The future of the whole Industry
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You will be telling me next you never took your caravan to Rother Valley CP, or Clumber Park. Plenty of scope there a day out with Van😁You could even stay overnight in proper places.
Just enjoy it busyelf, as others have said it’s not the outfit you choose, it’s what you choose to do with it, and everyone finds their niche👍
Incidentally, top towing tip from me. You don’t have to use motorways all the time. We used a good deal of A routes, and found some great pull in places for a look around, and a lunch spot. We still use some of them with the MH as well.
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What annoys me is the fact that provision is made for Motorhomers and campervanners but not for Caravanners.
I am not sure why you should be annoyed? Provision for parking of motorhomes either by day or overnight is very far from universally being available. The demand is there from motorhomers because the type of vehicle is not designed to be static. It has taken many years of campaigning to start local authorities thinking about providing this option. As far as I can tell there has been zero demand from caravanners for similar provision, I was a caravanner for 30 years before changing to a motorhome. Rather than berating the exclusive provision for motorhomes you should be starting your own campaign to see how much support there might be for such provision. There seems little support for the idea on this forum from caravanners?
David
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it can be hard enough finding a space to park 40+ ft of car & caravan at services due to everything but a caravan being parked in the caravan spaces let alone parking on A roads .... there's usually just one vehicle slap bang in the middle of any lay-by you might find.
At the last services I used while towing, I pulled up alongside another caravan among a load of HGVs into some dead end spaces .... the sign at the end said 'NO HGVs' 🤷♂️ On closer inspection, the spaces were intended for coaches. I never actually saw any spaces reserved for caravans.
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Haven't been to Rother Valley, but Clumber park is awesome.
The A1 has some great little stops (pull off and venture into a village). Just avoid Peterborough Services.. lol
We found a good little shortcut on the way to Lincolnshire Coast. it started out as a B road but became a dirt tack for part of the distance. it saved us about 6 miles. All good fun! Towing cover saved the Caravan Windows a couple of times though.
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Forgive me for mentioning over there, I have limited experience of this but what I’ve seen on the continent is a long history of aires and municipal overnight motorhome facilities which are occupied by camper vans and their bigger cousins. What I wonder is if there is a feeling of being left out, or less privileged, by our caravanning fraternity who live over the water. I suspect not.
My opinion on this for Blighty comes from having ‘camped’ in tents, trailer tents, camper vans, caravans and motorhomes. Each mode brought with it specific needs for difference phases of my life and with it different needs as far as enjoying the pastime itself. As others mention, if there are specific needs caravaners require these need to be expressed, explored by themselves and if viable I’m sure someone will try to provided what they need. Personally I think the idea in the opening post will find little support or appetite.0 -
Busyself from South Yorkshire, if you happen to be coming to Devon or Cornwall you will find easy parking for car and caravan at Gloucester services and again at Cribbs Causeway mall near Bristol - aim for the furthest highest parking area there.
But the “future of the industry” which you mentioned is that big caravans pulled by big diesel engined cars will be gone within ten years. Small will once again be beautiful.
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Cribbs Causeway can be fairly manic, not sure I’d want to be there during busy periods towing a caravan. Services at Gordano or Sedgemoor might be easier? One to avoid is Bridgwater Services.
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This was the whole point of this Topic from the begining, to identify the need and see how viable it was to explore this further. It appears that the caravanners are content with the status Quo, so nothing needs to be done. Most of the replies I have had are from Motorhomers, whose viewpoint I take on board, the Caravanners who replied have stated that there is no issue.
However I have identified that there is a problem with parking facilties for Caravanners in particular, while taking a break on a journey. and I think this needs addressing, for Service Areas on major routes as an example. Some, if not a majority have spaces reserved for Caravanners and large motorhomes, but seem to be misused. by other types of vehicles.
Is this a common problem or is it anothe case of 'We Work around it'?
btw way. I have been a backpacker, a tenter, a trailer-tenter and now, as my limbs are getting older, a Caravanner.. Also I did have a Fiat 500 Van conversion at one point in my married life , so possibly that counts as being a Campervanner too, I don't know. you decide.
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As you said,our opinions should be valued.
Yes, that problem has always existed, several services make provision only for this to be abused and not ‘policed’. Unfortunately then forced to work around possibly causing issues for others.
