CLs instead of Club sites
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We're different, for many years we returned to the same CL in Cornwall, meeting up with friends and enjoying the unique creek side position of the site. It has a very daunting approach so only the more adventurous got down there.
Sadly we lost one half of our friends and their caravan was sold. We tried going back but felt we'd got good memories and it was time to move on. Since then we've tried lots of other CLs interspersed with larger sites. We know what we like and so far have not had a bad stay anywhere. Each CL is unique and there's plenty of choice. We don't particualrly want repeat visits any more, there are so many new places to see. 
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You could say that Club sites are better because there is the opportunity to socialise with your neighbours. My experience, unfortunately, is that many of the neighbours stay in their vans watching TV.
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I've always found CL stayers to be more sociable, as a general rule.
Only last week we spent 3 nights at Chester site and apart from the "Good Morning" and a quick retreat no-one could be bothered with their neighbour. In fact a couple of them actively avoided any contact, even from 3+ metres away. Went on to a CL and all of the other occupants stopped and had a chat, quite willingly. You have to be lucky to meet a sociable type next to you on a club site, which we have come across every once in a while.
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That one, or it’s twin, is not far from me. The one where a review says the electric hook up is hidden in a clump of nettles? So £16 a night to park there, or £20 at a proper non CL site not too far away where the owners have made an effort. It really does take all sorts.
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An Owner's viewpoint.
Many visitors to CLs cite that the reason they often choose CLs is that they are ‘good value’. Whilst this clearly prompts members to choose a CL site over a (probably more expensive) commercial or club site, should CLs be ‘cheap’ or under-selling themselves? As site operators, we offer something that is unique: A limited number of pitches.
This restriction means that visitors have space to spread out, and don’t feel like they are pitching in a car park.
Pricing of sites that provide EHU
Many modern caravans and motorhomes rely on having access to Electric Hook-Up. Although there are some keen advocates of ‘off-grid camping who are well equipped with solar cells and lithium batteries, the vast majority of CAMC members seem to need EHU.With the price of electricity rising year on year, and the recently announced major increases, many CL sites have now chosen to meter the use of EHU and charge visitors for EHU per kWh at cost price in line with the OFGEM regulations.
A growing number of CLs that offer EHU are pricing themselves at between £20 and £30. If the site offers additional facilities (such as a toilet or shower), has exceptional views, is well-established and has excellent reviews, or simply has a lot of demand due to location, this would seem justified. There are some CLs on the network that charge more than £30 that are fully booked all year round. Many of the new CLs joining the network in 2021 are charging £20 or more per night.
This chart shows the Pitch Price of 1,864 CLs offering EHU as at September 2021.. Although there are a few sites that provide pitches with EHU at less than £10, the vast majority are priced between £10 and £20. The average is £15.37.
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On the question of sociability of members (hitchglitch, Wherenext and Deleted User User’s comments above), I suspect that it is true, albeit a bit of a generalisation, that those who visit CLs are more likely to be sociable types. The very nature of CLs is such that one is less anonymous, one of a small number and almost a part of the farm or household or establishment that runs the CL. This gives it more of a rally type atmosphere. Maybe this is more for the outgoing sociable types.
A person who is shy or unsociable on a club site is not likely to suddenly come out of their shell on a CL. It is not the CL that makes people sociable, it is that sociable types are more likely to go to CLs. I am probably stating the obvious.
As someone who has visited club sites over almost 35 years, I do believe that members are less approachable than used to be the case. Like Wherenext, I find it upsetting when neighbours avoid eye-contact, or otherwise make it obvious they do not wish to engage. I always try to be friendly and have a chat. Perhaps especially because I am on my own, so it is good to have some interaction. Most people will chat once one starts a conversation, in my experience, but too many adopt avoidance tactics and make sure you don’t get the chance to open a dialog. I do find that depressing.
At least I can say that there is less suspicion of single campers nowadays. In my early days, this was a problem. People seemed to think it was extraordinary that one could be on one’s own. That has changed, thank goodness, although it still limits couples’ willingness to do more than have a brief chat.
But, having written what I have, I would stop at criticising neighbours because they sit inside watching the TV. If they chat when one encounters them outside or walking on the site or at the service point, or wherever, that’s great and I much enjoy engaging in that way; sometimes this might lead to a drink or a cuppa together and that is great. But I have to say that, for myself, I do not want to find myself feeling obliged to interact beyond that. I might be willing to do so, but I do not want to feel obliged to do so. There is a very big difference. That is why, for example, I never go on rallies. Nor would I countenance, as a single camper, joining singles groups. I know some love that kind of thing and I have no argument with them at all, but it is not for me. I like to do things my own way, especially when I am on holiday. That does not make me unsociable, no more than staying inside and watching TV makes me unsociable. If a neighbour who is willing to engage and chat, chooses to spend the rest of their day watching TV I have no complaint with that. It would be arrogant in the extreme to expect them to come out to talk to me.
