Campsites closing at the end of the 2024 season
Comments
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John
In the past some of these types of sites were run by volunteers, Mildenhall springs to mind. That seem to have ended some time ago. As lovely as it was for people to volunteer I am not sure we should impose that sort of responsibility on ordinary Club members even if they are willing. All site wardens I imagine had a wide ranging training to do the job and to keep members staying on site safe. I know people throw their arms in the air at the mention of Health and Safety but it is there for a reason and why we are safer now than we used to be. If these sites can't survive on the relatively low site fees there is clearly not sufficient demand. It is a shame as over the years we have enjoyed several of this type of site. Unfortunately if they can't break even, and I suspect that is the key point from the Club's point of view, there is little justification for keeping them open. There are some no facility sites that do quite well, Stamford and Hebden Bridge spring to mind.
David
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I think it is good financial practice by the club to continuously monitor the profitability of each site and to sadly close those that are unprofitable. The alternatives are to use members money to support these sites, which are visited by so few, and take money away from the network refurbishment budget. Or raise the membership fee or pitch fees to raise funds to support these sites,
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Brilliant then. If more people did, or had, then these sites would stay open? But my point to NTH was about needing deep pockets.
Equally they don't for me and they would have to pay me to stay on them, each to their own as I've always said and I can't think of anything else to say apart from carry on using them? If the club doesn't have them then there must be plenty of others? If not, well...
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I agree, I do agree with some sites helping to fund less popular sites to some extent, after all not all sites are full all of the time with some maybe only making a profit, that is covering costs and above, at peak times and rather than close them off peak the really popular sites help to keep them open, but there must/will be a point where that is just unsustainable, I assume that is what happened here. Especially as the numbers were decreasing year on year, probably at a much greater rate than elsewhere?
If as posted somewhere one of these sites only had one outfit on and if this was the case often then that isn't going to cover the warden's wages for that day.
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I think the “one outfit on” comment needs a bit of context here. Nunnykirk closes at the end of September, always has done, so it does sound like even the seasonals had gone home at the time the poster who mentioned it stayed. We stayed at Nunnykirk twice a couple of years ago, before it lost the all in pricing pitch fee. It wasn’t full, but it was busy. Folks can interpret this how they like, but for us, it was a great location, close to places we wanted to visit, had all we required or needed in our less power hungry outfit, and we didn’t need legs, bikes or buses to get anywhere. It was actually our second choice, we couldn’t use Fontburn Reservoir overnight stop, as it was closed for an issue, so we popped into Nunnykirk, and were so glad we did. Did the same going home. I think it was £14 per night at the time. It appeared to be thriving to us.
Two years on, November, we go to Cayton Bay. Huge, a glorified, landscaped car park, half closed up, a mere six outfits in the bottom area (not enough grass to use the term “field”) deserted playground, not exactly close to Scarborough, but it might be on a bus route. I think we paid something like £36 per night for a standard pitch. I can only think that the pitch prices charged are levied so that the Summer pricing subsidises the Winter months it stays open (it’s not an open all year site) So expect to see such sites having a shortened season is my guess. The Club is facing a difficult period I think.
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John, you're in luck, if you want to help out then you can volunteer to help the club out then you can:
https://www.caravanclub.co.uk/about-us/work-for-us/on-our-sites/volunteer/
Everyone has a poke at H&S, until they are responsible if someone gets hurts.
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I can't claim credit for finding this, it was in fact found by a friend, but I did remember it being posted and started the hunt.
In 2023 the CAMC said this:
"One of the Club's ambitions is to ensure there is a pitch at a price for every member. Many members love a ‘back to basics’ campsite whereas others prefer a full facility campsite with a shower block, play area and restaurant. However you enjoy your holiday, be it midweek in the summer or only ever at weekends in the winter, we have a massive variety of sites and pitches at different prices to suit every budget."
How is achieving that ambition being served by closing these ‘back to basics’ sites? So much for CAMC being fully inclusive.
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I think the Club is relying on the CL network offering things at the more basic end (although of course there are a good few CLs that are very swish, and provide every amenity ).
For us, many of these small basic sites were ideally located as well priced stopovers as well as nice places to spend a longer period. We certainly used Bromyard, Nunnykirk, Much Wenlock, Notgrove (Bourton), NYM and a few others for our travels up and down and across the country. At £14 per night, they were excellent value, better than a lot of CLs. Some we actually went back to and stayed a lot longer to explore the area more. We were very loyal users of such sites, indeed sometimes chose them over other options, and the fact they were there, but are now dwindling so quickly is just another nail in our near 40 year relationship with the Club. They were stunning locations, proper camping that required a bit of effort (physically and mentally), and places to de stress and enjoy beautiful locations, wildlife, a lot more peace and quiet.
