from, and perhaps it could have been phrased better.
However as a very long term member of this club I am just as keen as you to see the club continue to not only survive, but to thrive as well, for all the new members that will follow on from us.
So I do see a danger in believing that "members are happy to pay". The too frequent use of that phrase can have the effect of removing from the clubs management any real desire to keep costs down and not to increase charges to members.
Obviously like many others i always resist paying any more than I have to, but in this case I have a more important reason and it is this!
I think that the Caravan leisure tourist industry is undergoing a quiet revolution. At one time there were really only the big two, the CC and the C&CC in the business, but today in recent times there are more and more alternatives. At the start they were generally quite poor in comparison with us. But in recent years they appear to have improved their act. They are in the main now very smart and do offer clean & modern facilities. But they have kept their prices down too and in many cases are now cheaper than us, so we need to be careful if we are not to suffer.
Please accept that I hold those views out of a real desire for this club to continue long into the future!
It is all too easy it seems to upset other members of this community, so again I will stress that what I have just said is a personal opinion and is not intended to criticise anyone else or to enforce my opinion on others!
TF
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CS, I dont think that Ian was intending to Insult anyone. Although I do also understand where you are coming from, and perhaps it could have been phrased better.
However as a very long term member of this club I am just as keen as you to see the club continue to not only survive, but to thrive as well, for all the new members that will follow on from us.
So I do see a danger in believing that "members are happy to pay". The too frequent use of that phrase can have the effect of removing from the clubs management any real desire to keep costs down and not to increase charges to members.
Obviously like many others i always resist paying any more than I have to, but in this case I have a more important reason and it is this!
I think that the Caravan leisure tourist industry is undergoing a quiet revolution. At one time there were really only the big two, the CC and the C&CC in the business, but today in recent times there are more and more alternatives. At the start they were
generally quite poor in comparison with us. But in recent years they appear to have improved their act. They are in the main now very smart and do offer clean & modern facilities. But they have kept their prices down too and in many cases are now cheaper than
us, so we need to be careful if we are not to suffer.Please accept that I hold those views out of a real desire for this club to continue long into the future!
It is all too easy it seems to upset other members of this community, so again I will stress that what I have just said is a personal opinion and is not intended to criticise anyone else or to enforce my opinion on others!
TF
TF - a good well thought out post.You make some good points.
I think that to label posters on here as several ostriches and therefore imply that some blindly turn up to club sites without noting the price or rather what that price actually gets you, or take whatever increase (and rememebr
Ian has only quoted a few sites) the club trows at us without considering if the price increase is worth it is actually quite insulting.However I believe by the eividence of full sites in peak and half full sites now, in additon to that is there are far more expensive sites than club site,s that the club is getting it right.
And surly people are happy to pay for club sites? Are there really people who go to a club site and say to themselves
well I'm not happy about these prices. The prices are known in advance aren't they. I have never grumbled about paying for any leisure activity or holiday, just thank my lucky stars I can.0 -
I am afraid I just don't see the logic in drastically lowering winter prices to try and fill sites mid week. It is not as though the CC needs to keep them open because there are other enterprises on site, that incur costs in any event. To totally fill other
than the popular sites mid week in the main winter months, you would probably have to half the prices. However, your consumables would inrease dramatically. For instance 25 vans at £16 consuming £5 of electric nets £275. Where as 75 vans at £8 brings in only
£225. I just don't think you are going to convince those sort of numbers to go away in winter, even at £8. Personally I think winter prices are already very good, Clumber for instance is currently £15.95 for two adults.0 -
I think TF is right and the odd time I have used an UK commercial site
I found standards very acceptable at a similar price. The Caravan Club has a devoted and loyal following that is well represented on this forum and for quite a few it can do no wrong or charge too much. Judging by the very nice and expensive outfits
commonly found on club sites (nothing wrong with this I have them myself) cost is a secondary to maintaining the status quo but upcoming generations are not going to be in our fortunate position and I don't think it can carry on indefinitely
charging a premium price for a minimal productAs you posted 'standards very acceptable at a similar price'
Sorry cannot reconcile that with the statement 'charging a premium price for a minimal product'. Some private sites do I suppose provide more. However for those that provide a good site shop like a mini mart, or restaurant/cafe/bar
it is also an income stream. It is a facility that I certainly do not want and so for me less is probably more. Those commercial sites that make such a provision are available for those that want them.0 -
"And surly people are happy to pay for club sites?"