It is those who simply won’t engage at all that I find deeply disheartening.
Sorry, a long post I know, but I felt I wanted to get that said. It means a lot to me to be able to have friendly chats when on site.
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"With the price of electricity rising year on year, and the recently announced major increases, many CL sites have now chosen to meter the use of EHU and charge visitors for EHU per kWh at cost price in line with the OFGEM regulations."
this is interesting in that we are regularly told that, despite many comments on CT where it was hoped the overall electric usage/bill could/should be lowered using metering, lower breaker values or a non-EHU option, the Club couldnt recoup any costs to carry out any of the above without price rises...
How can a 5 van site cover their costs for metering and maintain prices, and couldn't any plan they use be replicated to a larger site or group of sites ( et work)?
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I suppose many CLs are cheaper but still offer good facilities. CC is more expensive, but then CC income supports a web site, a discussion group on here, booking facilities for UK and overseas sites, tech advice, and all the admin that goes with a big organisation. The annual sub probably doesn’t cover that.
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It appears to me that our club is managed by people with a very different mindset to the one posted here by a CL owner.
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Have prices been maintained after installation? Difficult to know perhaps? I assume CL's do out their prices up?
I think it may be more about finding the money as well? The highest quote for a meter per bollard has been £500, which no one has disputed. Could be lower but there is a cost.
So a five site CL will cost £2500 or less, which I think is quite achievable for a business to raise that? A CL owner might think that makes it more attractive to potential CL users and people like yourself with good gas and SP setup and makes the price look more attractive and so worth it to them to spend that money as well as being easier to manage?
For the club however that would be £5 million - more difficult to raise?
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For various reasons over the years and two owners( if we're talking about the same site) it hasn't had consistent care. However it has it's devotees who accept these things and appreciate the beauty of the setting and access to a tidal creek for boats and fishing etc. Not every CL needs to be manicured does it, for us, in this instance, it's location and access to nature.
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Hopefully CG can provide more detail, hence my question to him.
The point is, like the club, a CL won't be able to recoup that investment by increasing electric charges so it's dead money..why invest it if not to stop pitch prices running away and ensuing loss of business.yes, the absolute numbers are higher for the club but the ratio per night visit is the same.
eventually those passed on electric prices will be taken notice of even by the most stalwart of CC customers.
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oThe point is, like the club, a CL won't be able to recoup that investment by increasing electric charges so it's dead money..why invest it if not to stop pitch prices running away and ensuing loss of business
Well as I said I think (might be wrong) that the £2500 needed or much less would be quite easy to raise for a business? A simple loan could cover it? Again I'm not nor ever have been in business so don't quote me on that but I personally don't think £2500 for a business or even an individual is a lot (yes I know lucky me I sure people will say)
The point I was trying to make that while it may be lost money a CL owner might think it might bring in more business by either appearing to offer a lower price and/or be more attractive to people with outfits like your self who say they want or like the idea of non paying for EHU and don't want full fat club sites all the time. Does anyone think that the club bringing in metering will lead to an increase in booking's? I don't but just my view and anyway would that matter, the club is getting more bookings that it can supply at times?
yes, the absolute numbers are higher for the club but the ratio per night visit is the same
Irrelevant in my view as it is the amount that needs to be found that is the important factor (and can it be 'written off' if it doesn't pay off? £2500 might be?) and as I said the club will need to find £5,000,000.
Has the growing prices put anyone off yet? Are they likely to? I'm not sure at all. people will see their own energy costs rise and just accept the club has to too? Like you I've been on this forum a long time, and every year the prices are complained about yet club usage continues to rise.
In fact how many questions at the AGM were about high prices? Not one I recall, yet quite a number of not getting a pitch.
But and the end of the day the club has decided not to go down this route at this time and perhaps for a few years.
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Btw, let’s not forget that expenditure on upgrading a site will be tax deductible and VAT paid on achieving it will be reclaimable which may be especially useful to a small business such as a CL.
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In the last 10 years I have stayed on well over 100 CLs at a very conservative estimate. I have yet to stay on one that has metred electricity. In fact I have never stayed on a CL which has metres, AFAIR.
I am therefore puzzled as to how CG can state "many" when talking about CL owners installing them. There may well be a few more than there used to be but, many? I think not. Let's not overhype the situation.
I have seen CLs increase their prices in winter months on a more frequent basis and I can see CL prices in general increasing judging by my recently arranged new home energy tariff which had a significant hike.
But, lots of meters there ain't.
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Corners wrote "Has the growing prices put anyone off yet?"
Yes, me for one. I haven't used a single CAMC site this year. I have, however, used 7 C&CC ones, 1 commercial, 1 THS, 7 CLs or associated Venue facilities plus 4 "freebie" nights.
