Wardens in hiding
Comments
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My experience is that the vast majority of sites I've been on are managed to a level above and beyond the 'call and time of duty' There are always exceptions and sometimes the very best can become victims as some label them over zealous or jobsworthian.
I guess you can't please everyone all the time!0 -
It appears to back up the claim that the CC being purely interested in profits rather than the proper management of their sites and again the wardens suffer.
The wardens can obviously only do so much in the time they are booked to work so maybe there are solutions to the problem.
An extra set of wardens on each site wouldn't take that much of a chunk out of the vast profits the club makes yearly (Why do they need so much profit and where does all the money go is another issue).
The wardens could then be on staggered shifts meaning their is always cover until later in the evening. What happens in the event of an issue within the toilet block/laundrette etc. would the wardens just say my working day is finished so come back tomorrow.
I also think its an idea to supply the wardens with a mobile phone so that anyone can text should a noise problem be an issue. I'm sure there are members who would feel apprehensive about going to the wardens on foot incase the are seen by the perpetrators.
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We used to call it Management by Walking About. Wikipedia has a whole page on it.
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Micky, what we have in the CC are self governing sites....the warden is (,hopefully) watching where he is going when on the tractor and isnt going to be able to 'see everything', nor can they from the office, or the toilet block.....or later from their van with the blinds drawn...
there is no security presence (imho) on site...popping into the office to report a dog dumping or a car speeding isnt security...
you cant beat a bit of 'hands on' and a few (20min) strolls around the site each day would let folk know that the clubs representative on site is 'on duty'
Write your comments here...so what level of duty are we talking about. 20 mins in every hour. Three times a day? Most miscreants in life chose their time for being antisocial not when they know they could very well be caught. How many dogs have we seen quickly put on that lead, how many speeders have we seen suddenly slow down. Going about theIr duty in duty time should be enough to show their presence And I reckon that most do exactly that!
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If, as moulsey says, that CC sites are a hotbed of crime, we would expect the Warden staff to contact the police and direct them to the people who are committing the crime. . Its not the responsibility of the holiday makers.
Its the Warden's responsibility to manage the CC site efficiently.
K
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We were on a CC site last weekend and wardens were out and about for sure. One poor chap who we had seen earlier fixing a puncture by the side of the road as we came back from the shops arrived and set up then got told off for pitching caravan awning car
- he was on the end of the row and the next pitch was a non awning so he was well away from any problem. Not his weekend at all :-(There were lots of children on site, on bikes and playing, and they generated a lot of happy noise until about 10pm which was totally fine - great to hear them playing out. Apart from one unit who were quite noisy (but luckily for us they were some distance
away) everything else was pretty quiet and the site was as tidy as usual on CC sites despite being full.0 -
If, as moulsey says, that CC sites are a hotbed of crime, we would expect the Warden staff to contact the police and direct them to the people who are committing the crime. . Its not the responsibility of the holiday makers.
Its the Warden's responsibility to manage the CC site efficiently.
K
Except, K, as I'm sure you realised, I was suggesting exactly the opposite.
Still, happy to have given you an opportunity to trot out the "it's not my problem, guv" line one more time!
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Unless we ask the wardens why nothing was done, we can only speculate. But I suppose the Scarletfan was stating his disgust at how some people can be so disrespectful towards other campers. I wonder if the problem is worse on sites which accept non members.
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Any scrout can join those club these days.
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We were at Pembrey over the Mayday BH weekend and can only deduce that the wardens had given up hope of running a tidy site for a few days.
New arrivals in Friday sped around the site at such a speed over the traffic calming that they must have let the contents of all their lockers in the process.
in the darkness, at 10pm, two vans were allowed onto site to pitch up. About 15 ( probably more like 7 or 8) were then allowed to run free screaming and shouting until the set up process was complete.
come Saturday, someone else arrived to join one of the vans. Parks his sign written sky tv panel van adjacent to their pitch blocking off access to another pitch. It stated there for the duration.
didn't see or hear a warden all weekend - probably in hiding.
