Wild overnight parking- Scotland

mickysf
mickysf Forum Participant Posts: 6,474 ✭✭✭
2,500 Likes 1000 Comments
edited August 2023 in Caravan & Motorhome Chat #1

A move is a foot to ban overnight wild overnight parking in Sutherland and possibly across Scotland as a whole.

https://www.northern-times.co.uk/news/sutherland-caravan-park-operators-in-move-to-ban-motorhomes-322876/?utm_medium=newsletters

«13

Comments

  • Cornersteady
    Cornersteady Club Member Posts: 14,426 ✭✭✭
    5,000 Likes 1000 Comments Name Dropper Photogenic
    edited August 2023 #2

    yes saw that. Going to be interesting.

  • K Brown
    K Brown Forum Participant Posts: 33
    edited August 2023 #3

    Wild camping was never about motorhomes parking for free. It was originally intended for walkers pitching a small tent/bivouac as a means to access the more remote hills. Why do those who pay a substantial amount for their motorhome feel they need to find free overnight (or longer) pitches?

    I should say that I am certainly not anti motorhome (I own one), however nothing is free. At some point all the “wild campers” will need fresh water and to dump their grey and black water. Where are they intending to do that?

  • mickysf
    mickysf Forum Participant Posts: 6,474 ✭✭✭
    2,500 Likes 1000 Comments
    edited August 2023 #4

    As I understand it they can go 3 or 4 days before a paid site is needed, Quite a saving and some stunning places to wild park are out there!

  • K Brown
    K Brown Forum Participant Posts: 33
    edited August 2023 #6

    Ok, they go for 3 or 4 days before they they need to come down to earth, let’s hope that the  responsible ones then go to a campsite rather than just dump their waste at any secluded spot. Why is there such a backlash from local residents against the motorhomers who do not seem to have the first clue about responsible behaviour. 
    The “stunning places” to which an earlier responder refers to have no facilities, but the free parkers seem to think that they can pitch up and have no effect. No doubt, they will all claim that they leave no trace, however it only takes a smaller  few to see that free parking is available then the problems start.

    Nothing is free. The days when a few campers in tents or vans would pitch up then move on are long gong. We all need to take to take responsibility for our actions, and “free camping” should not be viewed as a cheap, no impact, alternative to going to a proper campsite.

     

     

  • mickysf
    mickysf Forum Participant Posts: 6,474 ✭✭✭
    2,500 Likes 1000 Comments
    edited August 2023 #8

    I understand what you are saying but there are the responsible ones out there. I remember as an early twenty something taking my home converted camper to wild places, off the beaten track, so that very early dawn starts, sometimes predawn starts to climbs and Monroe baggings could be made. The locals then were both helpful and welcoming and we spent money in these remote corners of Scotland, some places well off the usual tourist trail. This latest move to ban wild parking comes from caravan site owners and not necessarily from the locals. Please note that a few can spoil it for the rest, that I understand but we shouldn’t tar all with the same brush, there are the good ones about. Afterall, moving a van on site at three o’clock in the morning to get to the start of a climb wouldn’t go down well with those enjoying the peace and quiet and a lie in would it!

  • mickysf
    mickysf Forum Participant Posts: 6,474 ✭✭✭
    2,500 Likes 1000 Comments
    edited August 2023 #11

    It can be the case if that wild parking place is way off the beaten track and only visited by the few with good cause for being there and leave no trace. Like the climbers and walkers accessing remote routes. As has been said it is still legal in many places, we shouldn’t let the lazy, littering antisocial folk spoil it for the true outdoor pursuitists amongst us should we. Maybe the Aires idea or a registered licence that has to be apply for with a certificate displayed in the leisure vehicle allowing folk to wild park may be a solution. The latter is employed in various national parks and wild places abroad. Banning it completely will not happen, the mountain sports fraternity is too large and too long established to be ignored or bullied in this way. Those that spoil it for others I’d argue are not those I mention, those without regard should of course be discouraged and even prevented from wild parking or even prosecuted if they abuse the countryside and communities within. 

