Newby with loads of questions about touring abroad
Hi all.
Returning to caravanning after a 20 year break we intend to take our new caravan to Lake Como this summer (June/July)
Probably go Dover / Calais or Euro Tunnel - recommendations?
Then down through France to Annecy (motorways and tolls or A roads?)
Via the Mont Blanc tunnel into Italy then onto Lack Como. (La Riva site) - never driven in Italy, observations and advice very welcome
Possible home via Switzerland - good idea or not?
Appreciate any ideas, thoughts or improvements as the above is really all we have at the moment
thanks
Gary
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All lovely places. I am envious. Have you got time to do them all justice?
If time is short you may just concentrate on Annecy and the Chamonix area with the Juras included on the way there or back.
Or you could concentrate on a route through Switzerland with time there on the way to Lake Como, with Alsace included on the way there or back.
But if you have time then do them all - though the cost of motorway tolls, tunnel fees and Swiss vignettes will be top side of 300 euros for the whole route.
Good luck.
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thanks for the reply
we'll probable take about 4 weeks for the whole trip with 7 days in Como and decent stops on the way there and back.
Last time we were in France the tolls were not too bad, have they become much more expensive? Is it viable to do the trip without road tolls?
Also whats is the Swiss Vignette? New concept to me!
sorry to be a pain but new to all this now
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Tolls for car and caravan...Calais to Annecy €107, Mont Blanc tunnel €60, across Italy to La Riva site €50 , vignettes (permits) to cross Switzerland €35 for car plus €35 for Caravan, homeward tolls across France extra depending on route. It adds up !
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I have traveled the route via Switzerland and the Saint Gotthard tunnel on three occasions now, but on one occasion travelled back via Mont Blanc tunnel. To be honest there isn't much in it. Personally I would go via Switzerland as the views and scenery are stunning.
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You really need to reconsider what you want to achieve on your 4 week 'holiday' towing a caravan all the way to Lake Como: it's a long way and going via Annecy doesn't seem to make much sense.
To cover such a long distance you're going to travel on toll roads. In France and Italy it's pay as you go, in Switzerland it's fixed rates for both your car and your caravan by buying a stickers.
Why not consider a less challenging trip for your return to caravanning?
A journey down through France with Lake Annecy as your destination might be more of a holiday.
p.s while French motorways have frequent well-appointed service/rest areas for caravans, Italian motorways have very restricted stops with very short slip roads and nightmarish lorry traffic between Turin and Milan.
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Thanks for the comments, the reason for Annecy is because we went there with our last caravan about 25 years ago, so its a nostalgia trip. Drove from Paris to Annecy in one go then had about 4 days before heading to Toulon. This time we'd like to go to Italy as we've flown there many times but never been to Como.
Are you suggesting returning via France would be better?
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If travelling to Annecy, why not go via Brussels, Liege, drop down through Luxembourg to Metz and on to Annecy that way. Cuts down on tolls, is a good route and a chance for cheap fuel in Luxembourg. I'm headed to Annecy in June and planning to avoid toll motorways all the way down. Adding Lake Como to the itinerary is a lot in four weeks, particularly if towing.
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Last year leaving end of May, we went via tunnel (we have 2 dogs) and travelled down to the Lakes via Reims, Metz, Strasbourg (well worth a visit) into Switzerland (stunning scenery) with a stay at Lake Lucerne. From there down to Lake Maggiore for a few days and then due to some wet weather, missed a couple of the lakes and went straight to Lake Garda. As we seemed so close to Venice, went there for a couple of nights at a very god site just over the bridge (far too many people in Venice and the heat wave had started). Next down to Pisa, La Spezia for the Cinq Terres, Portofino and then headed back via Genoa, Turin and with a few days at Annecy and Geneva. Travelled back up through France and stayed for a couple of nights at Lac D’Orient near Troyes. All of this in just over 4 weeks. With hind-sight, would not have gone quite so far and taken a bit more time in Switzerland and the Italian Lakes. I felt that going so far meant we didn’t spend long enough in each area. This year - Spain and Portugal for 5 weeks. Enjoy your trip.