Love the idea of the 500 van, I had a mini van which I kitted out for holidays as a youth. I classed it as a camper van, the CC at the time, and probably today certainly did not. When we were trailer tenting we had the unfortunate situation of being late at a site due to a road accident. We were told to go on the LNA and join others who had been caught in same jam. All concrete so impossible for us to erect, after a little discussion they let us on site. I was disappointed to hear one caravaner on the LNA groaning saying we had been given preferential treatment.1 -
That’s the spirit😁 The A1 is always a good choice, we travel mainly North on it, but some great places not far off for a look around. We parked our caravan up in car park at one or two big houses, so with a bit of checking, not hard to do.
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I wonder if local authorities are worried that if they provide parking for caravans and their attendant tow vehicles the place may be taken over by those who are permanently 'travelling' and who usually have caravans rather than motorhomes. In Launceston last year a public council owned carpark had been taken over by about 10 such vehicle combinations complete with the obligatory milk churns, generators and dogs on chains.
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That happens whether the car parks are intended for use by MH's, cars, HGVs….. The signage won’t keep them out so I don’t see that factor being a barrier to admitting touring caravans. I think the many other points stated in this thread are more likely to be the reasons.
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We have parked at Cribbs 2 or 3 times after confirming that caravans can use the coach parking area.
Its a very large area but you do have to reverse park.
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"What annoys me is the fact that provision is made for Motorhomers and campervanners but not for Caravanners".
"the Caravanners who replied have stated that there is no issue."
"Is this a common problem or is it anothe case of 'We Work around it'?"
Hi Busyelf, There are clearly differing wants and desires but, as I said, the type of facility you describe holds no appeal for me, and maybe others.
I for one am not saying there is not a problem but know there is not a lot I can do about it, and see no point in getting annoyed about something I cannot influence.
And yes, it is a common problem but again, for example, when faced with caravan spaces full of LGVs what do you suggest should happen?
And as 'over there' was mentioned our worst ever journey, so far as ability to take a break was a Sunday in France when LGVs are banned from the Autoroute and literally fill all the service areas-mind you do have the non facility aires to fall back on.
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"I was disappointed to hear one caravaner on the LNA groaning saying we had been given preferential treatment.". There's always one, right ?
So the caravanner didn't understand the requirements of a tralier-tenter. How dare he complain? !! (facial expression of Indignation here).
Allanandjean, Generally the Motorway Service areas are private land, therefore the only thig you can do really is speak to the site operators (car park attendant) and let them know the situation. Yes, complain to the staff on duty at the time. it may or may not get your a space but the offending vehicle's driver may get a fine or charges for his mistake. If it's reserved for caravans, other vehicles are breaking the terms and conditions. but I'm guessing each company have their own set of Ts &Cs. When spaces are at a premium, it's case of 'Any Port In A Storm'.
What is not clear is whether a car + camping trailer is allowed to park in a 'Caravan' area. or even a Motorhome of significant size. This is a very grey area of the whole parking thing, I would suggest that common sense prevail when taking into account the size of your rig and where to park it in a Mororway Service Area. Also Read The Signage.!
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Very true, there is usually one, occasionally several, when it comes to anything remotely associated with things perceived as not fair. Some don’t even want to recognise the reasoning behind some discussions and decisions made regarding rules, laws and guidelines. You only have to look at many a thread over the years on CT to find several instances of this. Now believe me, such discussion are good as they can serve to highlight issues and raise questions and occasionally changes. Sometimes they even serve to modify beliefs. It’s good to talk, good to value contributions and also possibly help those, me included, seeking solutions and/or clarification along the way.👍
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Just a quick update, I have contacted Moto, who operate a number of Motorway Service Areas around the UK and got their policy on parking for Caravans and Motorhomes, Tenters and Trailer-tenters.
Caravan Parking areas can be occupied by Cars with trailers or caravans in tow.
Motorhomes where possible can park in the general Car Park area, even if they occupy 2 spaces. unless they are too large and can then park in the Caravan Area.
Campervans as above.
Motorhomes and Campervans CAN park in the Caravan area even if they fit in a general car park area, and won't be penalised, (however it would seem prudent and respectful for smaller Campervans and Motorhomes to use the general car park areas to allow the use of Caravan spaces for caravans).. (words in brackets are my interpretation of the conversation with the representative of Moto).
