Smart Metering Trial
Comments
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The variation in reduction due to metering clearly follows a seasonal trend, although the difference between £1 and £6 does seem a bit extreme but what we don't know is what the Kwh price the Club pay for its electricity. I suppose we also need to take into account that toilet blocks also use power and we don't know how much that works out on average per pitch. Given that this is an experiment I assume the seasonal price reductions are not set in stone?
The payment option is interesting. You clearly have to add funds but how much? If you go by the amount of the reduction in site fee that might well not be enough? I think I would prefer to register a card and be charged at the end rather than trying to guess how much I am likely to use. Motorhomers need to read the instructions carefully about disconnections during their stay if for example they wish to go off site.
David
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Hi All,
Just to clear up some of the comments I've seen around this...
I'm Kieran and the Social Media Manager (SMM) here at the Club. Just wanted to make sure we had shared the latest update from the Club around Smart Metering as I know this has been a topic previously discussed here on Club Together, whilst Ro is enjoying an Easter break.
Unfortunately my Staff tagged hasn't loaded in as of yet!
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Dk. It's a bit like putting money in a meter but at least you can get the unused part back. We've had metered pitches where the remaining money can be used by the next person (and of course you benefit if there are leftovers from the previous user.) I think I was hoping there would be a pro rata non electric pitch rate which C&CC offers, about £5 at present. It couldn't be that much of a reduction due to installation costs etc but there's quite a big variable distinction which isn't clear. However it's interesting to read about and as it's a trial there is room for adjustment and feedback.
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We recently stayed at Bonterra Park in Spain and our total electric consumption for the 13 nights was for 67kwh. We used gas for cooking, hot water and heating; the rest (140 litre fridge, 800w kettle, leisure battery charging, laptop and phone charging and two 1.5 hour sessions with our Remoska) was via EHU.
The bill came to 33.50€, about £30.00.
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Trouble is, if they are using historical data and have not weighted it for recent electricity price changes, those figures will be on the low side. Last year I might have got enough electric for my £1 but this year no chance. Even the £2 reduction in August would be touch and go and as I said we don’t use much at all in Summer. Add in a few cups of tea boiled with an electric kettle and toast for breakfast and you have no chance, even at domestic rates.
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None of us know, Steve, and we are all speculating but one would assume that CAMC measures usage in terms of kWh. If that is so, they would surely have converted the average kWh into £s based on current (pardon the pun) costs rather than out of date figures in order to arrive at the figures for reductions. For all we know, though, CAMC could be paying the same price as last year at those sites as so much depends on their contracts. The tariffs will likely bear no relationship to domestic costs and contracts.
For those who want to know the cost of electricity to CAMC, if I recall correctly, under the secondary supplier (SS) regs I think the cost to the SS (CAMC) has to be displayed if electricity is resold by meter because the SS is not allowed to charge more than that figure. The display of costs will bear checking as my memory is hazy on that point.
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I am still trying to get my head round this. My experience of metered pitches has been via meter readings at start and end of stay, so this is very different.
If I understand correctly, any one staying at the sites in question has two choices, no hook up or download an app. Are the club confident that everyone likely to want electricity has a device on which to download an app? I could download one on to my I pad, but not my phone which I rarely use. My partner would really struggle, he uses his phone less than I do. Both of us are well used to technology but desk top computers and my I pad.
I am not sure how money is transferred onto the app. Very definitely not everyone uses internet banking. Initially at least I would expect people would want to keep checking the app to ensure they are not going to run out of electricity, and top up as necessary. Again, are the club convinced that all visitors use the internet whilst on site? I know a lot do, but all? I would also think that many would be cautious bout using the club internet for transferring money.
I know someone will say that people should just embrace modern technology, but everyone sees any need to do so. And I don’t think paying for electricity via an app on club Wi-Fi would be a good introduction!
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This sort of minimal reduction in the summer months could well generate long queues for dish washing and showers, thus increasing the hot water use there, and possibly the cleaning required.
Those who prefer to wash up in the van and use their own shower facilities will certainly be disadvantaged on costs.
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It sounds a bit of a complicated operating system to me, and given we are visitors that go out every day in our MH, and if we leave our dog in the MH, always unplug from the bollard, then it’s not a user friendly system for us personally. But credit to the Club for at least arriving at the party, if late.
