Trying to decide re renewal
Having been members for aprox 25 years, we had decided to wait and see by our renewal date, in the hope over the last 6 months the club would have sorted the online booking system and whilst its not as bad as it was its still hard work to work out site prices and availability.
So we were coming round to staying members, however the following is putting us off membership (yes I know there will be other views):-
1. The site cost increases
2. The terms and conditions that mean even changing site dates you loose deposit. Even when our kids were young there would be the occasional brake down, high wind or illness that might prevent us traveling and we could not afford to loose a deposit fee, this was the true value to us for the Club as we could usually delay travel by a day or move to different dates. Now that is even more important with carer responsibilities.
So we cannot book in advance and move dates if something happens and it is not viable to have insurance for this. We were members who often picked up extra nights if someone cancelled.
4. Having brought back midweek offers, we are disappointed to see the misleading advertising of them as you don't get them unless you can book in advance.
5. The magazine is not as informative and too full of personal columns and adverts for club offers which don't actually benefit members - e.g. the shop its more expensive and has less stock than many other local caravan part shops.
6. The decision that we all want digital membership cards - which if you don't have a smart phone or loose power are not available!
So on balance we may not renew, however if we don't renew we are letting what might be a small minority control the club, so is it better to renew and actively look at how we can have more of a say?
Does anyone know if there is going to be any new people standing for election or how people get elected?
Also why does the club not have more member participation? I don't mean the questionnaire surveys that can be useful but also can be used in the wrong way.
Finally should the club have a limit on how long an elected member can hold office - like most clubs and groups?
Comments
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To answer
1. You either accept the prices, or you don’t. CLs offer very good alternatives if you do your research properly, and if they suit you and your personal circumstances.
2. Some of the terms and conditions are not as user friendly if you cannot book ahead, and might need to cancel at short notice. Like you I am a carer, we don’t book anything at all more than a couple of days ahead for this reason. Our circumstances mirror yours.
3. (Where is 3🤷♀️)
4. Agree, offers are not that good as previous.
5. You don’t have to receive the magazine, it costs nothing, available online if you really want to check the odd item, go paper free.
6. you don’t have to have a digital only Membership, you can still have a card🤷♀️
You need to do more research around the Club and options. You need to either apply to go on one of the Committee’s, and challenge some of the decisions from within (watching an AGM, attending local meetings will give you a better insight) or you need to think as many are doing and look at other options. All the information is on this website about committees, staff, decision making, etc…… not always as good as it should be, but most is there.
Whether or not you renew is a very personal decision, only you know what gives you value from being a Member. But do the research properly before jumping one way or the other is best advice🙂
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ecocamping
At the end of the day it depends whether you can get what you want elsewhere. That may be perfectly possible and if it is you may have answered your own question. However I would question whether you will find more generous T&C's elsewhere? Even the C&CC are not as generous although depending on your age it may be a better bet discount wise. Most commercial sites require a deposit and usually full payment weeks prior to arrival so in that sense the Club have a major advantage. I do think the Club need to revisit the rules about making last minute changes which don't impact on overall Club revenue and seem a bit like a punishment!
Unfortunately my experience of having subscriptions to motorhome or boating magazines is that you get what I call the two year churn where by the same subjects are covered again and again, albeit written by different people.
Digitalisation is with us now and forever. So people need to understand that where it saves organisations money, which also means in the end it saves members money, it is not going away and I would really urge those who think it has gone too far to think about it practically and get onboard with it.
I am not sure if you have ever been involved with the latest way of running the Club AGM? You can now submit written questions in advance and whilst not everyone will be dealt with at the AGM the questions do get answers after the event. Many of us on here have found it a useful source of information which is frustratingly missing from elsewhere.
David
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Thank you for your replies, and oops re abolishing 3's
Off to look at the clubs committees and structures etc are they easy to find?
I do wonder how many people have left or not renewed membership, may be that's a question for the AGM along with how much spare capacity there has been?
One benefit has been for us that booking a site a few weeks at last minute there was a lot of choice where we could book and on site it was so empty there was choice of pitches too!
Though we are currently paying more than other as the offers are now there, I suspect there will be a lot of cancellations and re booking going on for people to get the discount if they are far enough in advance.
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I have some sympathy for the original post.
We don’t use Club sites and retain membership for CLs. Booked two days ago to go away for three nights next week.
