Motorhome Parking in Helmsley
The free overnight parking spots for Motorhomes in Helmsley have now been suspended, and it’s no longer possible to stay. Decision taken after all sorts of bad behaviour from some who decided to misbehave.☹️
Comments
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Its a shame but not only are a small minority ruining it for the majority but it is also a failure of the council to police the the area. Perhaps it would have helped if there had been an overnight charge rather than it being free. I also fear Hawick which is also free may go the same way.
peedee
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Perhaps it was not seen as a good use of Council Tax payer's money to fund policing of something that was giving MH-ers a free stay?🤷♂️
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This is the Out and About link to the story which is slightly easier to read than the Yorkshire Post link. Day time parking is still going to be available which is a good thing. It seems that the Council want to think about how they tackle the overnight parking. Clearly far more people are using than the space can really take. I imagine an overnight charge would be one option and actually might solve the issue? One of the issues is that what might be acceptable, in terms of spacing, is acceptable for day time parking from a safety point of view is clearly not true of overnight parking and this seems to be one of the issues of concern to the Council, that and antisocial behavior. Anyone is, of course, free to contact Ryedale District Council to add any thoughts for consideration.
David
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I note they can provide policing to enforce the new rules but not the old ones! An overnight charge would go some way to covering the cost of policing both day and night abuse. It will be interesting to see the views of the Northumberland Council on their trials which have been provided at a cost and with booking.
Some sites have been so successful they have used the revenue to add further facilities so it is not all doom and gloom.
peedee
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It's so frustrating to see this sort of report - no wonder I prefer to drive the 142 miles to the Tunnel and then enjoy the freedom to roam on the Continent.
I see that they are planning to have patrols to enforce the "no overnight Rules". How rigorously did they enforce the overnight parking regulations when the rules were being flouted ? I didn't see any reports of any prosecutions - or hangings
.Perhaps it is time that the authorities in tourist areas consider introducing barrier controlled areas that only admit vehicles registered as Motor Caravans. At least that would exclude those without onboard toilet facilites.
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- Motor caravan users with toilets who abuse anything that is put in place for this growing must have LV population, are it seems by reports from some LAs not being very environmentaly friendly when disposal of waste of any type is concerned
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It's so frustrating to see this sort of report - no wonder I prefer to drive the 142 miles to the Tunnel and then enjoy the freedom to roam on the Continent.
Tell that to the Conwy Council Jim.
peedee
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I guess it depends on how much you are willing to pay for an overnight stay ?
not a boffin on employment law/costs, but i would expect even basic costs to be something like this:-
2 x employees (for night patrols from my experience you need 2xpeople in a car/van)=
12 hr shift at £12 ph x 2 = £288 (pluse whatever insurance you have to provide)
vehicle = no idea but there has to be a cost for fuel insurance, wear & tear etc
lets take an arbitrary figure of £300 per night, maybe 2 sites total 20 units = £15 per unit.
from what i see today in our local area, we dont get many bonifide MH/Camper vans, since car parking charges were introduced, what we do see after 1800hrs on the few car parks that do not have height barriers are transit vans with a mattress thrown in the back and a bucket for slops, no telling where the contents of the bucket end up
our local council has provided special bays for MH/camper vans for day time parking, you have to pay but i have never seen all of them in use at any one time.
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I would think that the figure you quote is way above what is the real figure
I do not know Helmsley but going by posts on here unless there is a supermarket ,the motor caravans that use what was the free parking most will have shopped at cheaper shops and have their food already
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I think the main issue is providing parking without basic facilities. You are always going to get a minority who will not take their waste away. Clearly that would necessitate a charge, to pay for these and some level of enforcement. Overnight parking in the right place, with water and waste disposal for £15 would be a reasonable compromise.
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Even where we’ve used them over there that’s a bit of a leap PD. At two of them we went for restaurant meals which would cover that, but at the rest it was just the Boulangerie of a morning. The majority of other supplies and fuel being obtained in national supermarket chains, rather than local shops.
