Help shape future facilities at UK Club campsites

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  • DavidKlyne
    DavidKlyne Club Member Posts: 14,061
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    edited April 2022 #32

    I have some sympathy with that view. Having read some of Peedee's link and the fact that participants are going to be paid suggests that there will be a fairly limited number taking part so quite how you get a cross section of a 350000 member organisation I am not sure. I am never sure with surveys whether my views are being manipulated to agree with a predefined hoped for conclusion? If the full  results from the research were going to be published I would feel a bit more confident. 

    David

  • Hja
    Hja Club Member Posts: 888
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    edited April 2022 #33

    Well, I have opted to take part.  Curiosity as much as anything.

    You had to access the initial "selection questionnaire" via a google email, but within that they say contact with you, if chosen, will be via my "ordinary" e mail address.

    Who know whether i shall be chosen!  I do also share many of the concerns expressed in earlier posts.

  • Unknown
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    edited April 2022 #34
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  • Tinwheeler
    Tinwheeler Forum Participant Trusted Posts: 23,335
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    edited April 2022 #35

    I simply recall the numerous times you’ve posted about it, David.

    Full facility / non-facility, is personal choice and that’s as it should be. Whether there are facilities or not does seem to affect the whole ambience of the site.

  • Takethedogalong
    Takethedogalong Forum Participant, Forum Participant Trusted Posts: 17,298
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    edited April 2022 #36

    We booked Marazion last year (for an event), and there was a degree of trepidation around our week’s stay. Sadly our CL option for the area had closed. But the price was very good, we have stayed loads of times before, and know the Site inside and out. It was full all our stay, but we really enjoyed it, still a tranquil little spot in a lovely location. Mind we did get one of our favourite pitches😁

    That’s an important Membership tick for us. Plenty of choice across the network in terms of not just the prices, but having quiet little areas even on the busy Sites. There’s all sorts of little changes the Club could trial on some of its Sites to try out new ideas, many are put forward on an almost daily basis on here. 

    I am not against any form of Market Research, but as this is a pay to join Club, I do think transparency on spending is important. 

  • nelliethehooker
    nelliethehooker Club Member Posts: 13,936
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    edited April 2022 #37

    AD, you have been on enough CC sites in the past to know what they are like, and there is sufficient information out there about each site, so why did you choose that site in the first instance? Surely there were enough other sites in the location for you to find one up to the usual standards of sites that you expect. So IMO you only have yourself to blame for selecting that particular site.

  • Unknown
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    edited April 2022 #38
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  • brue
    brue Forum Participant Posts: 21,176
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    edited April 2022 #39

    Apart from the survey request on here I've not seen the same anywhere else or via email. This seems like a very slim or narrow based operation? Who else is it reaching I wonder?

  • Takethedogalong
    Takethedogalong Forum Participant, Forum Participant Trusted Posts: 17,298
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    edited April 2022 #40

    It might be like those beauty product adverts brue………95% of 70 women surveyed swear it’s the best thing that ever happened to them🤣

     

  • nelliethehooker
    nelliethehooker Club Member Posts: 13,936
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    edited April 2022 #41

    Especially as the 70 were particularly selected. Wonder if that's what the initial questionnaire is for, so that they can select those that they are sure will give them the answers they want?

  • eurortraveller
    eurortraveller Club Member Posts: 6,851
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    edited April 2022 #42

    How to avoid younger parents with families taking part in the survey? Choose  three weekdays like 11, 12, 13 April when they are at work. 

  • Takethedogalong
    Takethedogalong Forum Participant, Forum Participant Trusted Posts: 17,298
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    edited April 2022 #43

    That’s a shame EuroT. It’s a group they really need to reach. The future.

    Mind, then I ask myself, would I give up any time off work to take part that I could enjoy more, so it’s not easy.

  • Cornersteady
    Cornersteady Club Member Posts: 14,618
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    edited April 2022 #44

    Does it say during office or school times only though, if it's online then it could run over 24 hours each day?