The above has enabled me to keep my pitch cost average to £13.12 over the course of the year.
As for sociability, part of our reason for touring is for peace and quiet so social interaction isn't high on our list but it doesn't stretch to avoiding eye contact.
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Our touring here this year has seen a similar mix of site providers...CC, when used, won't be at the cheaper end...so, yes, cost is an influence.
I might be a 'lucky me' too, in that I can afford to stay on sites where I choose, but I don't like to be on the end of ever increasing cost where I don't feel I'm getting any more for it when compared to the competition.
location will usually drive our site selection but, where choices are similar, cost will probably come next....so, a nice CL or CCC site as 'handy' as the nearest CC one would probably get our vote.
no doubt the club's view will be to maintain its current pricing policy....the customer picks up the ever increasing tab.
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We are similar WN. Primarily CL users, yet to stay on one with metered electricity. We did find an absolute beauty of a new CL this year, and it gives you the option of with or without hook up. We only found it in July, but since then been back and had three stays now. It’s popular as well. Difference in cost is £3 per night. You know exactly what you are getting.
As for Club Sites......we feel priced out now as well. Used three this year, Ferry Meadows back in April when it had just reopened and is below £20 per night. Then Exeter Racecourse, which is always reasonable but we took advantage of the VAT reduction. I cancelled Moreton In Marsh, as I found the above CL instead. That took our weeks stay down to £72 instead of the £180 that the Club wanted! Marazion Club Site did us fine for a week as we needed the location for an event. But this Site might not be there next time we need it, apparently not earning enough income, not enough to satisfy HQ anyway.
So, we very much pick and choose our Club Sites now, all depends on time of year and any discounts. We are canny enough to use other options.
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The main advantage club sites have for us is it takes no effort to identify and book one
Those together with the "sameness" which gives security to many people, are the main reasons they are successful.
if all commercial sites advertised in one directory in a standard format, then the Clubs would have some proper competition.
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I don’t think you would have any problems finding a nice CL with a lot of things you prefer AD, huge range of provision nowadays, and many still well below the prices the Club charges with nicer facilities often. We enjoyed a lovely CL in Cornwall a few years ago, showers and loos, had its own indoor swimming pool and spa pool. HS pitch if preferred. It cost us £12 per night, with access to pool a separate but very reasonable payment. Admittedly that price was for October, but still a lovely Site in a lovely coastal area. Recommended, so we had no qualms on what it would be like.
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I am therefore puzzled as to how CG can state "many" when talking about CL owners installing them. There may well be a few more than there used to be but, many? I think not. Let's not overhype the situation
I agree with you WN. Over the many years that we have caravanned we have stayed on well over 450 different CLs and none have had metering. This last year we've stopped in 30, (100 in the last 3yrs) plus a couple of Commercial sites and a single CC site at an average cost of £14:80 per night. There may become a time when metering becomes so common that we will have to resort to using those sites occasionally but for now we can manage very well without having to do so.
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which gives security to many people are the main reasons they are successful
Well Arthur I haven't seen the timid approach reason used for a long time, I'm not sure it's true in any way for many and perhaps a little offensive, maybe people just like club sites for the standard they give?
if all commercial sites advertised in one directory in a standard format...the Clubs would have some proper competition.
What standard format? the site directory books or the websites? Does anyone use the directory in making a choice or a website?
Is this really the big secret to both club's success? Then why don't other providers use the same tactics? Perhaps it is not that but maybe the high quality of sites? Also one might be 'tricked' into a club booking once by the directory but as there is so much repeat business the sites must offer something?
Proper competition? What does that mean? You appear to be saying that the club users some underhanded methods of getting people to book. There is plenty of competition for both clubs, lots of it. And if the sites weren't good people would not go back in such large numbers?
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Does anyone use the directory in making a choice or a website?
Indeed I do Corners, - map first, then directory, to decide on which site or CL followed by Google maps, arial view, to check it out.
That way I have a fair idea of what I might expect - (except for the rare aggressive warden.)
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David, I used to use the website but now I use the CC app which can be filtered to show sites or CLs...useful with map option that can be zoomed in and out, confirming exact locations..
I have the CCC version too which is also great for their temp holiday sites...
im sure the background data is all the same, the app just gives a slightly different (better?) way to drill down.
I usually know where we are going (or the area where next stop might be) so starting with the map on the app is less cumbersome than opening out the paper map that came with the directory.
agree that for route planning, a big map with overall view can be useful but when looking for something once a location has been selected I prefer the app.
works well on an iPad and very convenient...all price and review data all available at a click...
in fact, all my site/overnight searching has now switched to apps...the clubs, searchforsites, aires etc...my payload has increased dramatically since I ditched the books.....(yes, I know they're great for back up when no signal etc.....but my first call is to the iPad these days..)
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