What Next ?
Comments
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In many ways it doesn't bother me the re-brand etc. But, what does is the cost of it and the lack of estimate of what benefit it will give in terms of increased membership etc. I asked the Vice Chairman at the NEC what was the cost but he totally avoided the answer as well as the question of the cost of the last branding exercise with the change of all the signs to the lighter green colour. A bit more transparency from ''above' would be good. It seems they are, when it suits, happy to say it is a Members Club, but when it comes to consultation they steam ahead like a business but without share holders to answer to.
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I think the title of this thread, What Next, is really good and gives us an opportunity to put forward our ideas for future development of the Club rather making it another discussion on what has already been done. Below I have quotes some of the comments I have made in other threads, mainly for those who may not have read them
On the subject of the new logo, love it or hate it, the Club have taken ideas from the original 1907 pennon to come up with this. The original pennon was 2 C's (one reversed) with a V intertwined in the middle. The new logo is 2 separated C's (one reversed) with an M in the middle and more modern looking. I thought it was quite a clever idea basing it on the 1907 pennon, but personally I would have made it a bit bigger. Unfortunately I don't have a separate photo of the original pennon - I found it on a National Motor Museum document. If I find a way of extracting it from the document I'll post it up.
I'm sure the Executive Committee and the Club Council and the Club as a whole would really be thankful for any suggestions especially in order to encourage younger folk into the Club.
After saying that, we have to start with what we have at the moment, the current membership, the current systems, staff etc. Any changes are always made taking these things into consideration and because of this are inevitably going to be slow, at each stage assesing and reflecting on the effect of any changes on the current membership and it's financial impact.
I know there are many things wrong with the Club but personally I feel we are making progress, although very slowly. I know, for example, that the Club have invested in a small number of 'Pods' (see HERE). I could be wrong, but I suspect they are not widely advertised - perhaps they need to be advertised more outside the Club? There is the 'Tourer Explorer Scheme' and the fact that certain sites have been earmarked as suitable for certain age ranges (see 'Be Inspired') and, of course, the sites with more 'activites' like Hillhead and Seacroft. There are also the sites where kids go for 1p.
Make what you will of the rebranding of the Club and the buzz words that go with it. (Incidentally, I heard a caravan/ motorhome retailer, last weekend explain that in their experience, new motorhome units were often purchased by younger couples and families - perhaps this goes someway to justify the Club's change of name.) For me, the important thing for me is not the change of name, the logo or the buzz words, but more where this leads the Club to in the end of the day - i.e. what actually happens in practice. For this any suggestion is worth looking at, but personally, I think it has to be within the limitations of my words in paragraph 2 above. The change of name and the buzz words are just a skeleton on which to hang the flesh. I think we should try and embrace the change and in particular look forward to the practical changes that we can bring about together.
Incidentally, all this is not meant to be an official response, but my own personal response - I am certainly not toeing any official line. I think we should go forward in a positive way and offer support. It is so easy to criticise and so difficult to instigate change that is going to fit with the Club as it is now. In many walks of life I have heard people extol the importance of looking to the future. Indeed it is, but the way I look at it is to look at the present with an eye to the future. Children and possible younger adults are the present and we should try and do what we can to encourage them. I'm sure we will all make many mistakes on the way.
David
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A long thoughtful essay David.
But are you saying that even someone on the Club Council has no idea what plan for the future the Executive Committee and the management have ? Or are you saying there is as yet no plan?
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The Club Council is generally a body that offers advice and suggestions to the Executive Committee. It only meets twice a year, so perhaps we will hear more when we next meet. At present, the Club Council know no more than the buzz/ key word principles that came with the rebranding. However, I think we should take this opportunity to discuss and offer ideas as I suspect it will be very much a two way process, and I would guess this is what the Executive Committee and East Grinstead want. The intention is 'to focus more on the experiences and adventures that can be enjoyed by all of our current and future members', so the way I see it is that we need to look to attract new members and by understanding the needs of current members in order to improve our caravanning and motorhoming experience.
