Pitching Instruction
Comments
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BB, I think you know as well as I do that safety issues(regardless of import) become less & less critical as the price to implement them gets higher & higher-sad but true I'm afraid
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It is that very equation that will always blow a hole in arguments re 'safety rules'0 -
On a caravan site you cannot have all separate 'units', be it car, caravan, pup tent, boat, awning, all 3m from each other. Not all have a self contained motor home as much as you would like that! Pitch sizes are what they are and you fit your units on them within the rules.
No one wants a fire, but the risk is small enough to have two cars on one pitch, or even, as it is now, having your car a few feet away from your caravan (what madness!). However if you feel that clubs sites are so dangerous in this respect please find sites that do as you suggest.
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The wardens go through the safety mantra of asking new arrivals to pitch to the peg, it doesn't matter how many years or not you have had a van you are reminded each time. You can't say "no-one told me" and the wardens have done their duty in telling you.
If the wardens feel you are incorrectly parked they can act but it's on their discretion. If you feel something is unsafe you can also discuss it with the wardens when you are there.0 -
If somebody does pitch significantly differently we will point out that they have done so but will only ask them to move if as a result they are contravening the fire spacing regulations or causing inconvenience to another member. Please do not assume they
remain there because the warden has failed to do his job!Barking50 to challenge your post with the last two parts above
Every pitch with a blue or white peg must surely have been carefully measured to assess the risk and the decision made for safe distance. So anyone contavening the peg position must be placing themselves and the van on the next pitch at risk.
The last sentence backs up the fact that the warden hasn't done his job hence they assume they are ok
That is not so Harry.
Every pitch has a peg. The peg is placed in such a way as to facillitate people who want to reverse on as well as people who wish to go o0n forwards. That is to say a car on one side and an awning on the other.
However, every pitch is not in the same position, some have fingers larger than three meters separating them and some do not. It is possible on some pitches to park incorrectly and still maintain the safety distances.
We take a common sense and practical approach only insisting those causing a problem move but ensuring that those pitched incorrectly but not causing a problem are aware of the infringement and that at other times/places they could be put to the inconvenience
of being asked to move.To insist that people move just so they are 'on the peg' would lead to the accusation of being a 'jobsworth', something many on this forum already accuse wardens of, second only to being accused of not doing our jobs.
Rest assured Harry, if you are ever on a site on which I am warden you will, if causing a problem, be asked to move.
Regards
Barking
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excellent post Barking - straight from the horses' mouth
Thanks
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But having naked flames in a caravan/motorhome is surely going going to make the risk more likely than in your car despite.
....i dont know what the percentages are for fires in caravans on site or for cars on site....both fairly rare thank goodness...
however, when mitigating against risk, you don't put all your eggs in one basket....
if there is still a slight risk of fire starting in a car, then this should be mitigated against by keeping them away (3m) from ALL other flammable units, not just those belonging to someone else....
perhaps all the cars should be kept well away from habitation units.....ie in the car park...that would make our pitches feel far more open....and much safer....
What a very large carpark we would need as by your analogy you would need 3m distance between cars!!! Dont think that would work would it. What about disabled people, can they park next to their caravan? If so are they less likely to have a fire.
What we have works most of the time if members conform to the rules, when they dont surly as has been said the wardens should then act accordingly.
why do people try and put a wedge between motorhomers and caravan ers, we are all doing the same with different bits of kit arnt we. Stereotype this and that is all bull and not helpful to any debate is it.
i really dont care what people drive of camp in, if they are polite and considerate im happy if not then we may have words, pritty fair to me.
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I don't have a problem with the warden reminding me of pitching requirements when I book in. Neither do I have a problem with complying with the request. If someone who has been put in charge of a site by the operating company requests that I comply with
the overall guidelines then why should I complain?I don't care whether anyone else on the site is exactly on the peg or metres away from it unless they are my immediate neighbour. On one very popular and rather cramped site we had to take the one remaining pitch and the neighbours had spread into the space
we were meant to park in. They were asked to move. If they hadn't had an awning up I suspect things would have been fine as they were0 -
We've just returned from a two week stay in Cornwall. Visitors are not instructed to line up with a peg, but to occupy the space between two markers and to be considerate to neighbours.
All was fine the first week as everyone in the row was piotched with the offside 18" to 2' inside the marker - allowing space to service the van.
We came back from a day out and new arrivals had pitched up with the offside of the van on extremity of their pitch.
