Caravan Sites and Control of Development Act, 1960
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TW, whether or not a certificated location/site is limited to members only is down to an agreement between the site owner and the organisation issuing the certificate. C&MC have stated in a previous thread they do not allow none members and presumably this is agreed with all CL owners. The limitation is not part of the 1960 act and it is down to each oraganisation to decide if they wish to limit sites to members only.
peedee
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I’m with you👍🏻 Crossed wires🙂
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That’s not as I remember, PD, but I’m not in a position to check right now.
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I suppose if C&MC wanted to it could apply for a camping exemption (it current does not hold this while the C&CC does) to allow CL owners with room to have tents. That would be one way of possibly growing membership and allowing CL owners to expand????
Ooops, correction, I have just checked and the C&MC does hold a camping exemption certificate as well as those held under the 1960 act.
peedee
P.S. camping exemption certificates are issued under Section 269 of the Public Health Act 1936
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Hi Allan, if some of the six units on site were motorhomes then it may be that things there were legal. It is possible that the figure five in the 1960 Act only applies to caravans - not to parking of motor vehicles.
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It is possible that the figure five in the 1960 Act only applies to caravans - not to parking of motor vehicles.
An interesting interpretation. Possibly more the letter than the spirit of the legislation.
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as above, with the references to being members or not (it's not a requirement with Nightstops) and to the interpretation of 'caravan', whilst not being able to check the wording in the Nightstops certificate, is says clearly on its website that the sites are limited to five 'Motorhomes'....very clearly worded.
so, again as Peeedee points out, each granting organisation can set its own parameters yet still remain within the law.
hence its perfectly possible for any of these groups to apply for a minor change should this be desired....
however....tents on a CL.....oooooh
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We were on a CL couple of weeks ago and there were 7 units in the Field which was large and still loads of room so no complaints from me. However one MH belonged to the owner and was just parked, another one was empty as the owner had driven to Ipswich to watch Ed Sheeran so was not staying in his van but asked to just park ti there whilst at the gig before returning and continuing his holiday the next day. so what looked like a CL with too many vans on did not in reality....
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Hi euror, at least one was. MH. My thinking is that many will be considering the words guidance/rules/wise men/fools.
Never had to make the decision but can see reasons why it would happen.
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So what? I doubt you car is shown on its V5 as 'support vehicle' 🙄😤
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No misinterpretation on my part, JV. Just sick of the same old.😬
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We were on a CL last week that on average (for a week) had 8 units on it and for one night had 10 - yes TEN - the owner happily told me she never turned anyone away as there was "plenty of space". If we were to report this to the club would they actually do anything about it ?
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Yes the club would at least investigate and may well act in accordance with the notes that appear on the certificate.
We as members can quibble and quarrel all we like about the 5 van rule and nothing is going to change. If a group of CL owners made representation would anything change, probably not. So that leaves owners with two solutions, the status quo or apply for planning to become commercial
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You’ve surely read Maddie's posts in the various CL threads explaining the implications of this act of greed by the CL owner. Report it for all our sakes.
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Can someone explain exactly what the rules/law is vis a CL having a "rally" effectively on the CL - does this in any way legally circumvent the 5 van limit ?
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They may have separate permission, I suppose. That’s a question for the experts to answer.
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this possibly looks like the section under which 'exempted organisations' can hold rallies, THS etc...
"Sites occupied and supervised by exempted organisations
Subject to the provisions of paragraph 13 of this Schedule, a site licence shall not be required for the use as a caravan site of land which is occupied by an organisation which holds for the time being a certificate of exemption granted under paragraph 12 of this Schedule (hereinafter referred to as an exempted organisation) if the use is for purposes of recreation and is under the supervision of the organisation."
i couldn't find (who could....?) a reference to max duration or numbers for these but I know some THS meets go on for several weeks and can have many vans....perhaps 28 days?
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It is 28 days BB. This explains a little more, and lists some of the Clubs and Exempted Organisations that are members. Note that under the News section CAMoGG, newly formed, are welcomed. 😁
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It should be noted there are 4 types of exemption certificates that can be applied for.
1. Sites Occupied & Supervised by Exempted Organisations.. this covers temporay sites established for events. As TTDL says maximum of 28 days
2.Sites Approved by Exempted Organisations... covers certificate sites and locations
3.Meetings Organised by Exempted Organisations.. covers rallies limited to a maximum duration of 5 days.
The above three are covered by the 1960 act.
4. Camping e.g. tents
covered by a 1936 act
The C&MC holds all 4 and unlike some organisations these are permanent and they do not have to renew these.
Hope this helps clarify.
peedee
P.S. other conditions may apply in Scotland and Wales e.g. I don't think the camping exemption applies in Scotland.
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Hi All,
The Caravan and Motorhome Club CL exemption is for 5 vans (Caravan, Motorhome or trailer tents). We only allow the use of pup tents (which are small single berth tents which is regarded as part of the outfit), but no other form of tents or camping is permitted on our CL's.
We have many CL owners with a large amount of land and we only designate and certificate an area as the CL site. The owners are able to use the rest of their land for other activities as long as it does not impact/intrude on the CL site and they are able to meet certain criteria set out by the Club.
Rallies/Festivals are strictly forbidden on CL sites and the owners cannot temporarily close the CL to hold an event on the area that we have certificated.
As previously mentioned on other threads, all CL Sites should only ever have a maximum of 5 vans on site at all times. There are no exceptions to this. Having more than 5 vans on site not only puts their own CL certificate in jeopardy and raises questions about the safety of our members whilst on site but it also risks the Club’s exemption to be able to certificate all of our CL’s.
We appreciate some members are happy to ignore extra vans for fear of losing a good site and we work very hard to keep existing sites but we have a duty of care to all parties that the 5 van rule is not abused and that we do not lose our exemption. Any breach of our guidelines is taken very seriously by the Club and we have closed CL's in the past for abusing this rule.
When an applicant applies for a CL it is made clear to them that the income from these sites will not be substantial and that they need to take into consideration the cost of setting up and running the site.
We will happily work with CL owners who wish to extend their pitching by getting a commercial licence from their local authority as well as keeping their CL site wherever we can.
I hope this has answered everyones questions.
Thanks
Maddie
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Sorry Maddie - you haven't answered my question, raised in this thread and that entitled "Crowded Out". I and a number of other members have come across sites that - according to what the owners tell us - are operating as two CLs, side by side - thus having up to 10 vans on site at any one time.
I didn't have a problem with the site I stayed on - there was more than enough room across 2 acres - but the demarcation between the two 'sites' was nothing more than a small fence and a few bits of newly planted hedging. To all intents and purposes, it was one large site.
All the facilities - and the entrance, were shared between the two.
Are owners - or different members of the same family / residence allowed to operate two sites in this manner?
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Can I ask if "CL Sites should only ever have a maximum of 5 vans on site at all times" means five OCCUPIED caravans, or five physical caravans.
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