Thinking about it, adding in all the now lost racecourse sites as well, last three years or so has decimated this kind of Club offering. Club sites are now destinations based on ratings for the loos, how long a pipe you need for a service pitch, can I get to a bus stop, and how dodgy is the wifi signal! Exciting times. The front seat view for the grand prix scrabble to get the perfect pitch does come as a bonus I suppose!
Its touring, of a sorts, but a world away from how we think of it. ☹️2 -
GE and GJE wrote - The alternatives are to use members money to support these sites, which are visited by so few, and take money away from the network refurbishment budget.
My membership fee is being used to support refurbishment of sites that I have no intention of using but as a member I accept that. The same reason I accept my fee being used to upkeep children play areas and dog bins and some shower blocks.
Quite a few of us are finding that club sites just aren't for us and will only use them when there is no reasonable alternative yet our fees will now be channelled into sites that we'll get minimal return on. We remain members for various reasons outwith the actual sites. Like Ttda we would often use these sites even in preference to CLs if we were in the area. Gwen-y-Bwlch was a favourite in Spring.
As LLM states, the CAMC are not being fully inclusive at all. They have, to use a phrase recently bandied around, "managed decline" these sites out of use by getting rid of their USP. The fact that they've closed so many in one fell swoop tells you everything.
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Given the amount of rain that we have had in Northumberland this year (it’s raining again now), I would expect a number of pitches at Nunnykirk to have been out of use for some time. It’s a lovely place when the weather is dry, but the reality is that most members want a hard standing, to avoid being stuck on wet grass. Not having a toilet block does not seem to be a major issue, but location and ease of use in our unpredictable weather, will probably reduce the attraction of the more remote sites.
In an ideal world the sites such as Nunnykirk would be cross subsided by the more profitable and popular sites. However, we are now in a more commercial environment, whether we like it or not.
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I would suggest that one of the reasons for the decline in use of those specific sites was the larger hike in pitch prices compared to the "full facility" sites, and the loss of an all season round price.
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Broomfield Farm closure.
What a sad day for this once great club. I have been a member of the club for 31 years and a seasonal pitch holder at Broomfield Farm for over 18 years ,that is thousands of pounds in the clubs coffers . I also pull my caravan off in the height of the summer and spend more money with the caravan club on overseas sites and ferry,s ,5C breakdown and caravan insurance.
We had our 40th year celebration party today on site to celebrate the site being open for 40 years organised by the people that matter,the wardens,volunteers and club members.
The site will probably finish the season in the black despite the club deliberately shortening the season for closure in September ,which has discouraged seasonal occupation and justified the closure .
The Club is now being run by accountants who’s only interests is an increase bottom line, and corporate branding, this is the Caravan and Motorhome Club not the All England Lawn Tennis and Croquet Club.
A very sad day for me ...That me done...I’m out I will spend my money elsewhere .
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I’m sure there will be some who don’t understand your tennis reference Robeno, but I do, and find myself in agreement. It’s been a rather sad three years or so, one way and another. Good for you all at the site to have your celebration, all you can do is treasure the friends made, the memories and enjoyment you have had. All the best.👍
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and a seasonal pitch holder at Broomfield Farm for over 18 years ,that is thousands of pounds in the clubs coffers .
When we had a seasonal pitch at a full facility site in 2018 it would have worked out at £6 a night if we had stayed all possible. Even using it as we did the cost was only £12.50. The full cost at the time varied between £30 and £22. You might have spent thousands, but personally I can’t see how the club make any money out of them. They are generally only available at the less popular sites and are presumably a way of selling pitches that wouldn’t be sold in the normal fashion, hopefully at a break even cost. I’m afraid as with many things, most of the non facility sites just aren’t profitable anymore and there is no good business reason for them to continue operating.
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There are so many things the Club could have done to attract people to a big site like Broomfield farm - a car/ caravan boot sale, a craft fair, a fun dog show, a vintage car and caravan display and all the rest - but nothing was done to pull visitors in. There are sites where the owners make an effort to boost business - but not there.
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Sites like Broomfield Farm create a perfect storm for the Club. First off, its in the middle of nowhere, accessed by a narrow road with no footpath. Therefore it won't be as popular with motorhomes, we are now told they make up half the membership. The price in peak season is just £23 a night for a couple on a hardstanding pitch including electricity so comparable with many CL's, so hardly bad value? If they reduced the price to £15 a night they would have to have a third more customers to break even with the current prices. Despite many of us saying we would be happy to use such sites if there were more of them it looks as if the evidence is against us. I imagine the Club would be happy to break even but draw the line at making a loss?