We are just not that organised to book months ahead. I think it is different if you are booking a two or three week summer holiday and need to book leave. Although when we were in that position, we were going to Europe, just booking the ferries, never camp sites, even in school summer holiday.
We continue to receive hard copy directory and memb card. We receive hard copy magazine because we both like to flick through which we couldn’t do conveniently if one of us received it electronically. I agree there is nothing much in it, but I find that true of a lot of club type mags and even many Motorhome mags.
As for the organisation of the club, I think it is all a bit of a cabale. We can vote for Council members prior to the AGM, including an option to say “no” to one or more. This is done electronically. Then at the AGM which I observed last year, by zoom, they vote and unanimously accept everyone. I have yet to find out how they incorporate the “postal” votes. Astonishingly, there are the correct number of candidates for places.
People nominated seem to be associated in some way with the area groups, or what ever they are called. Despite having an area group on my membership card I have never had any communication from them.
There are also Q & A sessions around the country. I have seen one advertised in the magazine, but not for anywhere near me.
I think only a select few members are allowed to participate. You have to be in the know. A real democratic deficit, in my view.
Over the last year or two I have felt increasingly that members are considered irrelevant. I think the club is run and managed by people who in some cases have no idea what caravanning and motorhoming is all about.
So why do I remain a member? Simply for the CLs. We have also for the first time joined the CCC this year. We have been to three of their club sites, as it happens. Whilst they reaffirmed our dislike of large sites, we found them more relaxed and pleasant than CAMC sites. And because we benefit from the age discount much cheaper.
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Go right down to bottom of page, into green bit, and click on “about us”. All sorts of information down there, lots of links. You will only find details of the AGM on here, local committee minutes are never shared. You can ask questions to be put to AGM, but don’t expect much in response to be honest. No one asks questions from the floor, at least I can only recall one in last two years. You can watch the AGM via Zoom.
It will only be a general response to any questions. The Club doesn’t share information easily to be honest, unless you analyse what is in the Annual Reports, current and previous.Link to last year’s AGM https://www.caravanclub.co.uk/about-us/agm/
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On a positive note I've just found a possible reason to stay members if you have more than 2 dogs, we have 3 small rescues.
Very few sites allow more than 2 dogs, that sadly includes many CS's
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Hja said :-
As for the organisation of the club, I think it is all a bit of a cabale. We can vote for Council members prior to the AGM, including an option to say “no” to one or more. This is done electronically. Then at the AGM which I observed last year, by zoom, they vote and unanimously accept everyone. I have yet to find out how they incorporate the “postal” votes. Astonishingly, there are the correct number of candidates for places.
People nominated seem to be associated in some way with the area groups, or what ever they are called. Despite having an area group on my membership card I have never had any communication from them.
There are also Q & A sessions around the country. I have seen one advertised in the magazine, but not for anywhere near me.
I think only a select few members are allowed to participate. You have to be in the know. A real democratic deficit, in my view.
I think we have to accept that there are probably two types of members. The first group will be those who just want to use the Club to book sites, buy insurance etc, probably the vast majority of the membership? The other group will be those that get involved with the Club, as a club, by running local centres (BTW you have to register interest, not the other way round) running rallies etc. It is probably from this group that the majority of people come from to put themselves forward for election. I don't know if you recall the furore prior to last years AGM when it seemed everyone was going to vote against those putting their names forward. What happened, nothing, life went on as normal!
With regards the regional Q&A's. I don't think there are many during the year and they were obviously put to one side during the pandemic. I have been to one but had to travel to Luton. Unfortunately the one organised locally to me (two miles away) we couldn't attend because we were away. I am sure that the hiring of rooms in hotels and the provision of (usually minimal) refreshments is quite expensive so I suppose that will be a limiting factor.
David
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Very true, the site we use in Devon for the month of September charge £84 for the month, not expensive but it is a charge, fortunately/unfortunately we no longer have pero so we will be better off to the tune of £84.
we gladly paid the charge because the dog walk was amazing, and i often went down early morning sat on the bench and watched the sunrise, and during the day it was a very sociable area with lots of people dog owners and non dog owners just taking in the view, oh! and they have a fantastic doggy wash
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I never saw any point in cancelling membership. Not as a protest, not out of pique, and not because I was short of £50 .
I used a campsite in London now and then, I sometimes insured the caravan, and the discounts and vouchers on ferry crossings were always worth having.
