Caravan build quality
I bought an Elddis Xplore 304 in April 2013 from Glossop Caravans. At just over a year old, stepping into the shower, I stood on the plughole area. With a load crack, it split, all around the plughole. With it being just out of warranty, I had to use the “expectation of use” and “of merchantable quality” to get Elddis to repair it free of charge.
In April of last year, an area of soft floor was reported during the annual service. It was now 4 years old, but it had obviously been less when it started. A subsequent full assessment found that virtually the whole of the floor area was suffering from delamination.
This is a known problem, confirmed by Glossops, and numerous examples on forums with some caravans as little as two years old having the problem.
Despite my best efforts of quoting “expectation of use” and “of merchantable quality”, Elddis/Glossops would not do the repair free of charge, so I ended up paying nearly £500 for the repair.
This problems would seem to be the result of manufacturers striving to reduce the weight of their caravans by using materials that aren’t up to the job. This is all very well, but why should we have to pay when these materials fail?
Comments
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Unfortunately a few caravans suffer from damp and/or delamination. Nobody knows what percentage as there are no proper surveys and of course those who suffer are more vocal than those who have not had any problems.
Our Bailey Valencia twice went back to the factory for damp floor and was gone for several months all together. When we sold it to a dealer at 4 years old it was resold but without the Bailey warranty being continued due to lack of information passed on by the dealer. When extensive damp was discovered for the third time the unfortunate private buyer was faced with a bill of £5,500 of which the dealer would only pay £1000 due to the limited warranty provided.
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We had an Explore 402. At 18 months old it was leaking in three separate places. The build quality was atrocious. The dealer tried to convince us that Eldiss are the best. If he is right, I hate to think what the others are like. We swapped it for a Coachman which was far better apart form seat cushions which did not fit together properly to make a double bed.
We are now switching to a motorhome and hope for better construction.
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We had both rear and front panels replaced under warranty after the first service, rear was 100% damp due to insufficient sealant around the central rear light. The front panel had numerous cracks just above the front locker, Elddis’ initial solution- put a decal over it. Eventually they agreed to replace the panel under warranty. The dealer was very difficult to deal with.
Second service reported as ‘no issues’ fingers crossed. Won’t buy another Elddis again or buy from the dealer.
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"Nobody knows what percentage as there are no proper surveys and of course those who suffer are more vocal than those who have not had any problems."
This of course is true, for us the end users.
IMO it is not so for the dealers that “handle” the cases nor the makers they refer back to who pick up or not, the claims made of them. I am quite sure the industry knows the situation very well.
At the begining of the century this club did a series of very revealing caravan owners surveys and published them. For the UK builders and the final owners it made quite appalling reading; some foreign builders came out significantly better.
We are left to wonder, or otherwise, why the Club never again repeated that invaluable service to its membership!
Belonging to a rallying community one “hears” of issues, sadly too many. From that and from the above mentioned surveys I am left in little doubt that the damp and other major issues in UK built caravans is widespread, its not the few odd percentage.
I suspect it can be argued the surveys were of technology now approaching two decades old, and today the failure rate is lower; but the info on the ground paints just as bad a picture as ever.Then those who rally tend to “use” their vans, so actually "using them" one would expect problems.
It is IMO an industry way overdue the need for a very big quality related and end user interfacing shake up. I don't see it coming as many owners in my own circle, buy the same product and issues time and again.
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"Nobody knows what percentage as there are no proper surveys and of course those who suffer are more vocal than those who have not had any problems."
I would have thought that the manufacturers and dealers would know as they carry out and bear the cost of the warranty claims. Once vans are outside of the warranty period that’s a different matter.
Our floor failed just before a year old. From the research I’ve been able to ascertain this is a known problem for Quasar based vans. For me it’s once barren twice shy
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The inconsistent quality of UK manufacturers is a problem when compared to the automotive industry which is vastly larger and where there is an oversupply of vehicles.
Due to the current growth in caravan sales with almost all production sold, there is little incentive for the uk manufacturer's to improve.