The meant that their aquarolls and wastemaster were in our amenity space, which they also had to use to service their toilet.
They had erected their awning by the time we returned so I did not ask them to move over, but it was annoying.
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All pitches to have a perimeter of fireblankets of a suitable height installed. Reduces fire risk, provides privacy for those who don't like left-handed vans/nose-inners, contain slavering hounds, stops your BBQ blowing smoke over the neighbours etc. What's
not to like?
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If somebody does pitch significantly differently we will point out that they have done so but will only ask them to move if as a result they are contravening the fire spacing regulations or causing inconvenience to another member. Please do not assume they
remain there because the warden has failed to do his job!Barking50 to challenge your post with the last two parts above
Every pitch with a blue or white peg must surely have been carefully measured to assess the risk and the decision made for safe distance. So anyone contavening the peg position must be placing themselves and the van on the next pitch at risk.
The last sentence backs up the fact that the warden hasn't done his job hence they assume they are ok
That is not so Harry.
Every pitch has a peg. The peg is placed in such a way as to facillitate people who want to reverse on as well as people who wish to go o0n forwards. That is to say a car on one side and an awning on the other.
However, every pitch is not in the same position, some have fingers larger than three meters separating them and some do not. It is possible on some pitches to park incorrectly and still maintain the safety distances.
We take a common sense and practical approach only insisting those causing a problem move but ensuring that those pitched incorrectly but not causing a problem are aware of the infringement and that at other times/places they could be put to the inconvenience
of being asked to move.To insist that people move just so they are 'on the peg' would lead to the accusation of being a 'jobsworth', something many on this forum already accuse wardens of, second only to being accused of not doing our jobs.
Rest assured Harry, if you are ever on a site on which I am warden you will, if causing a problem, be asked to move.
Regards
Barking
Barking 50
Thank you for your reply
Firstly, rest assured no warden would ever have to speak to me about site rules and no warden can be a "jobsworth" for carrying out the rules. I may disagree with them but demean, never.
Can I ask you re your reply. Is this a personal view from you in the way you carry out your duties or is it instructions given by HQ.
If the former, the problem that I can see here is that a member pitches wrongly on your site will only do so again elsewhere if he is not told otherwise. However, if this is a general order from HQ then only those on here reading this post will no
there is some leeway because of your reply.In the situation I described in my OP the row of pitches was blue white blue white across six pitches. The member in question by pitching completely to the right was then encroaching within the safe distance of the blue pitch and this is the point
I am trying to make. He should, under the circumstances I've described, have been asked to correct it. He obviously wasn't so now thinks it's ok to do it again on the next site.In teaching circles there is a saying, "I hear, I forget, I see, I remember, I do, I understand.
With rules they will no doubt understand if they are made to do it.
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We've just returned from a two week stay in Cornwall. Visitors are not instructed to line up with a peg, but to occupy the space between two markers and to be considerate to neighbours.
All was fine the first week as everyone in the row was piotched with the offside 18" to 2' inside the marker - allowing space to service the van.
We came back from a day out and new arrivals had pitched up with the offside of the van on extremity of their pitch.
The meant that their aquarolls and wastemaster were in our amenity space, which they also had to use to service their toilet.
They had erected their awning by the time we returned so I did not ask them to move over, but it was annoying.
That just proves my point. If people don't do as instructed and are allowed to get away with it then you get situations like yours.
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Harry, you did not read my post. I quite clearly stated that I would speak to those concerned, just not require them to move if there was no need so they would not be leaving the site unaware of the infringement.
With regards to leeway how many inches away from the peg do you suggest before people are required to move?
At the last 'warden conference' wardens were encouraged to try to show some flexibility in the appliance of rules in order to avoid being seen as too authoritarian, but not to the extent of allowing dangerous practice or impact on other campers.
I can not comment on your particular situation not having witnessed it or spoken to the warden concerned. Did you speak to the warden concerned and if so what was their reply? If not I would suggest you do this in future. If not happy with the explanation of the warden you would then be well placed to take the matter further, possibly on this forum but more properly with the relevant area manager.
Not wishing to be baited further I will desist from further response.
Regards
Barking
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B50, this is not a request for a reply just an opinion. I think the attitude of-flexibility is as good as it gets, the authoritarian/jobs worth label has been applied to your job(Warden) often on here, in the times I've met & interacted with Wardens I've generally met hard working & sensible people. It's an onerous task & the Expectation(from some) of running sites like a boot camp will never help. It's good to read posts from you & your colleagues. You are all supported far more than denigrated
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+ 1
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+1
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It's good to hear the explanation from the Warden why the CC on-site rules are not really being enforced. -- It's head office's fault apparently !!!.
