Additives
Do diesel addatives do what they claim to do, or are they just a waste of money?
Comments
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I also use Shell V Power ,BP or Texaco premium deisel I try to do 3 supermarket fillups to 1 Premium and especially fill up with premium prior to towing the caravan ,you can certanly feel more trottle response and torque and maybe a slight improvement in
MPG .According to numerous motor web sites its better for the engines but there a price hike for the Premium stuff.0 -
Cheapest Supermarket fuel every time for me diesel and petrol ,never waste money on additives which are not necessary.
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I tend to go for the cheapest usually Tesco round here. Needed to fill up today though and found the local Esso station cheaper and I still got my Tesco points. As far as I can tell there is little or no difference between the different suppliers. Round
here it all comes from the same refinery and the only difference is additives dropped in the tank by the tanker drivers.0 -
I tend to go for the cheapest usually Tesco round here.
I use Shell V Power or the equivalent in other brands whatever the pump price.
I really don't bother to look for the cheapest, ever. I don't even check prices. If I could get diesel at say, 4p a litre cheaper at another filling station that would be a saving of approx 18p a gallon. If I put 20 galls in my m/h I'd save £3.60. I don't check prices when I buy but if a local garage happens to be the cheapest around I'd use it but for goodness sake, life's too short to worry about saving £3.60 for every 20 gallon fill up - say every 600 miles.
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If premium diesel really made a significant difference to MPG you would`nt have to ask the question, it would be common knowledge. I suspect the oil companies would shout their claims from the rooftops, the financial press would regularily tout it as a
money saving opportunity none of which I have seen. It may well keep the engine cleaner but unless you are doing a very high mileage I can`t see much benefit.0 -
Cheapest Supermarket fuel every time for me diesel and petrol ,never waste money on additives which are not necessary.
Agreed - In the quantities its added to premium brand fuels (200ppm) it is little more than a gimic and a nice little earner for the premium brand - there is very little evidence othaer than produced by the brands themselves of the cleaning effects and
it will produce no detectable increase in power or mpg (as most real world tests have shown in the motoring media).Standard BS EN 590 from where ever you can find it cheapest.
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I also use Shell V Power ,BP or Texaco premium deisel I try to do 3 supermarket fillups to 1 Premium and especially fill up with premium prior to towing the caravan ,you can certanly feel more trottle response and torque and maybe a slight improvement in
MPG .According to numerous motor web sites its better for the engines but there a price hike for the Premium stuff.As an experiment - get your other half to fill up the car for the next 12 times, using standard fuel 9 times and premium fuel 4 times - get them to do it completely in random order but so that only they know what is in the tank - no cheating!!!
You then have to 'guess' whats in the tank from the drive feel!
....at the end of the twelve cycles, you will then be able to switch back to just standard fuel and save yourself a few quid!
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I think driving style and mileage is a big factor. I do 35-40k usually long hard drives. Never use additives or premium fuel. Last car did 196k, current Yeti is 106k. Running perfect.
FiL has problems with VW diesel; he does short, slow trips, and has to use Premium fuel or it runs terrible.
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I tend to go for the cheapest usually Tesco round here.
I use Shell V Power or the equivalent in other brands whatever the pump price.
I really don't bother to look for the cheapest, ever. I don't even check prices. If I could get diesel at say, 4p a litre cheaper at another filling station that would be a saving of approx 18p a gallon. If I put 20 galls in my m/h I'd save £3.60. I don't
check prices when I buy but if a local garage happens to be the cheapest around I'd use it but for goodness sake, life's too short to worry about saving £3.60 for every 20 gallon fill up - say every 600 miles.Write your comments here...I don't worry about the £3.60 saving on each 20 gallons but I can't see point in bunging unnecessary crap into my engine,each to their own as they say
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I had an old Land Rover Discovery 2 some years back and used to fill it up with half diesel and half sunflower oil, straight off the shelves at the supermarket.
