Corona Virus Concerns
Comments
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Well in a way that makes my point, Nellie. I do have faith in the general British public and they have shown in vast numbers that they are prepared to put up with the current restrictions.
What I described as my "fear" is that without a bit of promised future reward, more may begin to question whether the sacrifice is worth it. And that will certainly be the worst of all worlds.
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I just can't see how it makes your point, M. There are many ready taking no notice of the restrictions at the moment, and any indication of the level of relaxation will only exacerbate the problem, IMO. The Gov are stuck between the devil and the deep blue sea. If they say that in a couple of weeks a certain section of the community can for instance, go back to work, there will be those who will try to do it immediately, ignoring the separation guidelines. Better to stay as we are at the moment and when there's proof that the number of cases and deaths have fallen start the relaxation then.
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No, you misunderstand, Nellie. I'm not suggesting they give any finite time scale. What I'd like to hear (and it's just my personal opinion) is some sign of what the thinking is when the time is right. As you say, there are idiots flouting the rules right now, I fear more will if there is no sign of hope. At the moment it's a bit like old Mr Grace saying "you're all doing very well" but where's the incentive to continue? I suspect that until Boris gets back in the driving seat none of the others will bite the bullet though.
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isnt the 'incentive' to remain alive?
at the moment (and not for a good while yet) there is no vaccine nor specific 'magic cure' drugs to prevent us catching it or saving us if we do...
which means we have to keep on with the social distancing measures which are gradually having an effect.
even though we want to 'get back out there', Im happy to stick it out for as long as it takes.
other (Comtinental) govts have drafted 'plans' of how the easing might happen... especially for the overseas tourist venues, so theres a few 'ideas' out there.
we, all of us, will have our own ideas...but different situations panning out will lead to different 'plans'.
i expect our Govt's plan will be a bit different to what we all 'predict', personally I'm happy to hear what they have to say when they're ready...
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M, I don't know if you were thinking of a document or statement along the lines of that put out by Nicola S today, but having just read through it there's nothing in it that indicates what way they will actually begin the relaxation. It's just a drawn out explanation of what has already happened, the indications that will need to be in place before any relaxation can take place, and will happened should the number of cases start to climb after the relaxation. All of this has been repeatedly said at the daily Gov briefings. I can't see what all the fuss is about her having published the document.
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I suspect the Government don't have a firm idea of what the road map out of this is as yet. Understandably their worst fear is that reacting too quickly will trigger a second wave of of the virus. New cases are still averaging 4500 a day, which is only a 1000 less than the peak which doesn't suggest its anywhere near over yet. Obviously testing, once up to anywhere near their target will provide a lot of useful information. So I am not altogether sure what they could announce. There have been suggestions that the construction industry would be the first go back to work but that hardly has any impact on those not involved in that industry. People in Newport Pagnell have just been informed by the Highways Agency that work on the M1 will soon recommence so there is also some movement there. I understand some DIY stores are starting to reopen but I assume they could have stayed open under current restriction? My own view is that they need to review the current regulations to inject a bit more common sense. For example you can by a fence panel but not a tin of paint. You can't move your car off your drive to wash it. Its silly things like this that need attending to first in my opinion. I can't see what I can do or indeed what I am willing to do changing in any way for at least a couple of months and probably a lot longer!
David
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No, I don't know what Ms S has said. But I'm assuming that there has been some discussion of the future plans in government. Given that the vast majority of the great British public have gone along with plans heretofore I just think there should be some indication that it has at least been thought about.
Still, none of us are likely to influence that decision - I guess that's what they get the big bucks for (not to mention the stress! )
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Notwithstanding the current level of support for restrictive measures, frustration levels will rise as time progresses quite apart from what will, no doubt, be increasingly strident voices about the economic consequences.
If I was totally callous, it could be argued that a clear out of wrinklies like me and subsequent cascading of wealth to younger generations is a positive. Decimation of care home residents would free up spaces and reduce hospital bed blocking. A cull of the morbidly obese and others who abuse their general health would ease the pressures on both hospitals and the welfare system. There would also be an easing of the housing crisis. It would also provide a bit more room for immigration/asylum seekers. Somewhat along the lines of the Royal Navy toast in Nelson's day "a bloody war or a sickly season".
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I'm sure that they have had lengthy discussion about the way forward, but are concerned that if they put forward their ideas too early, and then things deteriorate, either because people have jumped the gun or an unexpected fresh outbreak occurs, then the "great" British press will be down on them because they released their ideas too soon. Whatever happens they can't win.
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I can’t wait to listen to Boris answering Kier Starmer in a few months time. He tied Raab into a Gordian Knot yesterday. The fun might just have arrived back into politics.
Well, we didn’t get to Sheffield. There we were all glammed up for our big drive out (I put some earrings in and a necklace on, and a touch of lippy), phoned vets last thing to check, tablets hadn’t arrived at vets. So big change of plan, necklace off, earrings out and gardening gloves on. But I kept the lippy, neighbours most impressed “glamour gardening”🤣
Tomorrow is another day............(name that film🎥)😁
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The gov. have set out five tests that need to be met to end lock down, I suppose you could say until we reach those levels of safety we're not going to see an end to the present situation and then the next tentative stage forward.