  • Dawn F
    Dawn F Forum Participant Posts: 167
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    edited April 2022 #45

    Seems another waste of our fees to me

    Surely they can gather information if they took the time to read club together and ask the members directly without the expense of going to another company which I bet is very expensive

    Another indication that the club has lost its way in providing a service to its members

  • nelliethehooker
    nelliethehooker Club Member Posts: 13,936
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    edited April 2022 #46

    Dawn, it looks good policy in their adverts when they state that they consult their members prior to making major decisions. However they don't say that the cost of the consultation comes out of the membership fees and that they don't take any notice of many the ideas that are out forward.

  • Takethedogalong
    Takethedogalong Forum Participant, Forum Participant Trusted Posts: 17,298
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    edited April 2022 #47

    Members could hope that the end report on findings and recommendations might be available to read at some point🤔

  • SeasideBill
    SeasideBill Forum Participant Posts: 2,112
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    edited April 2022 #48

    Agree - huge waste of members subscriptions. Unfortunately the business world is full of parasite management consultants. Organisations that have lost touch with their mission, customers and reality seem drawn towards them, presumably because they don’t have any good ideas of their own?

  • DavidKlyne
    DavidKlyne Club Member Posts: 14,061
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    edited April 2022 #49

    I think it rather silly to suggest that the Club shouldn't invest in research on what members may want as a waste of money. How can anyone judge whether it is a waste of money until we know the results? We all know that over the next 10/20 years the whole camping scene will probably change out of all recognition and clearly the Club has to try and be ahead of the game. Many of us by then (especially those that contribute to forums) will have probably hung up our EHU cables  and no longer taking an active part in the hobby. Hopefully the younger element of members will still continue with the hobby and new ones taking it up. A few things the Club will have to think about carefully for the future, and no real way of knowing what members thinks, unless asked are:-

    1) Will currently younger members want sites with more facilities or less facilities.

    2) How will the change over to EV impact of what members think about the hobby.

    3) Will there be a demand for far more static accommodation on Club sites? 

    4) Will changes in demographics mean less people owning LV's in the future but linked with 3 above would that lead to an increased demand for static units?

    5) Given the ever rising cost of energy would members be happy to have a metered electrical supply?

    These are amongst the things the Club may well want a steer on for the future of the Club. Please feel free to add your own burning issues. Now some will argue that all this information could be acquired by a simple survey sent out to all members? Even that would be expensive to collate and would probably have to be done by a third party probably at equal expense to what is being proposed in the OP? I hope those that take part will report back to us on their participation and what they thought.

    David

  • SeasideBill
    SeasideBill Forum Participant Posts: 2,112
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    edited April 2022 #50

    That’s me being rather silly then. 😵‍💫

    I wonder if you have any idea of the cost and value differential between organisation leaders, managers & stakeholders working things out for themselves (what they’re already paid for) versus a bunch of consultants at inflated daily rates, most of whom will have almost zero understanding, insight or interest in caravan, motorhome and related leisure issues? 

  • brue
    brue Forum Participant Posts: 21,176
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    edited April 2022 #51

    DK I too hope that anyone taking part will report back.

    Only once when I was working did our company employ an outside consultancy, we agreed later that they told us what we already knew! There are a lot of CAMC committees involved in different aspects of CAMC and I'm a bit surprised that there are not more ideas coming from these representatives. There are plenty of views on here, why not put out a few questions and see what the response is in general, it would certainly make the forum more interesting?

  • Hja
    Hja Club Member Posts: 888
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    edited April 2022 #52

    Well, I have been selected to take part in said survey. Like others, I have no idea who was told about the survey.

    I will receive an email on Monday giving me log in details. As far as I can tell, I have all day to answer the questions.

    we are actually away at present, so I will be completing each days task in the evening.

    I will endeavour to give you some idea of questions, but not necessarily my answers!!

  • eurortraveller
    eurortraveller Club Member Posts: 6,851
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    edited April 2022 #53

    Even here on this forum there are members who don’t use Club sites,  but the Club managers seem uninterested to know why that is or what would bring them back, as those members are excluded from the survey.