....and some of the better natured ones, no doubt?
im sure you didnt mean to come across as insulting with this post, Corners
Oh, BTW, good morning from a lovely bright, clear, sunny Broadway
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the way i see it ,is that the CC is selling a product (pitch), and they set their price . when i look to book a pitch i decide where i want to go and look at what sites suit me best ,i dont choose the cheapest or the dearest ,but the one that suits my needs
at that time . that is what i do with most products i buy , if you dont like the price there is often an allternative..0 -
the way i see it ,is that the CC is selling a product (pitch), and they set their price . when i look to book a pitch i decide where i want to go and look at what sites suit me best ,i dont choose the cheapest or the dearest ,but the one that suits my needs
at that time . that is what i do with most products i buy , if you dont like the price there is often an allternative..Spot on HD!.
Purely out of interest, has anyone looked at the supposedly superior commercial outfit's prices for next year to check what their increases are going to be? I suspect (but may well be wrong) that, ignoring special offers, they won't be far away from the
CC inceases being quoted.0 -
I am afraid I just don't see the logic in drastically lowering winter prices to try and fill sites mid week. It is not as though the CC needs to keep them open because there are other enterprises on site, that incur costs in any event. To totally fill other
than the popular sites mid week in the main winter months, you would probably have to half the prices. However, your consumables would inrease dramatically. For instance 25 vans at £16 consuming £5 of electric nets £275. Where as 75 vans at £8 brings in only
£225. I just don't think you are going to convince those sort of numbers to go away in winter, even at £8. Personally I think winter prices are already very good, Clumber for instance is currently £15.95 for two adults.whereas 50 vans at £12 (using your figures) nets £350.
or......Why not make the sites £12 and meter the electric....sites full and nets £600 for 12 vans.....or even £500 at a tenner?
customer might pay anything between £10 (10+0) and £17 (12+5).....far more 'competitive'....and (after the meters are in) all 'costs' chargable back to the customer based on usage..
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"And surly people are happy to pay for club sites?"
....and some of the better natured ones, no doubt?
im sure you didnt mean to come across as insulting with this post, Corners
Oh, BTW, good morning from a lovely bright, clear, sunny Broadway
Haha, well spotted BB. opps
And good morning to you from an almost bright Middlesborough. Yes I know not quite the same panache as Broadway, but the transporter bridge looked lovely at Sunrise.
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the way i see it ,is that the CC is selling a product (pitch), and they set their price . when i look to book a pitch i decide where i want to go and look at what sites suit me best ,i dont choose the cheapest or the dearest ,but the one that suits my needs
at that time . that is what i do with most products i buy , if you dont like the price there is often an allternative..thats certainly true Husky.....
however, every year (and more often probably) we have loads of customers (sometimes i think the club forgets that is what we are...) raising concerns about the way 'their club' is going on pricing.
they 'want' to stay with their club, its what they know, and probably like, but the constant stretching of peak periods and increases are making it very hard for some (from the young family to the fixed income retiree) to stay as loyal as they would like.
the main gripe is that the club is not very imaginative in its pricing, same old peak stretching and increases every year...
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"I don't think it can carry on indefinitely charging a premium price for a minimal product"
I find it difficult to understand that comment. Can anyone give a specific example to back it up? (I take premium price to mean significantly more per night than any site in a nearby area.)0 -
I am afraid I just don't see the logic in drastically lowering winter prices to try and fill sites mid week. It is not as though the CC needs to keep them open because there are other enterprises on site, that incur costs in any event. To totally fill other
than the popular sites mid week in the main winter months, you would probably have to half the prices. However, your consumables would inrease dramatically. For instance 25 vans at £16 consuming £5 of electric nets £275. Where as 75 vans at £8 brings in only
£225. I just don't think you are going to convince those sort of numbers to go away in winter, even at £8. Personally I think winter prices are already very good, Clumber for instance is currently £15.95 for two adults.whereas 50 vans at £12 (using your figures) nets £350.
or......Why not make the sites £12 and meter the electric....sites full and nets £600 for 12 vans.....or even £500 at a tenner?
customer might pay anything between £10 (10+0) and £17 (12+5).....far more 'competitive'....and (after the meters are in) all 'costs' chargable back to the customer based on usage..
but would potential customers looking at a site be put off by metered electricity? Would they do the sums?
Also you would have to install meters which surely would have a cost involved to be recovered/paid for from where? Then paying for the electricity at the end of your stay, all the probelms that have been discussed before on bringing in meters
to club sites.Out of interest how many non club sites actually have meters (in the Uk please non some far flung corner of the empire)
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"I don't think it can carry on indefinitely charging a premium price for a minimal product"
I find it difficult to understand that comment. Can anyone give a specific example to back it up? (I take premium price to mean significantly more per night than any site in a nearby area.)people post these things M but never back it up till real facts
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THe bottom line is :- Everybody is there own arbiter when it comes to deciding good value for money. If a person thinks they are getting good value for money when buying a product they buy it. If they can find the same or similar product elsewhere at a more reasonable price they buy it there. -- It's not rocket science.
