Interesting petition
Comments
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The general view of many of us living here in Cornwall is that motorhomers bringing their own provisions and sleeping in car parks would not contribute much to the local economy.
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Well said👍🏻
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Maybe a misguided and blinkered view?
There are some who would do that I agree but the vast majority would spend something in supermarkets (we can only carry so much food), petrol stations, pubs, restaurants etc. There are lots of pubs now offering overnight parking, some charge and some are free, the free ones expect but cannot enforce someone to spend in the pub, it may be food and drink or maybe a pint or 2 but it is extra revenue.
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There are some who would do that I agree but the vast majority would spend something in supermarkets (we can only carry so much food), petrol stations, pubs, restaurants etc. There are lots of pubs now offering overnight parking, some charge and some are free, the free ones expect but cannot enforce someone to spend in the pub, it may be food and drink or maybe a pint or 2 but it is extra revenue.
Agree that there are pubs that do that but not many in or close towns as such. No turning space and usually plenty of custom. Similar with restaurants.
There are doubtless some reasonable LA provision for overnight parking in some areas.
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Why so aggressive M it was only an observation . Calm down. !!.
In answer to your question, After around 20 years of continental touring including France, Germany, Andorra and Spain where I discovered the joys of Aires de Camping cars, I decided that the return journey of around 1000 miles from home to to ferry ports in the south of the UK was becoming non cost effective so modified my linear touring to the UK including the Northern and Western Islands (areas which I really love)
So you see it is more friendly to post without aggression.
BTW if my home was in the south of the UK I would still be touring in the area you love to call " Over There "
Your Friend Kennine
PS .I am convinced that the introduction of Aires in the UK would greatly enhance the touring experience of those who tour by campervans and Motorhomes.
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Why so patronising, K? I'm perfectly calm as I've told you before when you adopt that rather condescending tone.
Read back through this thread - I've been perfectly clear about the fact that my issue isn't about the benefits or otherwise of what's being asked for, it's about the petition itself. Whereas it seems you want to make out there is a major disagreement. There's not - get over it! Let's have no more rubbish about some mythical "5 negative posters" or caravanners not wanting "pesky motorhomers on their sites" (I'm sure you recognise the source of those quotes). If others who have advocated the establishment of Aires can discuss this reasonably why not try it yourself? (In the interests of forum harmony, obviously! )
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No BB, it was there for you to read too👍🏻,PD’s-“I wonder why?” So I answered it. Those posts are way better than the bickering I think👍🏻😊
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I have just looked at Canterbury City Council web site, because I hadn’t realised my local tax was providing Aires. There are several. New Dover Rd park and ride offers secure motor home parking, water, toilet, black and grey waste disposal and use of the park and ride service for £3.50 per day. Max. 3 days.
Another Site in the City centre is £15 for 12 hours, max . 24 hours.
There are others, this will probably catch on without the club getting involved.
Ken
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Siting the Aires within an out of town park and ride is a totally different and I would think a viable concept. BB specifically mentioned town centres. Think more Baltic Wharf area, rather than the P&R almost at Keynsham. You are lucky to get town centre parking in popular spots for £4 a day, which is why I questioned if LA's would be motivated to provide the facility. Although MH's spend in the local economy, they also bring many provisions with them. Four cars parked in the same area would probably benifit the economy significantly more.
Don't get me wrong I am certainly not anti Aire provision. If we make the switch I can certainly see us using them, particularly in France. However, I am afraid I just can't see why any LA would want to provide one in a town centre environment, at a cost folk would be prepared to pay.
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Here's something to ponder.
What if caravanners said "there aren't enough stopping points for us, we don't want to drive all over the place, we want to be close to towns and tourist hotspots, we don't want to be on sites miles from anywhere and have to use our cars."
The inconvenience is virtually the same for all drivers. the fact that you've got a bed on board a motorhome doesn't really make you any more in need of special parking spaces does it? Surely you looked into how you would use it and the drawbacks, just like caravanners do.
We've got a motorhome, this means we will have to get in it and drive it if we want to visit places. There are already overnight parking facilities around, night stops, some LAs, some pubs etc. If these are proving viable there might be more in the future. Am I going to demand or petition that the club does something about it to get more, no. I will let supply and demand work.
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With a motorhome the 'inconvenience' is far greater in many towns. With a car you can drive in and park.
From Cotswolds District Counclil:-
Motorhome parking
The Council has one off street car park that is able to accommodate motor home style vehicles; unfortunately this does not include overnight stays.The site is Maugersbury Road car park, Stow-on-the-Wold, GL54 1AQ.
If this car park is not convenient, please try the Waterloo- Cirencester GL7 2PY, or Beeches - Cirencester GL7 1BW, car parks. If your camper van occupies more than one space, you must purchase a ticket equivalent to the number of spaces taken.
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There are of course more considerations than the financial aspect alone. There is location with regard to residential properties and possible noise nuisance, the desirability of having larger vehicles use certain roads, misuse by undesirables, manouvering space. This would rule out some town car parks but some would no doubt be possible to be used. In Chester it would rule out all city car parks and if not multi storey have height barriers. All those that I can recall have a barrier system as well.
For motorhomes there are the 4 park and ride car parks or the Little Roodee car park just outside the walls which permit overnight stays.
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We always pay for 2 spaces in a pay and display car park- we actually need 1.5 lengthwise. However if we can park at the edge and overhang, not a pathway!, we pay for 1.
I can't see any problem using an existing car park and charging overnight fee should folks wish to avail themselves. I think the no overnight parking exists in many places for a different reason. Maybe it is easier to move folks on with this provision? I know not.
