Motorhome Parking in Helmsley
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If they spent a £lot bringing it up to high standards to wheedle out the miscreant users some would no doubt complain of the rising costs. Damned if they do Damned if they don’t🙁. They made a decision for the locals.
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Sadly we live in a society that tends to have an "I'm the centre of the universe and I'm the only one who matters" type of attitude. This pertains in many areas, not just a few rogue 'banners'.
We have a TV programme "Rip-off Britain" which highlights exploitation in many areas, so it is not altogether surprising that there is a push back by those looking to redress the balance where they can when faced with high costs merely to park somewhere for the night.
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I don't see it as any form of push back against exploiters. To look at it that way gives the miscreants an excuse they don't deserve.
Define 'high costs' as one person's high is another's reasonable but surely no decent person objects to paying a fair price and, certainly, no decent person abuses privileges. It is the minority who abuse and expect others to fund their lifestyle who wreck things for locals and other users.
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I do wonder just how small the minority is. In a recent survey, that I can’t now find, almost 50% of people said they had left litter on a beach. A figure which I find appalling, there is also a fair chance some said they hadn’t when they had.
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Who knows?🤷♂️ All we do know is that some people behave in appalling ways whether at park ups, beaches or wherever. It's shameful.
Mentioning beaches, a clean up exercise discovered bbq waste - meat wrappers, cans etc - buried on a beach. It must have taken more effort to do that then to carry it to the bin.
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Helmsley is the sort of place where bad behaviour from anyone wouldn’t go unnoticed, it’s a a gorgeous little place, with some fantastic shops, places of interest, eateries and nice places to stay. House prices are very expensive, people go to live there because it is so nice. It’s always neat, tidy and puts a well looked after and cared for face on for everyone. Hugely popular with tourists all year round. It’s provided a very large car park and award winning loos on its easily walked periphery, there’s lots more parking some days of the week actually in the town square. So it didn’t, and doesn’t really need to provide those overnight spaces for MH’s, but rather generously, back in 2017, it did, and free. I think all went reasonably well up to the pandemic, but we are all familiar with some of the issues that tourist centres have encountered this last couple of years. There are a lot of new to touring types out there, along with a lot more used to the freedom of Europe, and if you multiply this, you are bound to get a higher percentage willing not to follow the rules. Helmsley doesn’t need the hassle, if the park up’s are restored, it will be a very generous gesture from Ryedale Council, at a time when all council’s are struggling to provide services.
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Free camping used to be available in the Trossachs National Park until the behaviour got so bad you can now no longer camp in anything overnight without a permit and even then it is only in designated areas.
Making things free without any form of policing seems to always result in controls being introduced.
peedee
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I've got lots of stickers and permits on my MH - Umwelt, Crit-air, Angles Mort, C&CC, CMC to name but a few. If getting a permit to park in a designated area overnight in the UK was adopted, I would apply in an instant as long as the application fee was sensible.
I would also be happy to pay a reasonable overnight parking fee, say £12-15 ish, for a limited facilities space, but it would need to be at least 8 x 4 metres. None of this nonsense of having to pay for multiple "micro spaces" which then cost more than some campsites.
For me, the location of an aire near towns/attractions plus the ease of checking in and out are the key features which encourage me to use them.
Let's hope CAMpRA and the Camping-Car Parks initiatives bear fruit - the UK is way behind the rest of Europe in providing convenient locations for responsible MHers.
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"Let's hope CAMpRA and the Camping-Car Parks initiatives bear fruit - the UK is way behind the rest of Europe in providing convenient locations for responsible MHers."
i think the operative word is "responsible" surely the UK is not unique in providing irresponsible MH/Campervan owners, is it just that they are reported more in the UK?,
it would seem that almost every week there is a report in the UK press or even on this forum of bad behaviour by MH/Campervan owners in the UK.
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i think the operative word is "responsible" surely the UK is not unique in providing irresponsible MH/Campervan owners, is it just that they are reported more in the UK?,
Even the free Aires we have used over there, provide water / grey and black drainage / refuse. (Although there may be a small charge for fresh water) Even if you stop somewhere that doesn’t, service only Aires are available in many towns and villages. Even the despicable types that dispose of waste irresponsibly elsewhere, are likely to use the facilities if available.
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But how many of the culprits have actually been prosecuted for breaking the by-laws or parking regulations ? Very few I would guess, they are certainly not widely reported.
A concerted campaign to punish the irresponsible owners who flout the rules with as much publicity as possible on FB, Twitter and other popular media would hopefully get the message across.
LA's need to start punishing the culprits, not the majority of responsible users.
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Maybe it is more tolerated over there but there has been a tightening up of restrictions in recent years and I think it is still ongoing. I have never witnessed bad behaviour but I have seen evidence in laybys that it does happen but on Aires everyone seems to behave responsibly..
peedee
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"LA's need to start punishing the culprits, not the majority of responsible users"
Easier said than done, most LA's are strapped for cash, including Helmsly which is a very popular tourist area. As i highlighted earlier, costs to provide policing etc are quite high, we already have "enforcers" who tour car parks etc dishing out fines for non display of parking tickets, and they do some policing of illegal camping etc, but they are not 24x7.