David
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Despite many of us saying we would be happy to use such sites if there were more of them
All depends where they are . Close to attractions they would be packed out. Contrary to what some might think there are many members who would use non facility sites especially near attractions.
peedee
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Thing is, PD, what is one person's attraction is another's must avoid. I liked High Onn for its peace and isolation but, had it been next door to Alton Towers, I would have avoided it like the plague.
My feeling is that people aren’t using the non-fac sites purely because they do want facilities and that could explain the low take up of pitches.
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I cannot think of a single small site that we have used that wasn’t “close” to an attraction🤷♀️
Marazion………………Cornish Coast, St Michael’s Mount, Penzance
Nunnykirk…………….Northumberland Moors, Cragside, Rothbury
Much Wenlock……..Wenlock Edge, Wenlock Priory, Church Stretton,
North York Moors…NYM, Whitby, Scarborough,
Notgrove……………..Bourton, Sudeley Castle, Cotswolds generally
Lots of others, but you get my drift.
When did a bit of effort and planning get left off the holiday list? Just how close do folks want to be to something? Or is it just shops, eateries, crowds, folks want on their doorsteps?
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Close to attractions they would be packed out.
But some are (non club and club) and they have not been?
Contrary to what some might think there are many members who would use non facility sites especially near attractions.
And your evidence for that is? And you keep talking about attractions? What do you mean?
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It’s not about attractions, it’s about effort required. If it doesn’t have hard standings, plug in electrics, plumbed in water, little posts to help the spacially challenged, lots of staff to tell others off, it’s all too much for many folks that join the Club. Life is a little bit different away from Club Sites, so there is a degree of hope left out there on CLs and small private sites. Cheaper as well most of the time😁
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TDA
Just taking North York Moors as an example. Its in the middle of nowhere there are far better sites with access to Whitby, Sandfield House Farm, and Scarborough Cayton Village. In both cases you have a bus stop at the end of the site road to take you into either. I suspect most motorhomes, especially those with larger units would not want to take them into either town and try and park.
David
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Just noticed on a Facebook Group that someone has started a petition against the closure on Broomfield Farm. Trouble is that admin for that group has turned off posts in that discussion so there won't be any feedback as to numbers. I am not sure the Club will be swayed but it would be interesting to know what sort of numbers are willing to sign the petition. Interesting that they put it on a group which has no connection to the Club, perhaps they should try here?
David
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I disagree. When in France we use lots of non facility Aires because they are next or close to where we want to visit. Therefore in that respect it is about attractions. In this country we have used Altnaharra a couple of times because it was where we want to be. The other non facility sites in areas we have toured just weren’t in attractive positions. Bourton on the Water, for instance, is 5 miles away from the town.
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I wonder which sites will go next?
The Ilfracombe site has had only one review this year and only one last year. That doesn’t speak of much usage. It’s another undeveloped and uninvested site, in a field, on a hill, and 3 miles out of town. And with lots of nearby competition.
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You don’t need a bus to visit Whitby or Scarborough though DK, Whitby is easy. P&R, on North side, or if it’s the Abbey you want, the Abbey car park is huge, with direct access to Abbey and Museum. There’s a P&R half a mile from Cayton Bay in Scarbro as well. The car park next door to Harbour in Whitby is huge as well, but pricey. Even better, park up at Grosmont and you can use Steam trains or Esk Valley lines to get about. (Very big MHs might struggle up some of the roads round Grosmont though) Club used to negotiate discount on NYM railway, we have ridden for free! It’s a beautiful moorland drive on good roads (unless it’s snowing🤭) to North Bay at Scarborough. There’s an Aire and lots of parking under Castle, which is free part of year. It’s why we actually chose NYM site back in April, so easy to do both sites, but then you have the peace and tranquility, and wildlife back up on the site. Much better than listening to building works at double the price at Cayton Bay site. (I don’t blame the Club for the noisy building work🤣) Granted Whitby and Scarbro can be challenging for anyone with mobility issues, given how hilly they are.
(There’s a community Aire by the way in Goathland now, if anyone is interested)
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Again, looking at Nunnykirk it’s in the middle of nowhere, (that will be a positive for some folks)
However, most customers want to be within a short drive (even better a short walk), so that they can pick up a pizza and then go home),
We live a relatively short drive from Nunnykirk, it’s a lovely spot when the weather is warm and dry, and you want to get away from it all. But, we all know how much rain has fallen on Northumberland recently.
However, the reality is that not a sufficient number of paying customers want that sort of holiday. The world has changed, a lot of people are used to having facilities on their door, so staying at a place like Nunnykirk will appeal to a reducing number of customers.
Yes, a loss to the site network, but probably a reflection of reality.
To just say, that I started caravan holidays with my parents in a Sprite 400, which was basically a tin tent, no heating, no pumped water, no toilet (a tent outside). Towed by an old Morris. Happy days.
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I envy you where you live😁 Rothbury would be number three on our list of places to live.
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