Add in the rise of the Euro since the Brexit vote means that mid/top range foreign built vans are not competitive in price anymore.
We have had 4 new vans since 2011, each one of them with either minor or major bodywork- construction issues.
The Elddis before last had a factory approved 'Heath Robinson' duct tape solution to repair cracks above the gas locker door poorly applied by a 'technician' who made unsightly cuts into the ABS moulding with a craft knife while trimming the tape _ that was the final straw to get rid of it.
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Alutech - All Lashed Up technology
SMART - Stupid marketing and reliability techniques
SOLID - Soggy or lets in damp
Coachman ABC - All Blooming Crap
You can't beat a good acronym.
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"Alutech - All Lashed Up technology"
careful, CY, you'll have JVB all over your case......
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....Junior Vicepresident, Bailey perhaps?
...obviously only kidding, JVB, we love you really
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When the manufacturer has no quality control, when the dealer is paid to do a PDI ( That doesn't happen ) how can we expect caravans to be of merchantable quality the day we pick them up.
I have stated on many forums for years now ( having been told be a dealer friend ) the P.D.I. is carried out by the owner on his/her first couple of outings, you may well find 10 problems with your new hard earned purchase, 4 or 5 of these problems you may well correct yourself with screwdriver and pliers, other problems you will contact the " Oh that's no problem Mr Soap, contact our service dept' and she'll book you a date to bring it in ".
Then when this happens you may well be told they are waiting for the go ahead from the manufacturer to carry out the work under warranty.
It doesn't stop there, you may then be told " It has to go back for a factory repair ".
Why we accept this saga is beyond me, esp' as we are not offered a " courtesy caravan whilst our 'van is off the road for maybe months on end.
BTW : We since 2000 have purchased 7 new 'vans from our dealer friend without problems, our last 2 purchased from others have proved to be a big mistake !
Happy caravanning.
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As long as there are people repeat buying dubious quality caravans from the likes of Bailey and others, nothing will improve regarding build quality. Until buyers give those manufacturers a huge bodyswerve for a few years and their profit margins dwindle to nothing they will continue churning out vans of questionable quality.
A countrywide owners survey would highlight the manufacturers to avoid. This survey should be carried out by an independent organisation, not any organisation which has association with manufacturers.
K
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K, in the MH world it's certainly happening....
apart from the top line marques like those from the Hymer stable (Hymer, N+B, Dethleffs, Laika etc), Carthago, Frankia, Le Voyageur etc, there are far more mid range Continental vans coming onto the UK market....the likes of Rapido, Chausson, Pilote, Adria, Knaus etc....and these are the vans that are targetting the upper models of Autotrail. Swift and Auto Sleepers....
then there are the Continental sub-brands like Carado (from Hymer), Sunlight (Dethleffs), Sun Living (Adria) and Weinsberg (Knaus) that are right in amongst the mid/lower scramble of Swift, AT Imala, Elddis, Bailey et al.
Add in the likes of Benimar (Spanish, marketed by Marquis) and the massively sharp prices of Roller Team and the U.K. market is under assault...
now I don't see this being the case (yet) with caravan sales.....it's all Bailey, Swift, Elddis, Coachman with little evidence od large sales for Hymer, Hobby, Kanus etc....
perhaps, with the market moving towards MHs, the big Continental players are just waiting for the market to come to them as they already have these market contenders in place.
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with little evidence od large sales for Hymer, Hobby, Kanus etc....
Possibly got something to do with their looks that only a mother could love ......?
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BB
Is it not true that Continental manufacturers have always taken a fairly large slice of the the UK motorhome market? Being so established they are in a better position to consolidate sales, especially in a rising market. That has never been the case with caravans where Continental models which are popular with some are very much a niche market. Even when makers like Knaus have tried with building vans with the UK side door they have only had limited success and eventually gave up. I appreciate the financial crisis often have a detrimental affect on both sellers and buyers, a bit like the Grand old Duke of York, but Continental caravans for all their supposed better build quality have never really established themselves in the mass market. Having said that the four new UK built caravans I had prior to changing were all well built and trouble free.