  • Cornersteady
    Cornersteady Club Member Posts: 14,426 ✭✭✭
    5,000 Likes 1000 Comments Name Dropper Photogenic
    edited August 2023 #13

    I'm following through FB the travels of my Italian relations who I go motorhoming with when over there.

    They are working their way north to escape the 30 and often very 40C heat back home. At the moment they are in the Netherlands (and will heading even further north) and I repost their translated words:

    Approaching Rotterdam today to continue on to Amsterdam. First timid taste of the low temperature of the North Sea with subsequent forced break in Shedrecht guests of the Nescio farm as all the campsites are absolutely full (and the "free" break entails a €400 fine!). Walk along the canals to visit windmills up close restored and still efficient despite being almost 500 years old.

    So it would appear that staying anywhere with a MH apart from campsites, aires, and other specified allowed places there could get you a 400 euro fine? I've asked for further details but FYI.

     Post edit just checked a few other websites and this appear to be the case.

  • Wherenext
    Wherenext Club Member Posts: 10,586 ✭✭✭
    5,000 Likes 1000 Comments Name Dropper
    edited August 2023 #14

    That's the problem with Golden Geese.

    They become pests and are no longer wanted so have to migrate elsewhere.frown

  • DavidKlyne
    DavidKlyne Club Member Posts: 13,857 ✭✭✭
    5,000 Likes 1000 Comments Name Dropper Photogenic
    edited August 2023 #15

    ET

    Exactly my own thoughts when I read it. It completely lacks credibility, more like self interest?

    There must be thousands of motorhomes and campers that visit the NC500 (as an example) each year and cause no adverse effect to the environment even if they do park/camp off piste. It seems to me that that those that have a fundamental dislike of people parking where they choose have to find examples of the quite small number of people that do disregard the common sense rules. We should also remember that the promotion of routes like the NC500 came originally from local tourist boards but of course, like Topsy it kept growing and growing probably to the point where it was unsustainable. The answer is to provide more facilities which can be done in a number of ways not always to the cost of the locals. There must be loads of businesses that have the room to allow parking for a modest fee and maybe a few facilities. The trouble is someone has to organise it and really that has to be some official body.

    David

  • Takethedogalong
    Takethedogalong Forum Participant Posts: 17,033 ✭✭✭
    10,000 Likes 1000 Comments Name Dropper Photogenic
    edited August 2023 #16

    We visited D&G last year, and used quite a few of the free and very low cost overnight stay areas that are legal for campers and MH’s. From our experience, I would say that the only problems we had were with overseas visitors (Swiss in our case) and those in hired outfits. They totally ignored the concept of only a given number of outfits being allowed, and the spacing between outfits. Forestry Sites, the lovely little Aire at Kircudbright, everyone behaving and paying. 

    Scotland has a lot of hire companies. Easy enough to spot a hired camper, if they are misbehaving, simply make a note of outfit details and pass onto local community area/police and let them deal with it at source. Report to hire firm, fine if appropriate, they can pass on fine to hirer’s. 

  • peedee
    peedee Club Member Posts: 9,383
    1000 Comments Name Dropper
    edited August 2023 #17

    So it would appear that staying anywhere with a MH apart from campsites, aires, and other specified allowed places there could get you a 400 euro fine? I've asked for further details but FYI.

     Post edit just checked a few other websites and this appear to be the case.

    It has always been illegal to wild camp in the Nertherlands as it is in some other countries. However the Netherlands, like the UK is seeing a boom in motorhome ownership and has this year established 45 offical motorhome aires already this year.

    peedee

  • Cornersteady
    Cornersteady Club Member Posts: 14,426 ✭✭✭
    5,000 Likes 1000 Comments Name Dropper Photogenic
    edited August 2023 #18

    Good for them. Sounds a good plan.

    Although according to my source there it's not enough. They're moving north out of the country asap. 

