New Site Booking System
Comments
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I think the important point here is that it really has little to do with "selfish behaviour" of a subset of people. Cancelling whether because of a bereavement or because you don't like the weather forecast has exactly the same impact on others, after all. Most people believe their own justification to be fair whilst those of others must surely be selfish.
The incentives put in place by the rules of the system are what is important. Human behaviour is inherently selfish and subject to bias. There's an entire branch of mathematics and logic devoted to the design of systems which account for this - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game_theory
The outcomes of changes to even simple systems can be very difficult to predict, which is why they are best done incrementally.
The particular problem with not refunding the deposit is the cognitive bias against giving up something of value (even if it has no value to you) once you have paid for it.
There's a famous example of a study (can't find the link now) which found that late pick-up fines charged by nurseries massively increased the number of late pick-ups because parents no longer felt bad about being late, as they were paying for the "service".
You get what you incentivise!
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I think the key to the *Do I cancel within 21 day limit & lose the 20% deposit * as already been discussed on the forum, either on this thread or another.
Basically don't cancel through the website or app but phone the relevant site staff direct, then amend your dates accordingly if availability is still there for an alternative period , the deposit should be heldover for your new arrival date.(That's how the C&CC booking system works too. )
Apparently this way was also mentioned to change your pitch type first selected (ie swapping from grass to HS or vice visa) on the original booking, but it'll only work if your new choice is still available.
We wasn't going to make any bookings till after April when the new system starts & see how it actually runs , but have now made one booking for October to a site we visit that time every year , with the knowledge we should be able to change basic details with site staff if required.
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Agree with that but that wasn't my point, it was not about cancelling with 21 days it was about just not turning up, not telling anyone, and just losing £25, which is my view isn't that much to lose.
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Neither do I AD, for us it was a very unique, and much appreciated USP, as given that I am caring for someone, meant that if required I could cancel at three days notice and let someone rebook my cancellation. In eight years of caring, we have cancelled just the once. Anything else was cancelled weeks before, but even those instances, over a 20+ year period could be counted on one hand. We aren’t willing to give the Club any freebies, so for us, we shall either pick up late bookings, or go elsewhere. Not much hardship, as Club Sites are never our first choice beyond an event, or maybe a cheap stay like Marazion.
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The club can’t manage the current system dealing with bookings without all the different pitch types etc and as for cancellations the club need to put their own house in order as the two threatening emails I have had re cancellation inside the 72 hours were actually the club cancelling my booking due to flooding and pitch availability due to weather conditions on neither occasion were we informed prior to cancellation it was just by chance we saw Tewkesbury flood on the morning news the day we were travelling.
I am totally confused as to how they will handle pitch bookings particularly in the first stage were there will be a mix of bookings prior to new system and the bookings after the new system comes in.
What happens, as at my age I consider I am on the final lap if I die within the 21 days I won’t rest in peace if I lose my deposit.
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Morning
Could you possibly explain the content of the "threatening" emails you received please? I ask because in the past I've purposely cancelled a booking within the 72 hours just to see what comms. you get. The email I got was far from threatening in my opinion, just an automated reminder of a late cancellation.
2020/21 there was a communication regarding ignoring those late cancellations emails due to possible last minute track and trace isolations.
JK
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There'd be no one to haunt if they're all working from home
JK
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If you're giving it away Corners my address is .................North Devon.
JK
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please post your bank details and it's yours
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Borrowdale wrote "
There's a famous example of a study (can't find the link now) which found that late pick-up fines charged by nurseries massively increased the number of late pick-ups because parents no longer felt bad about being late, as they were paying for the "service".
You get what you incentivise!"
Then if the plan is to discourage 'late' cancellations/no shows, the penalty, as Corners observes, needs to be greater than £25 and sufficient to achieve the objective.
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Don't forget that £25 is the minimum unless the one night fee is less. 20% of a two week booking would be a decent incentive in my opinion.
JK
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I suppose those who think that some will surrender the deposit rather than let the site know are probably thinking of weekends rather than longer holidays?