David
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David, I'd say not in the way they are now...
previously, AT, Swift and AS were the big UK players but without much competition as the opposition would have been Hymer and in a different sector...
ten years ago, when I first got into MH it would be rare to see a Kanus, Dethleffs or other German vans, with the French Rapido, Chausson and Pilote mainly off the radar....although (like older Hymers) Pilote have always had a strong following for their early A-classes...
nowadays, there are very many dealerships with one (or more) continental brands, sometimes sitting alongside UK vans.
our own dealer sellsCarthage and Ho by alonside AT. Sputhdowns sells many Conti brands but also Bailey, Lowdhams do Hymer and others...
hopefully inthis way customers can compare similar sector vans from different produces side by side for real comparative choice...
however, I still feel that uk buyers are being targetted far more by the Continental big p.ayers than ever before....
...but, as we agree, not in the caravan market.
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TT you may well be right but it looks like those vans (at least 2) have the bedrooms at the front, hence the different front panel design...
a lot of conti caravans do this and, to a degree, mirrors the Brit 'love' of rear lounge MHs...
we were at the NEC one year and were looking for the Hymer MH stand. they must have had their caravans close by as we came across them...
we looked at a mid range one and were immediately aware of it being a 'better' product, more akin to their MH in build than a typical caravan we'd seen before...
however, it was about £35k from memory and was probably heavier (well built) than the typical £22-25k UK offering...
we were actually tempted......for a few seconds....
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BB, I was indeed selective in my choice of photo's to make a point.
But whereas German cars like Audi, BMW, Merc, VW, Porsche etc all look fantastic (to me.....!) and the German M/H's look good as well, for some reason their caravans don't appeal in the same way....
My father in law had a Hobby caravan he'd bought in Germany when O/H's brother was in the forces there. It was a very rugged piece of engineering, it felt far more substantial than the Abbey caravan we had at the time, but its looks were, well, rather utilitarian by our tastes.
If they can only crack the aesthetics, German caravans will do very well, like everything else they make.....
But no, you don't want to be a tugger. That would indeed be a retrograde step......
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I think there is some truth in that. Back in 2004 when we were deciding on a new van it boiled down a Hymer 470 (?) or an Eccles Topaz, both were two berth caravans and surprisingly similarly priced. We really didn't like the look of the front of the Hymer so we decided on the Eccles Topaz and to be honest never regretted making that decision. We had it for a trouble free six years and covered nearly 24000 miles in it both here and in Europe. It might seem a silly thing to take looks into account but you do have to live with it!!!
David
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...i thought this was the sort of thing the Germans were producing..surely, it knocks the spots of an Elddis, doesn't it??
smaller sizes also available....
might have to pick your friends, though
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You do need to be a Darth Vader fan to love its looks.
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yeh but... the door is on the wrong side for over here
Does it have all the essentials like:
Heating systems that fail due to non application of insulating paste.
Oven & hob.
Microwaves that fail after a while due to condensation that occurs in a caravan and motorhome through climatic conditions or steam from cooking
Fridge/freezer.
Door edging that falls off after a few months.
Dry joints in electrical connections.
Locker door catches that have never worked properly.
Leaky seams and joins.
Cos without those standard, oft loved, useless poor quality parts; they'll never sell to repeat buyers over here that are used to being bent over and well and truly spanked by the caravan industry
Has that one got the rear 'deck with the canvas hood/cover?
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Perhaps they're learning slowly BB, this is the model it replaced......
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Here's the steel cage of my caravan before they put the exterior panelling on - solid, chunky and heavy, but no bending, flexing or leaking since it was made in 2006 - at a French factory in those days.
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When we had a look around at Lowdhams last year, the only things that caught our attention was a new Hymer MH, on a Mercedes, and a brand new Eriba. Both just oozed quality build, fixtures and fittings. The rest, both new and secondhand, MH and caravan weren't worth disturbing the moths in our wallet!
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