The results were amazing; 30p per litre; and much better performance! Only downside, it smelt like a chipshop, but I had people fighting over it when I came to sell it. Wonder why?
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I only fill up where I see that the fuel is cheap! I understand that it might seem daft if I'm only saving £3.60 on 20 gallons etc etc. But if I give any trade to the dearer garages whats the incentive for them to keep prices down?
TF
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As an experiment - get your other half to fill up the car for the next 12 times, using standard fuel 9 times and premium fuel 4 times - get them to do it completely in random order but so that only they know what is in the tank - no cheating!!!
You then have to 'guess' whats in the tank from the drive feel!
I'd know what fuel it was from the receipt when she asked me for the money .
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Hi all,
I for four vehicles and eleven years have added half a 500ml bottle of Car Lube semi synthetic 2 stroke oil to each tank full of diesel ( Morrisons garage @ £ 2-00 per bottle ). New at the time " 55 reg KIA Sorento, " 57 Hilux 3-0D4D and now my " 14 Hilux
3-0 Invincible. Read of this on UK Sorento and FL4 forums and am covinced my vehicles run quieter, smoother and deffinately cleaner. Happy caravanning.0 -
I added two-stroke oil to mine for a while a couple of years back. No difference whatsoever.
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You should also be aware that the fuel the engine burns is also used to internally lubricate some very complex and expensive parts of the fuel injection system. Putting two stroke oil, cooking oil or anything "Snake oil" that has not been tested and approved for use could land you with a very big repair bill. And/Or damage your DPF if fitted to your car
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Hi all,
I for four vehicles and eleven years have added half a 500ml bottle of Car Lube semi synthetic 2 stroke oil to each tank full of diesel ( Morrisons garage @ £ 2-00 per bottle ). New at the time " 55 reg KIA Sorento, " 57 Hilux 3-0D4D and now my " 14 Hilux 3-0 Invincible. Read of this on UK Sorento and FL4 forums and am covinced my vehicles run quieter, smoother and deffinately cleaner. Happy caravanning.
Yes its a common bit of Woo that regularly appears on motoring forums.
I did an extensive search some time back to see if I could find any real research on this, other than well "Big Dave" on the "Diesel Heads Forum" said and his mate knows this bloke who works for a garage....and could only find one 'scientific' test undertaken in New Zealand if I recall, which showed it had no positive sides to performance, economy or reliability and that it was environmentally detrimental and also as Milo states above, it could damage parts of the fuel system.
But hey, each to their own!
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I used to use 2SO in my now 145k mile Audi A2 TDi with an EU4 engine and given I drive 300+ miles/week have long term high mileage usage experience. There is no doubt the use of the oil improved the economy, smooth running and shut off. The MOT exhaust test
results were also much improved. The only reason it isn't used now is my wife drives and fuels the car. I have also tried 2SO in an FL2 (EU5) and A6 V6 TDi (EU4) with variable results. The benefits in those were less noticable than the A2 and suspect EU6 engines
will be even less responsive although I have yet to try it in my EU6 Passat. Somewhere on the A2OC forum there is a link which takes you to a German car forum with some lab photos showing combustion with varying ratios of 2SO.0 -
I used to use 2SO in my now 145k mile Audi A2 TDi with an EU4 engine and given I drive 300+ miles/week have long term high mileage usage experience. There is no doubt the use of the oil improved the economy, smooth running and shut off. The MOT exhaust test results were also much improved. The only reason it isn't used now is my wife drives and fuels the car. I have also tried 2SO in an FL2 (EU5) and A6 V6 TDi (EU4) with variable results. The benefits in those were less noticable than the A2 and suspect EU6 engines will be even less responsive although I have yet to try it in my EU6 Passat. Somewhere on the A2OC forum there is a link which takes you to a German car forum with some lab photos showing combustion with varying ratios of 2SO.
If there is a peer reviewed paper then I'd love to see it flatcoat.