  • DavidKlyne
    DavidKlyne Club Member Posts: 14,061
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    edited April 2022 #54

    Well Bill, I was involved, in a minor way, with the introduction of an organisation wide, 80000, people, staff survey many years ago. The point being that people inside an organisation, if things are going OK, overall usually don't understand why some people within the organisation are unhappy or want changes. A forward looking organisation will look beyond their own thoughts and solutions, its a brave thing to do. The CMC is, as I see it, is a very traditional organisation and that probably permeates through the structure of the Club and I imagine tends towards a conservative approach to things. Don't forget the Club structure consists of two elements, the paid management and an elected Council. Perhaps the paid management want to move the Club on but there is a resistance from the more traditional parts of the Club. A survey of the nature being used may well be able to enlighten all sides to a way forward?

    David

  • SeasideBill
    SeasideBill Forum Participant Posts: 2,112
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    edited April 2022 #55

    All of that assumes the consultants have some value to add. I could play ‘top trumps’ with you about previous roles and experience, but what I do know is that management consultants of the type recruited for this exercise are largely a waste of money - we should  agree to differ. If an organisation needs refreshing, change the senior management team. The best bit of management advice I was ever given was ‘the team that gets you into trouble is not the one you need to get you out.

  • DavidKlyne
    DavidKlyne Club Member Posts: 14,061
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    edited April 2022 #56

    Surely the club is employing a company that specialises in research using the methods described by Rowena in her post. No mention of consultants? No doubt the Club would have fully discussed with them their aims and hopes of what they want to establish and then let the researchers use their skills to design and survey/focus group that can help establish what the Club want to know. It seems like good practise to me. 

    David

  • huskydog
    huskydog Club Member Posts: 5,464
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    edited April 2022 #57

    Is this going to be a case of the Club asking members their opinions and the go and do what they were going to do in the first place and ignore the members opinions? 

  • peedee
    peedee Club Member Posts: 9,499
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    edited April 2022 #58

    That is not necessarilly so HD but I do wonder at what the Club hope to gain by it. In my career I learnt to miss trust the the use of consultants/ surveys and considered most if not all a waste of a companiy's money. It didn't do the company I worked for much good, it no longer exists. I didn't immediately dismiss applying to take part in this survey but after some thought decided not to.

    peedee

     
  • Cornersteady
    Cornersteady Club Member Posts: 14,618
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    edited April 2022 #59

    It didn't do the company I worked for much good, it no longer exists

    That is implying that one led to the other, of course that might not be the case, companies go out of business or close for many reasons, having a survey or consultants isn't necessarily one of them?

    Did the company actually listen and act upon any information gained? Or did it just carry on? A survey gives just information and then they leave but if the company met or shared your mistrust then any changes probably wouldn't have been implemented with full support. Who knows but saying one led to the other is misleading?

    How far apart were the company no longer existing and the survey/consultants? At least the company tried?

    And all the club has done is employ a company to obtain some data, I can't see any mention of a consultant that people are going on about?

    For many years people on here have posted (rightly or wrongly) that the club doesn't listen to it's users of club sites, badly designed this... the club needs a rethink type of posts... people making decisions don't use club sites... Now when it tries to do that it get negative comments too?

     

  • Rocky 2 buckets
    Rocky 2 buckets Forum Participant Posts: 7,101
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    edited April 2022 #60

    If it’s got anything to do with Google it’ll be in part a harvesting exercise-I personally have no issue with that as it has served me well in the past but I need to be on board with the psychology & dynamic behind any harvesting practice.

  • SeasideBill
    SeasideBill Forum Participant Posts: 2,112
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    edited April 2022 #61

    no mention of consultants”, are you sure? What about the bit on their website….”Discovery Research is a qualitative and quantitative market research consultancy”. 

    There’s nothing in Rowena’s opening remarks that defines a problem and therefore to what, research is part of a solution.