    'They're crazy, 'cause the motorhomes (italians expecially) are absolutely more and more than available slots in campsites! 😡'

    (Translated)

  • Rufs
    Rufs Club Member Posts: 4,072 ✭✭✭✭✭
    1000 Comments
    edited August 2023 #19

    "They're crazy, 'cause the motorhomes (italians expecially) are absolutely more and more than available slots in campsites! 😡'

    this is becoming the case in some areas of Spain during the winter months. When we were there this winter gone, sites were rammed with MH's especially German, French & Dutch, the site we were on had converted the playing field into pitches for MH's, massive fire risk, you could shake hands with your neighbour thru the window, in fact there was a bad fire early this year at Bolnuevo campsite in Mazarrón when several MH's were completely burned out, this was not just a few apparently a whole row were burnt out, suspect gas cooker in 1 unit.

  • Tammygirl
    Tammygirl Club Member Posts: 7,957 ✭✭✭
    2,500 Likes 1000 Comments
    edited August 2023 #20

    That was our opinion when we checked it out the other year. 

    Lovely area, smashing beach but the site was unruly. Units parked to close to each other, awnings facing with windbreaks joining them to their ' friends' not for me.

    Yes the complaint came from site owners, no surprise. Not enough sites to cope with the hordes during summer, not profitable in winter. More Aires are planned but it all takes time. 

  • nelliethehooker
    nelliethehooker Club Member Posts: 13,636
    1000 Comments Name Dropper
    edited August 2023 #21

    The same problem applies in the Lake District with illegal overnight pitching up in car parks, especially around the Keswick area. V

  • peedee
    peedee Club Member Posts: 9,383
    1000 Comments Name Dropper
    edited August 2023 #23

    Visit Scotland is currently surveying "campers" as to their requirements for holidaying there.

    peedee

  • young thomas
    young thomas Forum Participant Posts: 11,356
    1000 Comments
    edited August 2023 #24

     Nice post, Matt...lots of good points. We can't expect everyone to 'get it' but you've made your points in the right spirit.👍

  • flatcoat
    flatcoat Forum Participant Posts: 1,571
    1000 Comments
    edited August 2023 #25

    I am not against motorhomes, we are considering buying one in a few years. I also agree provision of Ares type locations should go hand in hand with tightening (banning) wild camping legislation for motorhomers. Unfortunately too many selfish motorhomers have seriously damaged the reputation in the eyes of too many inhabitants of the highlands. There are lots of things I like doing but the law doesn’t allow - such as riding green lanes on a motorbike but a selfish minority got it banned for the majority. 

  • Takethedogalong
    Takethedogalong Forum Participant Posts: 17,033 ✭✭✭
    10,000 Likes 1000 Comments Name Dropper Photogenic
    edited August 2023 #26

    We took part in a survey whilst we were up in D&G last year. Local authority staff member out and about talking to visitors, and locals, about utilising more off road parking spots for legal overnight stopovers. Some places and local communities have made a real effort to welcome campervans and MHs. 

  • flatcoat
    flatcoat Forum Participant Posts: 1,571
    1000 Comments
    edited August 2023 #28

    I suspect one challenge of managing aires in the UK Will the temptation they offer to certain ethnic groups to take up a more permanent form of residence on them. 

  • Hja
    Hja Club Member Posts: 849 ✭✭
    500 Likes 500 Comments Name Dropper
    edited August 2023 #29

    Only some travellers belong to a separate ethnic group. But this is not apparently a major problem “over there”.

  • Tammygirl
    Tammygirl Club Member Posts: 7,957 ✭✭✭
    2,500 Likes 1000 Comments
    edited August 2023 #30

    No it's not, that's because most local councils over there provide separate campsites for the travelling workers. Not always in a nice area I must say but provide they do. 

  • Cartledge
    Cartledge Forum Participant Posts: 267
    100 Comments
    edited August 2023 #31

    I think much of the damage (to countryside and MH reputation) has been done by newcomers to MHs, or MH renters during and after Covid. They probably don’t belong to the CMHC anyway, do not read pages on here either so live in ignorance of best practice, Tent campers have also done a lot of damage, with no facilities at all for their waste of any kind. 
    Controls are bound to be imposed, the price of ignorance and laziness which conscientious people finish up paying on our over-crowded islands.