To be honest, I think the principles of Inspire, Simplify, Pioneer and to be Inclusive and their associated descriptors can include such a wide variety of ideas, that many things could fit and this is an opportunity we should all sieze to help shape the future of the Club, together with any other ideas the Club Executive' and those at East Grinstead may have.
So 'What Next?..... let the discussion begin!
Just my thoughts....
David
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I'm very happy to try to come up with ideas and suggestions because there are many things that I believe need urgent attention. Whether these are best aired on the forum or sent to another point of contact is in itself debatable. A germ of an idea posted on the forum might lead to a workable solution to the problem but then runs the risk of the thread being hijacked by irrelevant and inappropriate threads.
Whichever way these ideas and suggestions are handled I think we need to get right back to the basic facts and try to work out from there.
One very basic problem that I don't have an answer to is the fact that sites are, very generally, occupied/ part occupied Sunday to Thursday by 'post-retirement' members as the younger members will hopefully be in work and possibly have children at school. This means that their 'caravanning' opportunities are more limited (annual and school holidays excepted) to weekends. There are also, of course, some of the 'post retirement' (lets call them 'older') members that are child-minders for grandchildren who then become restricted to weekends themselves.
As I have already stated, I don't know what the solution is but it is one of the basic problems that I think needs to be carefully but urgently considered. We need to think 'out of the box'.
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One very basic problem that I don't have an answer to is the fact that sites are, very generally, occupied/ part occupied Sunday to Thursday by 'post-retirement' members as the younger members will hopefully be in work and possibly have children at school. This means that their 'caravanning' opportunities are more limited (annual and school holidays excepted) to weekends. There are also, of course, some of the 'post retirement' (lets call them 'older') members that are child-minders for grandchildren who then become restricted to weekends themselves.
Not sure that there is a soluble problem here. What is the problem by the way John? Who has the problem? Is it the retireds or non retireds or the non retireds with kiddies?
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This trend of loosing sites is a concern to the Club management too, who are consistently working hard to solve this problem. It appears to be so difficult to get suitable land, especially in areas where the the Club are being forced to close sites. The current trend with our local authority seems to be to build housing whenever land becomes available, in order to meet targets.
David
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Yet three popular sites were promoted to local authorities for housing development last year by the club's consultants
The club is becoming a travel agent. Overseas tours - some of which are by plane and coach, ASs advertised as if they were club sites. We'll get to a point where the membership fee buys a brochure of approved sites and discount vouchers and little else.
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If a member goes on a cruise it means thay are not occupying a pitch and someone else can use it. Look out for discounts from funeral undertakers soon.
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I don't remember all the details about that 'sites controversy' now, Jayess, as I was away at the time. From what I can remember the error was dealt with.
As regards the Club diversifying, personally, I have no problem with this. In doing this the Club are providing an additional service for members and ploughing the profits back into the Club for the benefit of the members - especially in updating facilities on sites etc. In my opinion, 'Sites' are still the most important provision that the Club provides for its members, and personally I can't see this changing in our lifetime. Who knows what will happen in another age - we might not even have caravans or motorhomes - then the Club will need to change its name and logo once more.
David
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A letter was sent to the relevant authority to say that the site was not necessarily available for development but the information was not placed before the inspector who dealt with the hearing. I thought it was probably an 'oversight' so I copied the letter and links to the relevant discussions to the inspector. As I have some knowledge in this field I would say that the error was not corrected at all as this would involve withdrawing the proposal and this did not happen.
I also have no problem with diversification of the business if it leads to improvements. We are seeing too many closures with no replacements. We aren't even seeing a rapid timetable for improvement to motorhome points.
I'm afraid that the club is coming across as if they are preparing for a sale or merger. They aren't are they?
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...as far as I know, the answer to your last statement is No.
David
As Jayess quoted my last post before I finished editing, I'll add the edit again as it's relevant to Jayess' final paragraph.......
In my opinion, 'Sites' are still the most important provision that the Club provides for its members, and personally I can't see this changing in our lifetime. Who knows what will happen in another age - we might not even have caravans or motorhomes - then the Club will need to change its name and logo once more.
