scotland outshines whereby engalnd lets us down
Having moved from a tourng caravan after 35 years to a motorhome with all the bells and whistles we decided this summer ( seems a long time ago ) to tour scotland and the outer hebrides using a mix of CL's and ''wild camping ''locations.
Have to say that Scotland is much better geared up for motorhomes - community stop overs / facilities such as cdp and freshwater availability,encouraging stopovers in rural locations etc and also more welcoming when England seems to no longer want motorhomes in car parks / stopovers etc and have resorted in some places to banning motorhomes parking.
We received nothing but warm welcomes in scotland where ever we travelled…yet one night south of the border made us realise the difference .
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And who do you think should pay to install waste water and toilet disposal points and fresh water supplies for motorhomers who don’t want to go to campsites?
I shall howl if Cornwall council or South West Water thinks of adding those to my domestic bills.
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One school of thought suggests that Scotland is taking this route in an attempt to stop the appalling behaviour of some motorhomers who choose to wild camp irresponsibly rather than use dedicated sites such as those provided by this club.
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Exactly @Tinwheeler. I've read countless articles this year of poor behaviour by M/Homers in Scotland. We have the same problem here in Wales despite some councils now trying to set up Aire type stops.
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Here, too, WN.
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We have always enjoyed taking our MH to Scotland, and I wouldn’t disagree that it does seem easier to find overnight stopovers that are legal. However, there are places in Scotland that have strict rules about MH’s, the lovely town of North Berwick being one that springs to mind. You have to be aware that the population density isn’t as great in Scotland either, so it can be a whole lot easier to find a hidden spot, we found plenty via Britstops, all legal. There are places in England as well, but it can be hard unless you are very off the beaten track, so it’s better in the North. We found our happy compromise using a good mix of sites, CLs/CSs and legal overnight stopovers, many at pubs and other small businesses. I could get quite angry about the way some Outfit owners behave, and it has resulted in some lovely stopovers being ended. Helmsley springs to mind.
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I would much prefer to see this being done than outright bans. Levy a charge and the cost of provision and policing can be recovered. Its a win win for both those providing the facilities and local businesses. It is only a small minority that cause problems.
peedee
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I did say ‘some’ motorhomers @peedee . We know it’s not all.
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there are Aires and other legitimate overnight stops in England, but nothing like Scotland. CAMpRA are doing a good job in encouraging councils and landowners to develop stops. Some are beginning to understand that providing overnight stops brings money into the area. Stops on the Fylde coast for example, which are charged, not only cover the cost of the facilities but make a profit the council. Stops in Scotland have paid for community facilities. I don’t understand why more Park and Ride facilities don’t emulate the Canterbury aire which is well used and facilitate trips by bus into Canterbury.
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Even some is too many @Tinwheeler
peedee
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Might be an idea for motorhomers to band together, pay subs, and form a club - which could set up facilities like dumping waste, emptying toilets, piping in fresh water and collecting garbage - all at their own expense - instead of expecting “councils and landowners” to pay out to do it for them.
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It sounds an easy do @eurortraveller but no matter who provides the facilities, there will always be some who abuse the facilities/ provision. It’s a sad fact around a great deal in life nowadays, not just touring. When we were touring Scotland last time, we found it was mainly hired outfits and overseas visitors that were the worst offenders. Some of the Scottish councils, communities, land owners have provided some excellent stopovers, with water, waste and plenty more. We saw a CPD point vandalised by one person, it had been locked as the cess pit was full and awaiting emptying, but that didn’t stop one outfit breaking the chain lock and dumping anyway. Didn’t stay, emptied then drove off without leaving a contribution. Similar at a really lovely Aire at Kircudbright. Three marked out bays with hook ups, water waste. Fourth arrived and decided to park up too close. He was told to go forth by those of us who had paid, and told to stop being a danger to others. Same in all aspects of life, some people have no respect for property, efforts or fellow tourers. You can see why some places consider tourers a nuisance rather than an opportunity.
Finest example we came across of wild camping wasn’t a MH though, it was a caravan. Big layby not far from RAF Cranwell, we were heading Norfolk way, and pulled in for a break. Took dog for a stroll and further up from us, an unhooked caravan, water barrel hooked up outside, chairs, table, parasol, they had a “lovely” little spot next to footpath, nice views. Huge HGVs going past close, cars in and out all the time, but worst of all? We pondered on how they dealt with emptying toilet tank. It had obviously been there a while.