But with my work head on - sorry, I don't believe it! Any evidence is anecdotal (unless you ran identical vehicles on identical routes on the same days one with and one without 2SO) and therefore subject to cognative bias.
(I'm not calling you and don't want to offend, just pointing out alternate explainations).
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CJ, I fully understand your response and reasoning. However the problem is at the moment I have yet to see any independant tests from outside the vested interests of the oil industry that prove that additives such as 2so do
not work...... Are you also saying that additive products from respected and long established companies such as Millers Oils are unproven ('snake oil') ?0 -
Yes,Snake oil
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I fail to see how I personally use only S/mkt fuels(totally) yet I've suffered not one single issue over the years, this leads me to believe 'super-duper' additives are just the kings clothes scenario. If the big fuel suppliers had proof either the S/mkt
fuels were damaging or their additive fuels were guaranteed they'd be on every form of media claiming this. They don't, so I will stick with saving money. If you believe the claims-good on you, it's your choice
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CJ, I fully understand your response and reasoning. However the problem is at the moment I have yet to see any independant tests from outside the vested interests of the oil industry that prove that additives such as 2so do not work...... Are you also saying that additive products from respected and long established companies such as Millers Oils are unproven ('snake oil') ?
....almost!
But snake oil is massive business! - just look at Holland and Barrett. Homeopathic and herbal remedies sold in most pharmacies etc. etc.
Just because they are long established and popular, is no indication of efficacy!
What you have got to ask yourself is; if it was actually advantageous, why wouldn’t the oil companied not put 2SO in the fuel and market it as such? That would give them a competitive edge.
Only the big “brands” sell value added fuels with additives (brands who rely on 'customer loyalty' over price) even though they don’t actually manufacture their own fuels any more anyway.
At 200ppm in a premium fuel, that’s 200/1000000 litres per litre of additive for typically 8p a litre extra.
So if 0.0002 litres of additive cost 8p, then (1/0.0002)*£0.08 = £400 per litre is what they are selling essentially cetane (a major component of diesel) and some detergents – not a bad little mark up I’d say!
You say “The problem is at the moment I have yet to see any independent tests from outside the vested interests of the oil industry that prove that additives such as 2so do not work”
Why would the oil industry want to prove 2SO does not work? – They don’t care – you are still buying their fuel and if you break your car doing it, what do they care! - There is no vested interest!
By the same token, I have just looked all over the Millers website, other than an advert saying that it’s great, there is not one piece of evidence presented….just a significant legal disclaimer at the bottom.
It is not for someone to prove it does not work, if it is being presented as an advancement from the status quo, the burden of proof is with the proposal – evidence must be presented to prove it does work.
As always, I am a scientist and given appropriate evidence will change my views and accept what you are saying – that’s how science works.
But based on my current knowledge and understanding AND the distinct lack of any evidence to the contrary (other than anecdotal), I am not currently convinced to do so.
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Just recently I was filling up my Merc ML with its monthly 90 litres of diesel, when i sptted that my local Tesco's were offering a bottle of Redex Diesel additive for £2.50 instead of its normal price of £4+. So I though I would invest!
Result = Nothing ! Smoothness - Unchanged. Range on 90Litres unchanged. The tankful lasted me the usual 570 miles, so averaging about 29mpg which is usual at this time of year mainly on short journeys with lights & heating on etc.
So advantage of that additive Zero Zero Blank etc
TF
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I have always chosen my fuel on price, the cheaper the better. On the odd occassion when I have been forced to pay top price, on a motorway service for example I have never noticed the slightest improvment in either economy or performance.
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I have never rated Redex, no one i know in the trade does either. My colleague whose family are in the car trade (Peugeot dealers) recommend Forte. I mentioned Millers in part because they are an old estsblished company making various niche market products but also because many years ago (20?) Diesel Car magazine did some tests and Millers diesel additive seemed to work. What i am a big believer in and i am sure CJ will agree, is the benefit of Italian tune ups!
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