We are well into the 21st century and nowadays there is little retailer loyalty. Customers shop around. Woe betide any retailer who is seen to be increasing the price of their product beyond what reasonable people would consider " good value for money ".. They drive their customers away !!!
Cheers ..............K
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no idea....i was just trying to be 'imaginative' and make the figures Steve gave go a bit further for both the club and its customers....
sometimes, businesses have to think outside the box a bit, rather than the same old....
as mentioned earlier, we are a lucky generation and dont baulk too much at prices, we can also choose to vote with our wheels if we like...
the club is looking to attract new younger blood and some of these families might not be able to be so carefree about prices as perhaps we (you and i) are...
i dont have a particular gripe myself but i am aware that rising costs will be a key factor in our hobby continuing for generations to come.....or not...
we could just do my other option...
"whereas 50 vans at £12 (using your figures) nets £350."
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That's very true, K, which makes me wonder why so many folk choose to continue using CC sites regularly despite complaining bitterly about the price increases. Just doesn't make sense to me. Find anther site or a nice CL nearby which will charge less if
you feel that way.BTW, how's the search for your new MH going? I don't think we're likely to change in the near future, but Mrs M does keep looking at them when we're on site!
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no idea....i was just trying to be 'imaginative' and make the figures Steve gave go a bit further for both the club and its customers....
sometimes, businesses have to think outside the box a bit, rather than the same old....
as mentioned earlier, we are a lucky generation and dont baulk too much at prices, we can also choose to vote with our wheels if we like...
the club is looking to attract new younger blood and some of these families might not be able to be so carefree about prices as perhaps we (you and i) are...
i dont have a particular gripe myself but i am aware that rising costs will be a key factor in our hobby continuing for generations to come.....or not...
we could just do my other option...
"whereas 50 vans at £12 (using your figures) nets £350."
but would another 25 members have been attracted to the site for a £4 cost saving....??
All I can say is that would not influence my decision to go away....
However BB you have brightened my morning, hammering away at your keyboard the same message that club sites are overpriced, whilst....err....on a club site.....
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Sureley the costs of a pitch are minimal compared to buying and owning a caravan or MH taking into consideration of insurance, fuel, tax etc. Then the heavier vans/MH requiring upgrades in licences. The actual cost of staying on site even in peak season is small compared to say a package to spain for 2 adults and 2 kids. I do not see the CC as expensive or indeed premium, it offers a standard of facilities the same accross its network that in general can be relied upon. It is easy to be imaginative with pricing if you own 1 comercial site but if you own 200 then you have to factor in local conditions/costs/competition into each one so would be come more of a nightmare.. The good thing about the CC site is generally the price is similar at all sites dependant on level of facilities so anyone booking sort of knows the cost before looking.
I jsut ahd a look at Damage Barton V North Morte Farm where we stayed earlier this eyar. The prices are comparable within a pound in peak season.
I would prefer to pay a set fee for a pitch and 2 people to include hook up then extra for each individual adult, child and dog jsut like the continent and most commercial sites do. Not sure about an awning fee but there is certainly a case for it.
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I am afraid I just don't see the logic in drastically lowering winter prices to try and fill sites mid week. It is not as though the CC needs to keep them open because there are other enterprises on site, that incur costs in any event. To totally fill other
than the popular sites mid week in the main winter months, you would probably have to half the prices. However, your consumables would inrease dramatically. For instance 25 vans at £16 consuming £5 of electric nets £275. Where as 75 vans at £8 brings in only
£225. I just don't think you are going to convince those sort of numbers to go away in winter, even at £8. Personally I think winter prices are already very good, Clumber for instance is currently £15.95 for two adults.whereas 50 vans at £12 (using your figures) nets £350.
or......Why not make the sites £12 and meter the electric....sites full and nets £600 for 12 vans.....or even £500 at a tenner?
customer might pay anything between £10 (10+0) and £17 (12+5).....far more 'competitive'....and (after the meters are in) all 'costs' chargable back to the customer based on usage..
The problem is BB you increase the price to £12 and you probably don't get 50 vans. Yes metred on new sites, but on existing just extra expenditure, and most who have not gone down the route you have, don't want it. So you could well drive folk away as
they have not got a refillable system and solar panels, and could therefore not take advantage of the cheap pitch. However, the main problem is that most of those who can go away mid week are retired and prefer the warmer times of the year, when they go on
long tours. We ourselves do a couple of weeks in winter and I think this is more the norm. There just aren't the numbers to fill the sites, whatever the price.0