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Agreed, it shouldn’t happen at all but the fact is, it does.
I’m not in the camp (pardon the pun) that says Councils should provide facilities such as aires as I believe we should all behave responsibly without expecting others to pander to us. If we choose to drive to remote areas, we must make our own legal and responsible arrangements, eg use sites where they exist.
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@Tinwheeler it is not all about remote areas. For me it is about providing stopping places near attractions. If I wanted remote places there are always the certificated locations. While the UK, England especially, shuns this provision I will continue my major touring trips across the Channel. The last trip we made to Scotland was in 2005.
peedee
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"For me it is about providing stopping places near attractions."
There are sites, PD. I’ve visited many attractions from 'proper' sites over the years. Why should the public fund stopping places near attractions? The operators of such places can provide them if they feel there’s a need.I think you’re best suited to touring overseas although you seem to use a fair number of club sites.🤷🏻♂️
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I agree there are some sites well located and they are fine for long stays but work out expensive if you only want to stay a night or two. I really do not care who funds them as long as they are available but do agree owners of attractions are better placed to benefit from their provision. Yes I agree, I find touring across the Channel more attractive and easier, that is why most years we do this. Contrary to belief, I am using C&mC sites less and less, only 4 nights this year and I will not be using them at all next year. Over the last 4 years I have averaged just 10 nights a year. That equates to only 10 percent of my average nights away in a year.
peedee
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Is it any wonder why some places won't fund the setting up provisions for motorhomes when this sort of thing occurs.
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There is provision for motorhomes in Wasdale. It’s called Church Stile Campsite. But some Motorhomers seem to have an acute allergy to campsites and won’t use them.
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@eurortraveller the situation in the Lakes has gotten out of hand, with M/Hs pitch up for days in parking places, dumping their waste, of all sorts, around willy-nilly, lighting fires in the most dangerous spots. Something really has to be done, and it is not as simply moving them on or providing additional campsites, even if there was room, as many just won't use them anyway.
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There are always a few who won't pay anything and expect everything to be free or who simply cannot afford to pay the prices demanded by campsite. These may well understand the rules and may not actually be the culprits. Providing more campsites with all facilities is more than likely not the answer. Provision of dump facilites and etiquette education would go a long way to help but how you instill the latter in those who give little thought to others, is difficult. These problems seem to be much less prevalent across the Channel where the abundant provision for motorhome parking goes hand in hand with the provision of fresh water and dump facilities and where the ediquette is far more familiar to the users.
peedee
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”…or who simply cannot afford to pay the prices demanded by campsite.”
As they drive around in their £100k motorhomes! 😤
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there is a role for hire companies to do more to educate their customers. Too many have been sold an unachievable dream of park anywhere with wonderful views from the van.
Particularly when in Scotland but elsewhere as well we dont use full facilities camp sites. We don’t like the sites and don’t need the facilities. We use Aires, and authorised overnight spots. They are NOT usually free, costs vary from £5 to £15 overnight. Usually £10.
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I'm afraid the hire companies are only interested in one thing @Hja and 'educating' folk won’t add to their profits.
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The £100k van doesn’t need to empty tanks/cassettes???
I agree not all the wildcampers are in shiny new vans but you have to admit it happens.
Even those who cannot afford sites (I won’t get into the issue of questioning why they’re doing it if they can’t afford it) have to empty somewhere and most 'proper' places come with a cost.1 -
Living the dream.
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Yeah, I’ve seen that photo before.
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yes most emptying facilities come with a cost. But obviously you don’t need to pay campsite fees if emptying is provided elsewhere. Some Aires provide emptying facilities free of charge. And dare I remind people that the ccc allows emptying, filling, use of laundry, for a fee, at a number of their sites.
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As has been stated frequently on here it is no use comparing "over there" to what the situation is on these highly populated islands. The most popular places to visit are crowded at the best of times with day visitors, those inconsiderate campers who stay for days on public parking spaces, ignoring the no overnight camping instructions, leaving their waste around, just exacerbate the problems.
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@eurortraveller Did you take that? I t was on MotohoneFun two years ago?
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