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Well I thought I'd decided to stay in members, but I'm not sure we can afford or justify £59, I thought it might be worth it for CL's but so many don't take dogs or if they do its max 2.
CCC is looking more appealing for us in our circumstances especially with their discounts being now available on day you book not just in advance!
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The subject of dogs has nothing to do with your post Eco, and it will get your thread closed down under the current T&Cs, so friendly advice is to move off it. (It’s a historical thing, dogs have their own thread, or at least they did until it got closed down last weekend)
As for justifying £59, the canny ones amongst us get our membership fee back via some of the special offers the Club has negotiated. You don’t have to join one or the other Club either, a lot of us use both.
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I don't understand why, its a valid reason as to why we may or may not stay as members? I won't ask why the D thread got closed down, I do understand strong feelings either way, but the hygiene on pitches (so long as picked up) and children I don't get, as wildlife can also be around!
Yes in the past we have been members of both but at the moment don't have spare income to justify it, so struggling to decide which, we use to find the days out offers were good in the past not so much now. Having looked at current offers they don't work for us.
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Dogs are very welcome on most CLs, and most CS sites, we have toured for nearly 40 years using both with three, two and one dog. So owning a dog, or three, is irrelevant to your decision and choice. Debating anything else about dogs will close your thread down, because there are polarised opinions on the subject.
All you really need to do if costs are a factor, is do your research and make an informed decision based on your findings and your personal needs.
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So on balance we may not renew, however if we don't renew we are letting what might be a small minority control the club, so is it better to renew and actively look at how we can have more of a say?
My simple rule is I don’t let a minority push me around. I am a member of this club because it gives me access to CL’s. I don’t give a hoot for all the other stuff. I don’t have an ounce of loyalty to the club, I treat it like any other business and when it ceases to be any value to me I’ll be gone4 -
Sadly having been members since 1997, after much consideration, we have decided that the club is no longer right for us, the USP of the club (being able to choose pitch on arrival not grass or hardstanding, being able to change dates even if its by a day without losing any deposit if you have a delay such as high winds vehicle problems or illness) has gone.
The magazine has less information and is harder to read now than it was, the club needs to think about making it more readable with better print for accessibility if sight impaired or dyslexia etc.
Having seen hard standing pitches grow in size on club sites to the point where its often like staying in a carpark and pitches flood more as less able to drain this is bad for the environment.
The name change was an unnecessary expense poorly implemented.
The change to the booking system and not having anyone to speak to at weekend to book is less than helpful, we have waited to see if it would improve by now and are disappointed that even with some changes, its still very hard work to use and book.
Looking at the cost for us, combined with the savings and what we get we can no longer justify being members so will be choosing from the alternatives.
We hope the club listens to its members before its too late. The current stream of emails trying to get us to take up offers appears that its not working, we won't miss those.
Wanted to say good bye for now, we have had some wonderful times on club sites and CLs, have rallied with club centres and up till now insured our caravans with the club. We loved having the caravan club credit card in the past and offers in the past seemed much better than they are now.
We may re join in the future if things change.
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ecocamping
Don't they say one man's meat is another man's poison? Some of the things you list as negatives for you are positives for others. Some of us have long argued that we wanted to book a pitch type at the time of booking, so when the Club enabled that many of use were really pleased. The name change just reflects the modern make up of the Club. Whilst some motorhomers might argue the Club still has a lot to do in how it deals with motorhomer needs they wanted the wider public to know that they were not just a Club for caravans. If you enjoy using CL's are you not shooting yourself in the foot by not remaining a member? Whatever you decide I hope you make the decision that suits you, the Club is always here.
David
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It’s called the grass is greener syndrome.
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I think Eco deserves recognition for standing by his views and voting with his wheels. That’s a far better way to deal with discontent than to constantly moan yet continue paying membership fees which, in my view, devalues the criticism levied.
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Everyone using a site this weekend ought to look around at the customer base. Then observe the wardens too before finally checking this image of the:Committee
Now ask yourself, is there any obvious connection between those customers, wardens and the Committee? Does that image honestly and accurately reflect or represent the membership? Is it likely to attract members? Are current and new members likely to feel connection with the Committee? How likely are current and potential members to feel enthused and drawn to the Club or to participating in how the Club is run?
ps. I use the term “Club” in its most loose interpretation.
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