Write your comments here...0ne to avoid
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The thread title is Wardens in Hiding.
Some on here have suggested that the site customers on holiday should interfere and tell the warden how to do his/her job.
That is demeaning and disrespectful to the warden staff.
Good wardens spend time out of their offices attending to their sites and as they go about their business they are aware of what is happening on their site. They will see if the CC rules which is their responsibility to uphold are being complied with by the customers.
It is the wardens sole responsibiity to take action against those customers who flaunt those rules with no interference from other customers with an axe to grind.
We must help the warden staff by letting them do their job without making bullets for the warden to fire.
Perhaps if the on-site moaners would mind their own business and let the wardens do their jobs we will no longer be seeing threads with a title like this one. The wardens will feel comfortable going about their sites without moaners telling them how to do their job.
K
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The Club has a "warden" system that I have never seen in place anywhere else in the world - middle aged couples on short term contracts, providing their own accommodation. paid for restricted hours at minimum living wage, with no profit sharing bonus, and moving from site to site with no long term stake in the sites at which they are based. I guess it's cost effective for the Club as employer - but there are other models.
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...but the warden isnt necessarily fully aware of whats going on throughout the site if they are inside the office for a couple of hours booking folk in....
then, when they are inside the toilet block for another 90 mins, they wont have a clue whats happening outside, how could they?
then, at the end of the day, like most folk, theyll be putting their feet up, fair enough..
..but the implication of the thread is about whether we (the customers) should be right to expect a fully managed 'warden' service, not one that is only possible when the warden isnt carrying out all his other tasks or is finished for the day.
again, this is not a dig at wardens, merely that they are hamstrung by the current system.
if folk are happy with the way things are, then they cant criticise the fact that a warden 'didnt see' a particular incident (kids belting round and making a noise late at night etc).
however, of they do want a system where there is a proper 'presence' who is all over the site , then its not the one we currently have....
reporting 'stuff' to the warden after the event will acheive nothing, will just result in a 'no i didn't yes you did' scenario which gets no one anywhere.....and doesnt surprise me that a warden might not want to get involved...
Write your comments here...Good post . We have to remember that most sites do not have one warden only. Many have four or more. When one warden is working indoors, there are another 3 or more available to go out and about their site.
Wardens will have been supplied with a job description prior to being employed and if they find that they are unable to cope with those requirements, it is their right to discuss their concerns with their line manager.
Like all employees, if after their meeting with their line manager , they can either accept their boss's ruling or resign.
I do particularly like your last paragraph BB --- very true
K
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"...reporting 'stuff' to the warden after the event will acheive nothing, will just result in a 'no i didn't yes you did' scenario which gets no one anywhere.....and doesnt surprise me that a warden might not want to get involved.."
Good point, BB - much more useful to come on CT and moan after the event!
Let's be clear, there are very few occasions when we've been on CC sites when there's been anything we'd even consider remotely worthy of drawing to the wardens' attention. I suppose if we saw someone repeatedly speeding we might think abut it, or if there
was loud music late into the night, but CC sites don't generally suffer from a great deal of this.Eurotraveller makes a good point about the CC warden system - we've just been at Commons Wood - one couple of wardens running the site. They can't possibly be everywhere; they can't even be expected to be strolling round the site every half hour. There was
nothing untoward going on the whole time we were there - happy wardens, happy holidaymakers!
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yes, perhaps we've been very lucky but like most we never have experienced bad behaviour on club sites. I suppose that's why when it does happen like on this thread it is 'news' and worthy of a good discussion, but not worth changing a system which most
of the time works very well.0 -
yes, perhaps we've been very lucky but like most we never have experienced bad behaviour on club sites. I suppose that's why when it does happen like on this thread it is 'news' and worthy of a good discussion, but not worth changing a system which most of the time works very well.
Write your comments here...Once again I agree with a portion of your post. -- Your following quote is so true.Corners------- Quote "I suppose that's why when it does happen like on this thread it is 'news' and worthy of a good discussion,"
Yet there are some who are unhappy with such discussions perhaps because they suddenly realise that theirs is not the only opinion. They therefore describe those discussions as moaning.
