Dogs and Touring
Comments
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My observations over many years have shown me that some aren't aware that their dog is causing a nuisance to others by letting dogs wander on or off lead around sites. However there is a rule about short leads and sticking to the paths and also an acknowledgement that there can be "accidents." So most dog owners do their best and it's not something that I want to waste time observing. Responsible dog ownership brings pleasure to many individuals and families.
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We know you’re not a fan of dogs but have you never considered that charging could possibly encourage the attitude of ‘I’m paying so my dog can do what he likes'?
You seem to know a fair bit about dogs on club sites so I wonder if such a measure was introduced, would it mean you'd join CAMC and use club sites?
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Dogs on club sites were numerous when we were members and are almost certainly more evident these days.
If charging caused those with more than 3 dogs to stay away, wouldn't that be a win/win for most people?
Will we ever rejoin, only time will tell but, as DK mentioned, you do seem to see less dogs where they are chargeable.
Regarding your point could charging encourage the attitude you mentioned, why should it encourage the bad habits of 2 dog owners any more than now. As an avid litter picker I can assure you the number of poo bags lying around is so great that the problem is not caused by a small percentage of owners.
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So what percentage of dog owners do you think are irresponsible? Would a irresponsible dog owner take his dog out two or three times a day? - that seems like the actions of a responsible dog owner.
Wherever you visit in this country whether that is NT, beaches, towns, walks you'll always find signs saying " Pick up your dog waste and dispose of in a bin". They can't be just for a small percentage.
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AG I am amazed how you can state on one hand that you don't use club sites and have not for some considerable time, yet you then state somehow that there are more today than when you were members? How do you know this?
I have been on club sites for over 22, almost 23 years, and I haven't seen an increase in dog numbers over that time. Dogs have always been on club sites in good numbers, it's part of the fabric of club sites if you like, but problems are very few and far between and I personally have only been really 'inconvenienced' once by again bad owners, not bad dogs.
Actually more 'dog issues' happen off site when out for the day.
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I see an awful lot of speculation and guesswork there from one who is not a member and does not use club sites.
The same can be said of your assertion that the problem of poo bags lying around is not caused by only a small percentage of owners as you have absolutely no idea of how many owners do not cause problems. However, this issue seems to be drifting away from the topic of dogs and touring and the recent point about club sites.
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But what happens outside of club sites is for one thing irrelevant and for another you're trying to suggest that 'club dog owners' have the same characteristics as those outside? That in your words the 'percentages' are the same?
Are they? I would say not as a club site is a totally different place to a beach, town... Rules can not be easily enforced on them while they can be on a smaller enclosed space that is a club site. Also as I said before club dog owners are usually very good while I encounter poor ownership outside of sites.
You appear to have a issue with dogs anywhere?
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Mikey, how can you personally tell the difference between someone like me, who has at one time toured with three, quiet, well behaved, always exercised off the site dogs, and someone let’s say with one dog, that yaps constantly, goes for other passing by dogs, and the only walk it gets is round the back of the pitch, when the owner can drag themselves away from the TV?
How will charging me for three dogs, and the other owner for one make a blind bit of difference to the respective behavioural patterns🤷♀️ It’s been said umpteen times before, it isn’t the number of dogs, it’s the behaviour of the owners. Unless you are an out and out dog phobic, in which case that’s a totally different point of view, unlikely to tolerate dogs at all.
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Ttda ( and Tinners, Corners) - the full set today!! , As you have pointed out it is not a secret that dog ownership has increased during Covid, this has been widely reported in the Press and 3 of my close neighbours have acquired a dog during the past 18 months. It is not too much speculation that this increase in dog ownership will have also have spread to Club sites.
I hope you at least accept that charging for "more than 3 dogs" will probably result in less numbers on site.
Regarding behavioural patterns, last week we were sat outside a cafe in Anglesey ( part of a CL and Museum complex). Two customers arrived soon after us and sat at the next table. The four dogs sat under their table and there was always one at least barking. We moved to another table. Soon after more customers sat at tables either side of the dogs, within 10 mns they also moved. My point is I don't think one dog on its own would have barked but the likelihood of barking will multiply as the number of dogs increase. Similarly children seem to make more noise in a group than individually or in pairs.