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It’s somewhere we know really well. The car park is huge, comprises three areas, the quiet overspill being the one designated with 5 bays. It was a huge success when it was put in place in 2017, but I think the last two years will have tested the patience of all concerned.
The Ryedale Traffic Wardens, when on duty, are of the Rottweiler breed, ticketing visitors, particularly in Helmsley and Pickering is a sport, and any minor infringement gets short shrift. Unwary visitors, like us one day in our car, got bawled out by one in no uncertain terms for having a vehicle too long to fit in a tiny space in Pickering car park. So when on duty, they miss nothing. Overnight policing will be done by a few zealous residents, this is a town happy to take the visitor pound, but then wants the folks out once they have spent.
That said, we also have first hand experience of just how selfish and unthinking some tourers are, as this echoes what happened to us up in D&G, in a paid for stop. Seven allowed, we spent a night with eighteen parked wherever they could fit, (no one too close to us, we had fend off measures in place, and the only one who asked if it was ok, was politely told no.) Main culprits were hired Motorhomes, and the six Swiss MHs, who were happy to squeeze in anywhere.
So sadly, it comes as no surprise the way things have gone. In a place as picturesque and up market as Helmsley, where it’s well kept, well heeled and with a very active policing of what’s going on, and what will be tolerated, it looks like the few have let the many down again.☹️
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Those 5 CLs are not in Helmsley, and anyone who knows the area well will tell you how many hills and how steep they are to get from a Site to the town centre.
The whole good thing about this little stop was it was a 250 metre, level stroll into the town square. Personally, I think they should have put a nominal fee on it, and it sort of indicates the naivety of the Council to not see how the proximity of the loos would lead to a few slopping out in there, but these last two years have tipped the balance from a small careful few users to a lot of new, hired, couldn’t give a damn types taking advantage. What the Council needs is some good workable advice to help with these issues, and fingers crossed it might just become available again.1 -
I would think that the figure you quote is way above what is the real figure
No your forgetting these are owners with, and I quote 70k to 80k luxuary vans
. I did say it was an average and I can vouch that some spend a lot more than £50.Steve, regardless of where you spend it on a tour it is going into the local economy and if you stop overnight you are more likely to spend within at least the area if not the very place you stopped at if it was close to outlets.
TDA the fact there were significant numbers of motorhomes at both D&G and Helmsey indicates there is a requirement for this type of overnight space.
peedee
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I think you are looking at it from a caravan perspective, as I will freely admit I did before I had a motorhome! Unless the CL's are within easy walking distance of the village I expect they would be shunned. Also some CL's are not always suitable for larger motorhomes. TDA's post was interesting as they obviously know the parking there. Even if you have sensible people who park correctly there are others, especially from overseas who are used to parking close together, who won't use common sense. There are also what would be described as "Van Lifers" people who live in van conversions who people tend to blame but many of them are very sensible and subscribe to the policy of, leave no trace. As with anything in life there is always a "bad element". Hopefully the Council will have a think about it and come to a compromise. I think a £10/15 a night would be a reasonable fee which would hopefully recover much of any costs the Council have to spend.
David
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There definitely is a need. We were very happy finding out what had been provided up in D&G, that little tour was a real eye opener for us, some aspects great, others not so good. We are hoping to do something similar in Northumberland and Borders, but provision South of Border seems limited to Forestry Car parks (which we will use at £10 per night). Intersperse this with some CLs, and we are looking at a £25 per night private site, so we are happy paying for locations we want, just hoping to achieve a reasonable average nightly fee.
Proper touring for us means finding a legal, safe place to sleep for the odd night where we are in transit to somewhere else. Hence we don’t need facilities or hook up, or any kind of services for one or two nights. We will alternate doing this with a longer stay on a CL or a private Site. Hence we aren’t happy to pay the big prices for a stay of eight hours using nothing. We will have four or five nights on a CL to look around an area, go to the beach, go cycling, explore, and know that the MH, and more importantly, our elderly pooch is safe. It’s the folks who are overstaying their welcome, treating such as Helmsley as a campsite that are the issue. We always make sure we shop local as well, to put something back into the local economy. And it won’t be a supermarket shop, but nice fruit and veg, deli goods, artisan ice cream, local tourist attractions.