I hope this clarifies things for anyone who isn't sure what should park where, on a Motorway Service Area.
As for Overnight parking of the above mentioned units, remember the cost can be well in excess of the cost of a pitch on a proper site per night and there are no service points for any one. It is a car park, not a campsite.
I am awaiting a reply from WelcomeBreak. but I am sure it will be along similar lines.
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Busyelf, there was a thread some years ago that stretched to many, many pages on the Service Stations and their inability to either provide adequate parking areas for caravans and motorhomes and/or their abject inability to enforce parking fines on those other drivers taking up these spaces when they could easily use the car park provided for them.
There was supposed to be some sort of collective agreement within the camping industry to do something about it but we never, to my belief, got a final definitive action plan even though I think the club were actively involved in trying to get something done. I can't remember the exact details and will try and hunt the old thread out but if anyone wants to beat me to it then feel free.
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Busyelf, this might be of interest to you.
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"Generally the Motorway Service areas are private land, therefore the only thing you can do really is speak to the site operators (car park attendant) and let them know the situation."
"Caravan Parking areas can be occupied by Cars with trailers or caravans in tow"
Hi Busyelf, All the points you make seem eminently sensible, the problem is that the reality doe s not match my experience.
What car park attendant? If you cant park how do you make you problem known??
We have come across, and reported several instances of van parking areas being 'abused'. Taken photos of LGVs parked in clearly marked areas, sent them to the vehicles operators, had a discussion last summer with an AA Relay driver who was about to pull into our space in a caravan area-his reply was its busy so I can park there as I have to have my break.
I am sure that your response will be positive but see no prospect, no matter how many emails, letters of complaint or whatever, are sent to the operators, if for no other reason than their income from LGVs, and in particular coaches, must far exceed what the cravanner brings in.
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Did they confirm that after the free period (2hrs usually) that 2 spaces = double pay? If so, just wondering how (or if) the ANPR system handles that?
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Plus the chances of getting two spaces together for the mid-sized, or even small, motorhome are pretty remote and there's little chance of fitting into a standard space. It means that anything bigger than a car, including AA Vans on their break, have to go in the caravan slots.
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I am assured that one vehicle = 1 charge regaless of spaces occupied.
As for other queries re parking on Motoroway Service Areas, as far as Moto are concerned at least are something out of the ordinary. i.e 8 foot wide caravans, other vehicle types being in Caravan Parking Bay. should be sorted out locally on the site the incident takes place with the Site Manager or any of his colleagues.
All of which are both frustrating and time consuming in what should be a relaxing time away from the hustle and bustle of daily life.
As for the legal provision re Caravan Parking areas on Motorway Servcie Areas. this needs to be sorted out in law as to what is an acceptable size of parking bay required for a caravan and tow-car in this modern era. This is the responsibility of the Local Council and Governement to sort out.
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To report abuse of caravan parking bays you can use the form at https://share.hsforms.com/1tdrJZpJXSviir2ENBV5PSQ46bdj. for MOTO Services areas.
Send please, and flood them with complaints of the abuse we get. There's a whole season of caravanning, yet, to get in Lol.
Or we could just avoid Motoroway Service Areas altogether and simplify our lives, but then we'd be shooting ourselves in the foot, so-to-speak as there wouldn't be a need for Caravan Parking and it would be withdrawn. lol
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Since I last posted, I have had a reply from Welcome Break. basically they are saying that there is abuse of the caravan parking spaces, but there is little they can do about it, especially at busy periods. At some of their sites, Caravan and Motorhomes have to use the HGV parking. Not ideal but at least you can park it. HGV parking is sometimes very smelly, due to spilled oil and other biological/non-biological fluids.
I hope I am not showing any bias towards Motorhomers or Caravanners here, but being a 'Caravanner' myself, I have my preferences.
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One of the main reasons I sold my motor caravan and bought a regular caravan was parking….or the lack of when every car park and supermarket acquired 1.85m barriers.
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The problem we have in the U.K., the absolute problem, is the caravan clubs and trade organisations will not challenge the ancient and outdated laws under which the industry and hobby is governed.
We are not in law a legitimate leisure activity, we are regulated by outdated laws introduced a century ago to regulate gypsies and travellers.
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