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Probably what would be interesting is to know how many sites are freehold and how many are leasehold. I am sure that 20 odd years ago the Club got quite good terms for running a leasehold site and investment was worthwhile given the length of the lease. I expect as leaseholds come up for renewal the owners of the lease are increasing less likely to offer a long term option which brings into question whether investment is worthwhile. The pressure on local authorities to build houses will make the provision of campsites near to towns a very low priority. The reverse of that is that building them in the countryside will become less welcome as a perceived protection of the countryside against further urbanisation! We seem to be entering a period where we are losing a lot of sites
As for the Club organising discount on cruises, why not. Surely none of us are complete slaves to the camping tradition. Nice to have an extra bit of luxury now and them
Mind you it's such a competitive business that there might be better bargains out there without the Club discount.David
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Surely none of us are complete slaves to the camping tradition.Wrong again, David. We have only ever gone away in our caravan during the 15 yrs or so since retirement, (for over 250 nights each year), and are not interested whatsoever in doing other wise. Perhaps we are unique, but I doubt it.
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Well I joined the club to access the site network and for the insurance.
The network is diminishing but the insurance and membership premiums are increasing.
I wouldn't be interested in a cruise or a motorhome tour through the USA through the club if I'm honest but have no issue with them doing it as long as it doesn't detract from what I see as the key function. That function is the provision of touring pitches
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I know that a regional manager was willing to sell freehold site in the Cotswolds when interest was shown in aquireing it as in his words to our friends "there is no money in sites, its travel and insurance that makes the money
Also when the now ccc over the railway line from Crossways was coming on the market the then warden at crossways advised the club,as there was and still is I think a problem with the lease at crossways but of course what do staff on the ground know??
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I joined the Club initially for the sites network, but soon started to use caravan insurance, continental travel insurance, booking ferries and more recently tunnel and Mayday breakdown insurance. In the past I have used the Club for car insurance and pet insurance but don't do so at the moment.
I think we have only ever used a CL once and we have never rallied. I've attended a National on three occasions as a day visitor. I'm happy for the Club to diversify to support the development of facilities on sites, but I'm not interested in guided tour holidays, USA tours or cruises.
I would be happy to see an expansion of the site network.......and happier still to be able to book a hardstanding pitch.. LOL
David
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I'd be really interested in any more ideas that folk have for the future development of the Club - especially what we can do to encourage younger couples and families. Of course, we should do this at the same time as fulfilling the needs of current members. It would be really useful to have some more positive suggestions in addition to those which have already been discussed.
David
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Hi everyone,
I've removed the off topic posts from this thread. I'm enjoying reading about why you joined the Club and your thoughts on how we can offer more.
Like David I'd be interested in hearing more of your ideas, keep 'em coming!
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Re the Baltic Wharf site,
I think there is now some uncertainty about the original plan for a school. So if the council don't want it for their use, perhaps the CAMC could buy it. Expensive, yes very. However, at least it will show a guaranteed return, and please a lot of people, which is more than can be said for the rebrand.
It would also be a valuable asset, as land in that area is unlikely to go down in value anytime soon.
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How can we overcome the facts that, generally, younger people will be at work Monday to Friday and their children at school these same days except for holidays? I don't think we can. This means that that category of members can only 'caravan' at weekends resulting in very full sites Friday and Saturday nights. Only more pitches/sites will alleviate this and to stop pitches being taken out of use because they are waterlogged or churned up many more pitches must be converted to hard standing. Unless this is done there is no real advantage in tinkering around the edges of what we already have. Spend money where it is really needed.
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I really dont like the name change or the logo but why not split into a caravan section and a motorhome section like the other Club have? I travel a lot overseas and the requirements if motorhomers are totally different to those of caravanners. I dont care where the nearest shop is or where the nearest bus stop/cycke lane is. I use the car. The overseas Tours could be more competitavely priced as there would be no need to hire coaches etc as we would use our own cars! I have nothing against aravans or motorhomes but feel that they are totally different beasts and this will benefit no one!
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