David
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Quite easy to tweak the system and have the stay paid in full 21 days before arrival or if booked within those 21 days then pay in full. It's what other sites do as a rule and certainly what I would expect from hiring a cottage or apartment for a stay.
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I can imagine the competition are looking at these changes with glee, a club with over a million members,18 million booked nights a year and a £100+ millon turnover changing its rules and booking systems to be the same or stricter than theirs, what an opportunity for them with so many dissatisfied members with very little reason to stick with the CMC sites.
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I thought at first that too but the club's booking conditions are still pretty good. I was looking at an old club site that is now independent and they want all the money up front, many others want a deposit which is not refundable, and/or will charge an admin fee per night if you cancel. And really you can book now under the old T&C for all of this year and till April 2023.
The club's 21 days and all monies refunded is still 'good' compared to others, though I wish the current system didn't have to go.
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I can guarantee that their customers do not pay an annual fee for the the privilege to do so ...
Lost me there on your point, what privilege? it's just as expensive (actually the club site is a few pounds less) as neighbouring club sites, takes all your money up front rather than 20%? No one if forced to pay the club membership or prices
No matter after all it's all personal preference, and I'd rather pay a membership fee and have not have to pay the full price for a site many months ahead but if anyone sees any advantage in that (and I can't) use those sites, simples really.
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We won't know whether the change has been a success or perhaps more importantly accepted by Club members until at least this time next year. What we don't know is whether all the bookings the Club get are due to currently being deposit free or whether people genuinely prefer Club sites and the services it offers? Cynics will say that it can't possibly be the latter but I suspect that under estimates the loyalty of many Club members. Even with a deposit Club sites will still be a more acceptable proposition to many than having to pay a higher deposit on a commercial site and usually the need to pay in full six weeks before arrival. So we may be surprised at fairly trouble free change over from one system to the next. If we manage to do what we want to this year it looks as if we will be using more commercial sites but that is not a result of the CMC changing their methods but more to do with sites being where we want them to be.
David
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Yes I agree.
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Will we really ever know, will there be a full cost analysis in 12-24 months time, I dont think so especially with the pandemic to cloud things, it has to be a success whatever or someone has to stand up and say it was a mistake, in my experience that never happens but I do hope the club does publish a full analysis and proves it was a great success and more than compensates the the cost of introduction and running costs.
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Do we need to know? Cost analysis, facts and figures are the province of the club management and, as end users, surely our only concerns need be that the club remains solvent and the system is acceptable for us to use? Sometimes people can become overly concerned about such issues.
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Is that how it happened with the name change🤔. I’m struggling to think of any company publishing facts relating to a similar operational change tbh🤷🏻♂️
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I completely agree JV, we’ve been part of that entitlement for years tbh👍🏻. The folk who’ve been on CT demanding the pitch thieves are stopped came first now we’ve got the other side demanding proof it’s been a good thing that the stopping of the ‘pitch thieves’ has been made. PS-is it really a ‘club’ in the Olde Worlde description or just in name only🤷🏻♂️🤔
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Yes I agree, being members doesn't mean we have to know or are entitled to such things, would being members of a local gym mean you would?
Myself I'm just interested in getting a pitch and the club keeps to its high standards.
More sites would be good too.
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Are you a member of a gym? I am. I pay for an annual membership. I book as many classes as I like, free. I do not pay a deposit or the total up front. So, if my gym was to change the T&C's without consulting me, believe me, they would be challenged exactly the same way.
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After numerous requests in the past ,for information about cancelations ,it is only in the past few weeks that it seems to justify ,what was in the past not a problem for the club , ,which it seems now is a problem ? or as posted by those good at figures, more of an attempt to justify the implementation of of a system that is only wanted by the vocal minority ?
The social club side of our local cricket club ,who we pay an annual membership, always asks the membership what they think before anything major the committee are contemplating ,and any comments or objections to anything else, it is what would be expected of any democratic club
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