After much debate and gnashing of teeth, our local councils decided that monies would be better spent erecting height barriers, installing parking meters ramming in bollards etc on green areas previously used by MH's/Campers, yes and the occasional caravan, rather than provide patrols 24x7 to police these areas.
Loss of revenue to local business, not if you look at the queues at the ice cream kiosks, and we have 6 in a radius of 1/4 miles
I took this photo today at approx 1400hrs when i went swimming, this is just one of our beach side car parks no height barrier, £1 per hour up to 5 hrs , note the lack of MH's.
pre car parking charges these bays would have been full with MH's costing upwards of £50k, daily spend, dont know, but they obviously dont want to spend £6, there are good facilities available with outside tap and cold shower, you can park for upto 12 hrs, charges are from 1000 hrs - 1800 hrs, this is typical now of all our carparks & along the prom which is also now PAD.
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In the Devon car park set ups people are asked to double space but are not double charged . The problem is that some are so desperate to get a space they'll ignore the spaces in between vans and use them. When I've looked at photos of some of the very popular French Aires I've noticed many are cramped with very close parking, no fire regs. It's good that safety and hygiene rules are being imposed here but it appears some just won't comply, sadly.
We have some excellent small CL, CS and THS sites in the UK so do have provision, the desire to overnight in a car park doesn't appeal to me but I'm thinking national permits might be a way forward? Or maybe that's too expensive an option in present times. Perhaps we should just make more use what we've got?!
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When's I've looked at photos of some of the very popular French Aires I've noticed many are cramped with very close parking,
Certainly the spacing wouldn’t meet the CAMC standards. However, even on the free Aires we used which were totally full, we had a bare van width in between. Personally we were happy with that, whilst it might not stop a fire spreading, it should certainly slow it up and allow escape. Any less than that and we would look elsewhere and that is of course the big difference. There are loads to choose from even in a fairly restricted area.
Possibly the issue here is that the larger space in between, allows the insertion of a MH where it shouldn’t go. Not possible when the space is narrower. OK if it’s policed but not if folk are left to there own devices.
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The Forestry Sites up in Scotland that we used asked MH owners to space out as well. Only the one charge. Huge car park, so shouldn’t be a problem, and wasn’t when we stayed, mind it was mid May.
But even with marked out bays, clear signage some were still shoe horning themselves into one or two other spots, way too close. One hired MH actually blocked access for everyone to the footpath exit at another Aire we used. She got aggressive when challenged as well. Such as shame, we said on leaving that we didn’t expect this lovely little place to still be there on our next visit if it was getting such abuse. We drove into a pitch bay, then used the picnic bench to fend off anyone trying to park next to us, it was that bad. One owner asked if he could block us in as he was only there one night and leaving early🤷♀️ Some out there on the road do beggar belief to be honest.
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Gloucester services gets a lot of praise. Here’s a photo of the spacing of their marked out bays - approved by the authorities . They clearly don’t think 6 metre spacing is required.
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Well maybe because it's a services car/caravan/MH park and not a campsite? What's the max stay at that place btw?
The 6m spacing applies in particular to campsites where people stay overnight. I know this has been pointed out before to this very same question.
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it probably has a caravan behind it Ruffs. It will be the parking for MH, cars+caravans... very similar to Wetherby services where one can drive in and straight out.
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It’s the best of the motorway services. But then that bar is set very low. I think it’s around £20 per night now, but a good nights sleep won’t be guaranteed. We wouldn’t use it for sleeping, prefer to find a proper CL just off M5.
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Thanks Steve.
Also I recall that it's all up to the site owner but some insurances won't cover sites if they don't have the 6m spacing?
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Yes it is certainly better and/or cheaper to use a local basic CL?
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Some European Aires have parallel parking to the kerb so they are much more spaced out albeit you step out into the road, although that won't be any busier than any other car park but of course it does take up much more space. We have been on a Stellplatz in Germany where they mark out the spaces by logs so still tight by CMC standards but a bit more feeling of space.
The problem is in the UK in trying to have a dual use for car parks, ie day time parking and overnight parking is how do you maximise space during the day but keep to more space between units at night. A bit of a difficult circle to square? On balance I think I would prefer the day time parking with perhaps the overnight parking being a bit further away if that was possible?
David
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This post is about car parks not sites. The Gloucester services photo I posted earlier shows that the regulations do not require 6 metre spacing in car parks.
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Excellent I'm glad you have grasped that now ET and we agree.
In any event it is up the parking/site owner to set the rules or take the risk.
And really what you actually posted was in relation to thinking:
...approved by the authorities . They clearly don’t think 6 metre spacing is required
Of course they don't as they would know the 6m rule doesn't apply here.
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