I've just looked up the details HERE No doubt they're also on the uk gov site too.
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Blimey Cy, that’s a terrible way to look at the situation we are in. These victims are someone’s loved ones and some are NHS workers on the front line.
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Not a deliberate exercise EB, merely the possible consequences of these events.
TDA, Gone with the Wind.
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‘Tin pot revolutionaries’ only surface when a dictatorship is building. Keep the people in the dark, feed then misinformation, untruths, bad decisions, costing lives of the innocent. . .Yup, all ticked🤷🏻♂️. We live in a democracy, we should be kept informed, we need a plan going forward, no precise dates but an open ended plan. Certainly not obfuscation.
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+1, I see the reasoning too. I thought that due to the cavalier attitude of the regular trotted out statement-‘we are doing everything we can to protect the NHS’, yet they still fell & continue to fall, including our seniors-remember them?. Our Politicians are struggling to☹️
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Oh, I quite like a bit of speculation. CT could become rather dull without it. In this instance though I think the spokespersons are right to avoid it, despite constant goading by the media. I think we all have our own ideas on the subject. However, until the curves of infection and death rates are on significant downward trajectories and contact tracing is in place, I think they should just continue to reinforce the message on social distancing / staying at home. If they were to start discussing suggested exit strategies at this stage, it would take everyone's eye off this very important ball, as our focus would inevitably be switched.
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Wales about to get stricter about use of second homes.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-52396683
peedee
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Agreed....
in fact, if the Govt had done nothing.....or we all ignored the restrictions, what CY described would be a very likely outcome....survival of the fittest (most resistant)....rather than our actual focus of sheilding the weakest.
..and we could remove all the economic issues (wealth and health) from the equation.... and avoid the 'crash'....by leaving businesses open and trading.
Sweden have adopted a far less restrictive approach with life continuing 'almost as normal'...but numbers (compared to other Nordic states) are rising.
different paths, possibly different outcomes.
when deciding on how to manage the 'end game' there will be more different choices....and possibly different outcomes.
CY's post is not harsh in the least, merely reflecting 'plague' scenarios without understanding (and implementing) how to minimise the spread, as circa 1665/6.
'tis a grim topic so lets keep as safe as we can...
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This virus has shown just how vunerable every one is to any new illness. that as this one has(although predicted by some) ravaged many parts of the world ,and every one is on a very steep learning curve ,of how to manage the present virus ,, and will be on possibly even steeper curve when trying to fathom out how to manage the consequences to many countries economies ,
There are many "experts?" out there who are putting forward their "ideas?" but nobody really has any answers to what the fallout is going to be,
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My view, for what it's worth, and maybe I haven't been expressing it clearly enough, is that "speculation" flourishes in the absence of knowledge or information.
I fully expect that at the next review in a fortnight's time the decision will be for no change because the statistics, although improving, are not long term enough to justify any change. And that is absolutely the correct decision. In fact, as I've said earlier, I suspect there will be little real change before September at the earliest.
But I do think that, if we're considered adult enough to be given these instructions and repeatedly thanked by ministers at just about every interview for adhering to them (the vast majority), then we're also adult enough to be let into the government's long term thinking - there surely must have been ample discussion of this in COBRA meetings.
But it's just my view - others may disagree, that's the nature of discussion surely?
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i dont think it upsets others, not seen as such on CT has it?
it certainly doesnt upset me...i just dont think its time to reveal 'the Plan' (if they have one) just yet....
yes, there will be some ideas about what will happen as the five indicators get reached (or approached) but there are many combinations of the rate at which each are reached and it may be that, with those differing combinations, a tweaked 'plan' (different set of changes) may emerge.
the last thing any Govt wants is to start outlining 'what will happen' and then changing circumstances mean elements cant be delivered.
anyway, most of the measures are arbitrary not quantifiable (to the public)...
some folk are 'adults' but some clearly arent...
at the moment, the message is simple and clear enough even for the non adults to understand....even if they think a barbi on the beach is a better idea.
As said, things arent going to change much for a while yet, lets not get ahead of ourselves.....with repeated 'are we there yet', and 'what am i having for Christmas'
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There are stirrings in UK Government circles arguing for an early exit from lockdown because of the financial damage to the economy.
B&Q have opened almost all of their stores on a phased basis over the last 72 hours and preparations are under way to restore train travel.
That looks difficult to square with 'essential travel only' and maintaining social distancing for months ahead and an acknowledgement that vaccine development is still months away.
Awful financial figures released yesterday for UK, France and Germany; plans for lockdown exit to be released early next week by France, UK lobbying beginning, Germany already started.
Dangerous times to be short of food essentials!
Steve
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I think the general(logical) plan will be-release workers in industry(once PPE is eventually available) then the healthy older ones, then once a vaccine or a level of control over Corvid-19 is achieved. The ‘shielded’ being the last ones.
PS-I think PPE wear in this Country if not the world will be at levels only seen in Asia. It will be the norm.
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