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"lets take an arbitrary figure of £300 per night, maybe 2 sites total 20 units = £15 per unit."
lets not forget folks, my figures were based on 20 units per night anything less then obviously the price per unit would have to increase, and i was also very conservative on my £12 per hour for night workers, my friend says £15 per hour would be more realistic, especially if it was for just seasonal work.
As for the £50 spend per day, Wow!!!, we dont tend to count the pennies whilst we are away, but that seems to be an aweful lot, maybe on a couple of occasions, if we have a meal out in the evening.
Not carried out any sort of survey as to loss of business in the area as a result of the banning of overnight camping/sleeping in our car parks, but people i have spoken to in the area are pleased that they have got their beach side car parks back, even though we have seen an increase in residential parking.
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As for the £50 spend per day, Wow!!!, we dont tend to count the pennies whilst we are away, but that seems to be an aweful lot, maybe on a couple of occasions, if we have a meal out in the evening.
How would you know if you do not count the pennies, if you did you might be in for a surprise.
I broke down the cost of >my last tour< into site costs, fuel, and other expenses just to compare with "costs over there" and to provide feedback to CAMpRA as many others have done.
peedee
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How many times has it been posted as not to compare costs in other countries? With some of the costs here
Last time we were here there was a Dutch couple in their caravan with some relatives from Australia (they had been to the Commonwealth games) the Australians were commenting on how much cheaper it is in the UK than their country
Ps I think a quick look at your bank account would be a good place to start👍
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Local spend? We had two lovely nights on the Aire at Kircudbright. It was £10 per night, marked bays, hook up, drive over waste, hose and tap for filling up, cpd disposal. Fabulous views, 150 metres walk into a smashing town. We shopped, ate, and enjoyed visitor attractions, and I paid for a swim in the adjacent pool. We spent something like £200 in Kircudbright, and voted it the stay of our holiday. First night, some potential cheapskate tried to park up next to the three of us that were legally there. All three of us challenged his behaviour, told him he was on camera, gave him our opinion of his thieving and spoiling behaviour, and we all took details of his outfit, telling him to move on, or else we would pass onto those we thought needed it. He went, and good riddance.
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There are various types of motorhome owners including a group whose main aim is to spend nothing. The whole idea for them is not to pay. We know two couples like this, one lot went round Scotland last year and reported back on their "free" trip. A lot of effort goes into free trips and I think if you're using Aires and stop overs there will be a much broader mix of users which can make for uncomfortable situations and behaviour.
We noticed on the £10 stop over being used in Totnes that users ignored fire safety regs and some semi converted vans looked generally unsafe. Councils won't be able to spend extra money on checking who is legit or not.
It's great to have these stop overs but if they're funded by public money they could cost more than intended to the local people. So I'm not surprised by the OP.
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Agree Brue. It’s all about respect really. Respecting the place you visit and the locals, respecting the environment around you, respecting other users who might be there, respecting the efforts made on your behalf.
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"How would you know if you do not count the pennies, if you did you might be in for a surprise"
i have been on this planet for 75 years, am a Lancastrian, so know our daily spend give or take a few bob
"I broke down the cost of >my last tour< into site costs, fuel, and other expenses just to compare with "costs over there" and to provide feedback to CAMpRA as many others have done."
dont have a problem with this, I have our household budget in an excel spreadsheet, and i have to say with the increase in such necessities as diesel, ferry costs, travel/medical insurance we are sitting up and taking notice more, have not seen much of an increase in site fee's in Spain, as yet. Seldom use UK sites especially club sites, not a cost issue, they just do not have what i like e.g. swimming pool, with the exception of a couple.
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Spain apparently is bucking the energy cost rises that are hitting the rest of Europe badly, according to a report I saw yesterday.
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