I don't think the clientele on Club sites are any different from those you will find in the general population
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I think the maths expert is merely saying that the percentage of dog owners not Club members is greater than the percentage that are, so therefore you are more likely to encounter poor owner behaviour away from a site, in all sorts of environments, rather than on the more controlled site only environment. 🤷♀️
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Mikey, you know simply nothing about dogs. If a dog is trained not to bark, it won’t. If an owner doesn’t train it, or reinforces its barking behaviour, it will. It’s got nothing to do with the number of dogs.
I trained as a teacher, and trust me, if I wanted a class of 30 children to shut up and listen, they did. It’s not the numbers, it’s the training.
Like you, we would have moved. I find dogs that bark constantly very annoying. Different if the owner is trying to train it I might add, but ignoring it is wrong.
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"…the full set today!!"
Just what is that supposed to mean? Are you counting or is it a case of you posting in the hope certain posters would respond? I think that's called fishing.
Tbh, Burts, someone who has regularly posted in an anti dog way and frequently referred to "packs of dogs" doesn’t have a lot of credibility in a reasoned discussion where we all agree that some dog owners act irresponsibly. No one will defend them and anyone can see that the club welcomes dogs because it’s a good business move and even this club is unlikely to be daft enough to change that.
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Not sure what the full set and two exclamation marks has to do with it or what you're trying to say with that Arthur?
You're really pushing the boat out with these puzzling speculation or extrapolations, and changing your goal posts, and trying to prove one thing with another.
So dog ownership has increased but does that mean that those with one dog (or two which appears your limit before charging) has added an extra dog? Any data on that?
Also the relevant question is are those who have got a dog recently own a caravan or MH?
More than three dogs, I though you said charge for more than two? Now it's three? What's your limit in truth? No I don't accept that at all, those who love and care for their dogs will pay to have them with them. As you're comparing children with dogs would charging more for children mean that there will be less children on site?
And no children do not always make more noise in a group, at playtime yes, in a classroom no. What perhaps you need to understand is that dogs (and children) make noise and/or bark when they are not properly supervised or have not been trained. It is the owner that was allowing the situation you described.
I don't think the clientele on Club sites are any different from those you will find in the general population
I assume you're joking here, first and foremost of all does everyone in the general population have a (usually expensive) caravan, tow car or MH? The age profile is the same on club sites as the general population? No of children, Earnings, number of dogs... the list just goes on.
I think perhaps you do have an issue with children and dogs?
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And you also see in any new areas please put your litter in the bins provided and that is not directed at dog owners
With the proliferation of dog ownership that has come about with the lockdown and working from home many more Hospitality venues it seems are now accepting man's best friend as part of their acceptance of visitors
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And all children and awnings and metered electricity and extra water….
It’s nothing to do with inclusivity, Husky.
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I'm lost here HD.
How is charging for something or someone that was free make the club more inclusive? Inclusion means not excluding anyone who could take part and removing any barrier to them taking part.
Charging may lead to less people being able to bring their dogs with them and therefore excluding them?
Post edit: if you mean all inclusive like an all-inclusive holiday then once again once you start charging for something extra that is already free then it's no longer 'all-inclusive' in the price?
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I am temporarily closing this discussion pending review as we have received several reports.
Please all abide by our Community Guidelines or it may well result in your access to Club Together being removed. We need the forum to be a friendly forum free from arguments.
Many thanks.
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An interesting post given that this thread was started by Ro to give dog owners a chance to exchange information about dogs enjoying their holidays on Club or CL sites and any complaints should be directed to the club directly.
I do not see what the numbers of dogs on site has to do with it. More dogs does not necessarily result in more noise or disturbance, it all depends on how well trained the dog is. We have been out all day today with our dog, including going for a meal in a dog friendly café. It was only when we had finished our meal that the waitress noticed her laying under the table and she is not a small dog.
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