That said, I support wholeheartedly wardens who do their job properly and insist that the on-site rules to which we all signed up when we joined the CC are complied with.
No-one will ever hear me denigrate wardens by calling them " jobsworths " They are people just like ourselves who have a job to do. It is up to everybody to comply with the CC site rules -- even those who think the rules don't apply to them.
K
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Harry, you did not read my post. I quite clearly stated that I would speak to those concerned, just not require them to move if there was no need so they would not be leaving the site unaware of the infringement.
With regards to leeway how many inches away from the peg do you suggest before people are required to move?
At the last 'warden conference' wardens were encouraged to try to show some flexibility in the appliance of rules in order to avoid being seen as too authoritarian, but not to the extent of allowing dangerous practice or impact on other campers.
I can not comment on your particular situation not having witnessed it or spoken to the warden concerned. Did you speak to the warden concerned and if so what was their reply? If not I would suggest you do this in future. If not happy with the explanation of the warden you would then be well placed to take the matter further, possibly on this forum but more properly with the relevant area manager.
Not wishing to be baited further I will desist from further response.
Regards
Barking
Excellent post, and the previous ones, says it all and as a result needs no further explanation or justification.
Thanks B50
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If we are talking pure fire risk surely a BBQ is massively higher risk than a car or caravan of creating a fire? The only fire we have seen on a site was a bbq setting the hedge on fire.
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If somebody does pitch significantly differently we will point out that they have done so but will only ask them to move if as a result they are contravening the fire spacing regulations or causing inconvenience to another member. Please do not assume they
remain there because the warden has failed to do his job!Barking50 to challenge your post with the last two parts above
Every pitch with a blue or white peg must surely have been carefully measured to assess the risk and the decision made for safe distance. So anyone contavening the peg position must be placing themselves and the van on the next pitch at risk.
The last sentence backs up the fact that the warden hasn't done his job hence they assume they are ok
That is not so Harry.
Every pitch has a peg. The peg is placed in such a way as to facillitate people who want to reverse on as well as people who wish to go o0n forwards. That is to say a car on one side and an awning on the other.
However, every pitch is not in the same position, some have fingers larger than three meters separating them and some do not. It is possible on some pitches to park incorrectly and still maintain the safety distances.
We take a common sense and practical approach only insisting those causing a problem move but ensuring that those pitched incorrectly but not causing a problem are aware of the infringement and that at other times/places they could be put to the inconvenience
of being asked to move.To insist that people move just so they are 'on the peg' would lead to the accusation of being a 'jobsworth', something many on this forum already accuse wardens of, second only to being accused of not doing our jobs.
Rest assured Harry, if you are ever on a site on which I am warden you will, if causing a problem, be asked to move.
Regards
Barking
B50.......clearly you have never been on a site that I've been on then.
What are your thoughts on people pitching on the completely wrong side of the peg (about 3 metres out) then? Have you any idea why wardens often completely ignore that?
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I thought Barking explained his position thoroughly. There was no more to say.
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As I see it many of us have tried to move the discussion forward in a positive and friendly manner, others may appear to have a different agenda. Let's get back to reasoned discussion. So I ask, what should the tolerance off peg be, what should it be determined
by?For me this tolerance should be determined by the regs and the peg is there to guide us in getting it right. For some of us being slightly off peg may be 'acceptable' according to ground measurements. For others one inch may just be too far off in every
pitch instance! However, in no instances should pitching which contravenes the regs themselves be left unaddressed.It may be that some however just do not want wardens to use their legitimate initiative, discretion and common sence in any instance even when this results in no regulations being broken.
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Wardens discretion is good for me Mickey Boy
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As I see it many of us have tried to move the discussion forward in a positive and friendly manner, others may appear to have a different agenda. Let's get back to reasoned discussion. So I ask, what should the tolerance off peg be, what should it be determined
by?For me this tolerance should be determined by the regs and the peg is there to guide us in getting it right. For some of us being slightly off peg may be 'acceptable' according to ground measurements. For others one inch may just be too far off in every
pitch instance! However, in no instances should pitching which contravenes the regs themselves be left unaddressed.It may be that some however just do not want wardens to use their legitimate initiative, discretion and common sence in any instance even when this results in no regulations being broken.
Yep, for me the bottom line is clearannces.
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