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Why not do what I think many of us do? That is book to get across the channel by whichever route you want and have a very general idea of which area you want to head for. We have done this on numerous occasions and ending up by not reaching our 'expected' destination as we found lots of very interesting places on the way and spending several days there. On one occasion an overnight stop resulted in 7 nights because there was so much to see. Weather can also dictate where you end up going.
Although we have and do use the autoroutes from time to time, cost aside, you see far more by going by other routes. Maybe slightly slower but it is supposed to be a holiday, after-all, not an endurance race.
Going in June / July we have never found the need to book a site in advance apart from an overnight stop in Dover before crossing.
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i can see John's and David's points of view...weve done both...
in fact, this break we are doing a bit of both but have made the 'destination stop' our first one (other than overnighters on the way) ....mainly because detours in France arent yet warm ones...
weve already decided to stay a little longer where we are settled (its nice and the weather isnt any better without drivng another 500km) yet still allow plenty of time for exploring on the way home as the weather warms up in north eastern spain and southern france.
only an outline 'plan' for the return, but having plenty of time allows for the odd turn off that doesnt quite pan out...
luckily, many of them do....
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weve already decided to stay a little longer where we are settled (its nice and the weather isnt any better without drivng another 500km) yet still allow plenty of time for exploring on the way home as the weather warms up in north eastern spain and southern france
careful what you wish for another Gota Fria forecast for Murcia region, my daughter teaches in Villa Martin and schools already closed for Monday
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Hmmm, starting to have second thoughts based on the above. Perhaps we should stick to France this time, probably still via Annecy though but where after that?
Leave Italy until next year?
Still think I prefer the idea of staying off motorways if possible though.
Gary
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Gary I can’t help you with France I’m afraid but Italy has so much to offer that its worth a few holidays on its own. We’ve been going for 40 years and still haven’t seen the majority of it. Como is a long way and if you want to stay in Annecy for a time you will probably find yourself rushing instead of relaxing. In our experience Como has charisma but the sites can be cramped and the pitches small. Walking and cycling from the sites is limited although there are lots of ferry’s to use. Sites around Lake Maggiore tend to be more open. Sites along the north Adriatic coast have lots of opportunities for walking and cycling. Every town and city in Italy is worth a visit.
As others have implied; tolls on the routes from France into Italy are quite expensive. You will need two motorway vignettes through Switzerland (one for your car, one for your caravan). However, Switzerland is a beautiful, if very expensive country, and well worth a visit. The St Gottard tunnel into Italy is recommended if you do go to Como.
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Dave, Thanks for the reply. Yes we've done lots of Italy by air and fly/drive, including Lakes Maggiore and Garda. Florence, Rome, Venice, Siena and much of the west coast. We still want to go to Como but maybe by air.
More and more I'm thinking of reconsidering this trip and I thank folks for their comments.
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I always spend some time planning our trip; checking out reviews on campsites and what there is to see so I have a detailed plan. Invariably because we never book anywhere we don't stick to it all but play it by ear as we go along. We spent six weeks in 2017 visiting the Jura, Chamonix and Lake Annecy and I wouldn't have wanted to fit in anything else but we do like to see everything of note in an area. My blog on the trip might give you a few ideas We tend to use the peage for ease of towing and I note the cost for that trip was £225.
https://jennyandjohngocaravanning.wordpress.com/2017/06/19/2017-jura-alps-and-lake-Annecy/
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Hi Anne/Gary, lots of info and suggestions for you to consider.
It is often difficult not to ask questions about a post, to clarify what you think the poster is asking, so I would ask why Camping Riva?
its in quite an isolated location and, as said, not the easiest or cheapest place to get to. We have stayed near Como and site choice may be greater than on the lake, as it is in lots of places-like Annecy.