K
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K, your continued selective use of quotes does make me smile! Who was it used the expression "on site moaners" just a few posts ago.
I'm guessing there are worthy moaners and not so worthy moaner in your world !
Write your comments here...M, you are mistaken. is there is a huge difference between those who are continually moaning to the warden when on site, and those who moan on this forum about others having a good discussion.
Come to think of it they might be one in the same people.
Thats it -- A Eureka moment !!
K
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when is a complaint a moan, made two complaints to a warden nothing happened about said complaint, so you are left with a moan, then you get moaned at on here for complaining, and the world keeps on turning plus when I pitch up I am next to the village idiot.
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I am pertfectly aware that the sites are different places on BH weekends, no more so than at Pembrey as we were there the weekend before also.
My OP was not intended as a dig at the wardens, more of an observation really. They are in a no win situation on a BH weekend, particulary at "member magnet" sites like Pembrey. This is why I did not complain to them, nor have I made a complaint to HQ.
They would not have personally witnessed the speeding, but one new arrival did 4 circuits of the site before settling on a pitch. The wardens would have had to open the barrier for him after each circuit so would have been aware of how fast he was doing
a loop.They let arrivals on at 10pm. This shouldnt have happened, but what else could they do faced with 2 or 3 outfits at that time, except maybe escort the members to pitch and supervise the setting up?
I will admit that the pitch occupants may have sneaked the panel van in, but given it's size and garish graphics it harly blended in, so would have been sticking out like a sore thumb when teh wardens did their bin rounds.
Like I said above, not a dig, just an observation.
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K, your continued selective use of quotes does make me smile! Who was it used the expression "on site moaners" just a few posts ago.
I'm guessing there are worthy moaners and not so worthy moaner in your world !
Write your comments here...M, you are mistaken. is there is a huge difference between those who are continually moaning to the warden when on site, and those who moan on this forum about others having a good discussion.
Come to think of it they might be one in the same people.
Thats it -- A Eureka moment !!
K
Indeed, a eureka moment! We are agreed then that moaning on site and moaning on this forum are equally undesirable!
That's good and I will keep an eye open for your positive posts, particularly about the club and its wardens, in days to come!
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K, your continued selective use of quotes does make me smile! Who was it used the expression "on site moaners" just a few posts ago.
I'm guessing there are worthy moaners and not so worthy moaner in your world !
Write your comments here...M, you are mistaken. is there is a huge difference between those who are continually moaning to the warden when on site, and those who moan on this forum about others having a good discussion.
Come to think of it they might be one in the same people.
Thats it -- A Eureka moment !!
K
Indeed, a eureka moment! We are agreed then that moaning on site and moaning on this forum are equally undesirable!
That's good and I will keep an eye open for your positive posts, particularly about the club and its wardens, in days to come!
Write your comments here. You dont get any more positive posts supporting the wardens than my post on this thread a couple of hours ago.
In case you missed it I will repeat it :-
"The thread title is Wardens in Hiding.
Some on here have suggested that the site customers on holiday should interfere and tell the warden how to do his/her job.
That is demeaning and disrespectful to the warden staff.
Good wardens spend time out of their offices attending to their sites and as they go about their business they are aware of what is happening on their site. They will see if the CC rules which is their responsibility to uphold are being complied with by the customers.
It is the wardens sole responsibiity to take action against those customers who flaunt those rules with no interference from other customers with an axe to grind.
We must help the warden staff by letting them do their job without making bullets for the warden to fire.
Perhaps if the on-site moaners would mind their own business and let the wardens do their jobs we will no longer be seeing threads with a title like this one. The wardens will feel comfortable going about their sites without moaners telling them how to do their job".
K
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We are at Haycraft (one couple site)and there was one member who really could not understand what 5mph means,but was most put out when two other members stopped him this morning on his "paper" run and verbally laid into him, the warden was also informed,
and as for Ks assumption that on some sites there are staff a plenty to ensure that rules are not abused,then he needs to read the EU working time directive
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