Having or not having a smart phone, choosing to use Apps or not using Apps, being willing to pre load a system, or not, are all personal choices that visitors will need to weigh up for themselves.
Our only choice experiences have been with or without EHU, with a decent price differential between the two. Only metering we have come across has been to push a coin into a slot for a shower (usually a very good one). We have benefitted from a previous users credit, likewise we don’t quibble if there’s a bit of shower time left. All very easy to use.
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As you say TW it is all speculation at this stage. However I know even with our minimal use in summer with fridge, battery charger and hot water we would be using 6 Kw or so a day. Even if the CC rate is only 25p per Kw hour ( which I doubt) a £1 reduction is going to fall well short of average usage, as this will also include electric kettles, hot plates and toasters. I agree with other posters that this is only a trial and rates are not set in stone. However, for July in particular they do seem to have been set unrealistically low.
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That sounds about right DD. When our fridge mains element failed while in Norway one year, and we could not source a replacement in good time, we had to run the F/F on LPG, one of our 6kg refillables lasted for 2 weeks.
We have caravanned quite a lot in countries like Germany, Austria and Denmark where electricity is often metered, and expensive, and have found that between running the F/F on electricity, charging the battery, and some lighting and odds and ends, the lowest we could get per day was 5-6 kWh.
( of which at least 4kWh was usually included in the ACSI price)
That was in addition to cooking on gas and heating some water. We do not have a solar panel
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It does say in the FAQs that the commercial rate paid by the Club is more than domestic rates........but not what they are basing that on.
Would certainly be more than anyone on a long domestic fix is paying, but could be less than the current domestic EPG rates most of us are now paying if the site is still on a good fixed rate.
Without actual numbers, it means very little. The price per kWh needs to be clearly stated on the site page.
We have been looking at CLs for June/July and have found some that are metering the electricity, and have reduced pitch prices by several £££, but again there is no indication given on what the unit price would be. Presumably we could contact them to ask, but the lack of details on their websites just makes making decisions more difficult.
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As so many of us are paying different kwh rates at present it's difficult to work out what rates seem reasonable on site. Maybe by the summer rates will have come down? As you say KJ due to metering there may be increased usage of site facilities which will further increase costs for CAMC. No doubt the meter trials will need a lot of evaluation.
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Were pitch prices not adjusted upwards not so long ago, to pay for increased electricity costs? Some by something like £2.50per night?
We do not use other than the no facs sites these days, so did not pay much attention.
How does that fit with the only -£1 per night in July?
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Kj we are using CAMC main sites much less, possibly only one this year. We are going for CL/CS, C&Cc discounts and other sites. We tend to use our own facs and don't mind going off grid occasionally. I'm not interested in high prices for what are essentially camp sites. If CAMC can keep overall costs down for us the end users I'd be more inclined to consider using the sites but prices seem to be running away this year.
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There is an interesting piece of information on this months CL Booking newsletter, around metering and how to conserve energy, keep warm, use less power. I was going to copy and post it, but I note it’s copyrighted, so didn’t want to upset things. It’s all about how some long term vanners changed a few of their touring habits, and little changes they made. Sure some others will have read it as well.
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Exactly what we are doing too brue, and have been for a couple of years.
Our upcoming trip uses 4 CLs and one CCC site.
At present DD & Co are on an affiliated site outside Ayr, large serviced pitch, £36.50 per night for the 4 of them, which compares very well with current Club site prices.
We will not use any Club main sites this year.
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For usage, yes, but they’ll know the present day price.
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Hja
I am not sure it will be by an App on a Smartphone or tablet, we will have to wait for that to be confirmed? They mention Smart Metering which suggests an App but it looks as if you have to log on to a website in order to set everything up? I am sure this will put an extra burden on site staff initially as those less familiar with computer systems could struggle a bit. For the likes TDA who take their unit off site on a daily basis a Smartphone App would probably be more convenient than a website. I am just glad that it is something that can be controlled by the user rather than having to go through site reception which could be inconvenient. Both sites are quite near to where we live so I might stay on one of them for a couple of days just to test the system out.
David
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I am not sure how money is transferred onto the app. Very definitely not everyone uses internet banking.
I would also think that many would be cautious bout using the club internet for transferring money.
Hja it states in the link provided that you can do this before arriving, that is load some money and that unused money can be reimbursed at the end of the stay. It won't be the club that you are paying but Sagepay.
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