There is another recent thread on here where it seems the main, if not only reason for going, is that its a site bookable wit h the club.
So far as costs are concerned one of the best ways to check is to use the viaMichelin site to plan the route. This will give you infinite options and a very accurate cost breakdown which will allow you to compare the relative costs of differing routes.
I am currently looking at routes to.....................Annecy!
We will land in Roscoff and the first thing thats become clear is the distance will require two overnights and using viaMichelin and Google maps/Streetview is great for planning.
So far as the timing is concerned June will see lots of sites available via the ACSI card, July not so many, but sites such as Eurocampings and Campingfrance will give lots of alternatives as well.
Enjoy the planning and the trip!
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Hi Anne,
Before retirement we used to tow the caravan down to Garda, with 2 big dogs and did that in 2.5 - 3 weeks. For those trips we used to go via Lille, Namur, Metz then cross into Germany for toll free motorways. Once into Germany we would head for Stuttgart, Ulm and then pass Innsbruck on the motorway and then through the Brenner Pass. In those days we were a lot younger and happy doing long days driving.
I think if your going that distance you have to use motorways for the bulk of the journey when time limited. If you were going for 6+ weeks you could get away with non toll roads.
We drove to Italy last September, we were away 5 weeks, did 12 days in Tuscany for a family wedding then hopped up to Lake Garda for 2 weeks. We went down via Belgium and Luxembourg then across to Strasbourg and down to Basel and through the St Goddard tunnel. However, we considered the first half of that trip too exhausting and difficult because of the extremely heavy traffic, especially lorries. It was slow going and very different from 20 years ago. We agreed that we were prepared to pay the tolls on the way back, which we did from Nancy to Calais. There is no need to pay tolls on the southern part of that trip.
We will be going to Garda in June again this year, again for 5 weeks round trip and will use the toll roads for the first half of the trip to Strasbourg.
if you really want to go to Como consider taking the shorter route and do Annecy another time. But, whatever you do, enjoy.
BillC
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Funny, ha ha! More horse power?
BillC
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For what it's worth, we drove down to Riva in June, 2018: Dover-Calais and 1st night stop in Luxembourg. Then to Lech in Germany for a few nights. Then Nattersee just outside Innsbruck for 4 nights. On to Lake Garda for a week, via the Brenner Pass and then a week at Riva. returned via the Mont Blanc Tunnel, stopping at La Colombiere for 4 nights [with easy access to Geneva] and then to Lac de Liez for a few nights. Final stop at Chateau Gandspette to sort out the dog's vet visit then an hour drive to Calais. The outward route avoided France's toll fees and dodged Switzerland's motorway fees. Mont Blanc tunnel isn't cheap though. Get an E-Movis tag for the French tolls - it saves the hassle of getting tickets and paying fees every time you go through a toll plaza. We really enjoyed Riva; relaxed atmosphere and a scenic venue. A short drive to the lake ferry system. Obviously each to their own but it was a great trip
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Thanks for all the above comments.
In light of these our plans have 'evolved' or perhaps 'contracted' somewhat.
We are now considering just staying in France and travelling to the Annecy area via Reims and returning via Strasbourg. Not as big a trip but we can always do Como another year.
Its reading the above that makes me realise how much things have changed and how much we don't know. What are emovis and ACSI.
more confused now that before. Thanks though, very useful info.
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ACSI is a camping card offering discounted site fees valid for a year and out of peak season only. It is available from the Club and comes with guide books. You can find more information about the system >here<
I have a fairly large motorhome and tolls in France can work out fairly expensive so I tend to avoid using them if I can. If it is any help you can read more about the route we took to Annecy >here<
peedee
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E-Movis explained here: https://www.caravanclub.co.uk/membership/member-offers/sanef-toll/ It prevents the need to get a ticket when entering a toll route and then paying when exiting; and thereby requiring your passenger to get out for same. You get charged on a monthly basis and pay by direct debit. makes it all a lot easier. The tolls aren't cheap but the roads are good..
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