Not sure about using such facilities but some MH parking provision close to sightseeing and towns would be wonderful. We are quite happy to use public transport, shanky's pony or bikes as well as our motorhome!
How it can be said we bring less to the local economy than caravanners who can equally bring a stock of food I know not.
Sadly there will always be those who litter, just look at the amount of rubbish even where bins are provided 😲 be they vehicle drivers or pedestrians. But providing somewhere to park and dispose of waste shouldn't be a problem. In NZ there are dump stations, generally free, in most places but often in fuel stations. Another revenue stream?
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I would say the financial aspect would have to cover a variety of things, not just parking. Often car parks are closed overnight because of the need for human input during the day, checking tickets, collecting rubbish, cleaning etc. Plus all the things mentioned above, anti social behaviour for instance, much depends on the area. But there are places which will no doubt be suitable.
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dont come to Stokes Bay area, Gosport bourough council, they have recently put up notices in the car parks that i have visited saying "no camping/human habitation, and some have 2.5m barriers. In one car park there are a number of reserved bays for vehicles over 2.5m but you have to pay normal car park rates and from what i can see they are mainly used by cars with roof racks. Further down the road in Lee on Solent, Fareham bourough council rules are not quite so stringent, in fact most car parks are free and out of season allow long term parking of upto 7 days, but they will become more stringent due to many complaints re MH's, for many of the reasons mentioned in other posts, and in my experience some owners are most rude, e,g, they bog 2 bays overlooking the sea, use 1 for their deck chairs and then get upset when you ask them to move, I cycle between these 2 areas every day so i see what i see. Not saying caravaners are whiter than white but i dont think they are as conspicuous as 8 MH's bogging 8 sea view pitches in the local car park.
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Many thanks for your feedback and for highlighting the petition to the Club.
We do consider motorhome owners when designing, re-designing and reviewing sites for acquisition – looking at the availability of public transport and proximity to local amenities among other things. Many of our existing sites were acquired decades ago when demands from members were different. But as these sites remain popular despite some of them being in locations away from towns, it makes no sense to sell them. We install hardstandings and motor van waste points on all sites as a matter of policy, and we will continue to review what is needed by our members in the future. The Club is a ‘broad church’ and that’s why we try to meet all members’ needs wherever we can. The whole purpose of our name change and revised values is to ensure we do a better job on an ongoing basis of catering for owners of motorhomes as well as caravans.
There is arguably scope and demand for another level of stopover, along the lines of a French Aire. However, the establishment of these would have a cost, and there would be planning approval challenges and UK safety requirements (minimum fire safety separation distances for instance) to overcome. It’s worth debating whether the provision of such facilities should be the responsibility of an organisation like the Club, or whether local authorities should mainly provide them (as is the case in some other countries – France and Australia, for instance). There are already some examples of this in the UK, although some of them operate without compliance with the safety separation distances that those same local authorities would insist on for site operators like the Club.
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No axe to grind either way, being a caravanner and I cannot speak for all geographical areas, but around my location (albeit not on my immediate doorstep) there seems to be an ongoing issue with illegal overnight stays (mostly for several nights, until legal redress is gained) by the traveller community, sometimes in public car parks, as well as grass areas in residential districts and also commercial/business car parks etc.
Its difficult to see, how, if public car parks were able to be used overnight by motor-homers (as has been suggested by earlier posts), the distinction between the legal and illegal stays would be managed by local authorities. Even if one sought to have a 24 hour maximum, the fact remains that if current parking restrictions are ignored as they are, the same would surely again happen.
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...Ro, are you saying that the LA for Canterbury has allowed the narrow spacing at the Aire but insists on the club using '6&3' spacing for 'proper' sites in that area, incl some CC ones?
if so, it's because they 'make the rules' and can allow what they like.
maybe they've realise that overnight parking isn't 'camping' and therefore different to what goes on at a campsite.
this is certainly the case in France (Aires don't generally allow chairs, tables, awnings etc to be deployed) and I guess Canterbury from the photos....no room...
so, although I'm not suggesting the club looks to provide the space as the cost is too great, nor to sell any sites, but I also don't think what you've stated re spacing would necessarily be a show stopper....it's already happening....
what I do support though, is the club being positive about the provision of more simple stopping places (as in your post) but to be positive enough to engage with the petitioner and see if there is anything the club can do (from a lobbying standpoint) to support the premise with advice to the petitioner if it becomes the thing to work with LAs...the more logical avenue for (low cost) provision....
thanks for the input.
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Ian, on page 15 I posted a picture of a simple aire, 17 spaces, operated by barrier and paid for by card...those who don't pay don't get in.
there are rules regarding duration (varies with season) and those overstating will be removed...
ive got no problem with barriers as long as they allow e try to those who wish to use (and pay for, if required) the facilities in accordance with the regs.
what I don't agree with is a barrier keeping out decent law abiding customers just because we (as a nation) don't have the balls to sort out those who feel the rules don't alp ply to them....
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Its difficult to see, how, if public car parks were able to be used overnight by motor-homers (as has been suggested by earlier posts), the distinction between the legal and illegal stays would be managed by local authorities. Even if one sought to have a 24 hour maximum, the fact remains that if current parking restrictions are ignored as they are, the same would surely again happen.
On the Chester Little Roodee site the exit barrier requires payment to operate. It is overlooked by CCTV. The charge depends on length of stay
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I just had a word with my line manager and told her about this petition and all these replies, and how, if only we spent £50,000 on a Motorhome, we could then spend all our future holidays in car parks.
I told her it would be called linear touring but she thinks I am mad and is threatening divorce.
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But as prevision made not a problem for MHs
