A Club Dilemma!
I have just read a rather scathing review which criticised some member's children and their parent's attitudes in respect of non supervision, which many of us can relate to. We often see cars which continually drive far too fast on site and members who arrive far too early when specifically advised in the Member's Book and on the booking site, not to do so at sites such as Chatsworth or Borrowdale, due to the narrow access roads. I wondered what the Wardens or the Club can actually do about these problems, if anything at all?
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You forgot irresponsible dog owners. I thought I’d say that before someone blames the dogs.
I'm afraid that until the club takes the bull by the horns and fully backs wardens and empowers them to throw people off the site then there is little to be done. Such action would then be needed to be followed up by the club with membership being revoked if necessary. Can you see that happening?
I find it strange that breaching the T&Cs of this forum can carry a stiffer penalty than rule breaking on site.
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How often do we see not only on caravan sites but in life in general the attitude of "the rules are for everyone but not for me"?
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I, too, rarely see anything to complain about, WTG, but it seems others do, especially at peak times.
I wrote my earlier post on the assumption that the complaints to which the OP refers were justified but we'll never know.
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as I have often said, what happens on site and what is reported to happen on CT are two very different things in terms of the number of occurrences. To read things on here does give a very distorted view.
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Morning,
Your last sentence sums up CT altogether
Not everyone can sift through to find facts!!JK
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Reviews about uncontrolled children that should have more control exercised. I have seen it but it is not a common occurrence.
I have come across totally unacceptable behaviour and taken action on two occasions that I remember over about the last 1,500 site nights on a mixture of sites but probably at least 1,000 of those being on CC sites.
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indeed , much easier to believe what is written on here by a tiny percentage (CT poster v people using club sites) of those that actually use club sites.
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From our early caravanning days we do feel that there is now a combination of more unruly children, versus an increase in the flow of complaints - forums like this being one outlet for releasing one's blood pressure!
But it is difficult to say whether this is because children are less well controlled, or an increase in intolerance by adults. I can recall being on a campsite some years ago at Woodhall Spa. There was a family with two children, where the children were made to carry out chores and were quickly warned if they came even close to the risk of annoying a neighbour. On one occasion the parents apologised to us for some misbehaviour, but we could not fathom what had been done wrongly. We had been thinking 'what well behaved kids they were' but, on reflection, we began to feel sorry for them being under so much discipline.
I have no doubt that there are isolated instances of unacceptable bad behaviour, but the incidences of this being outrageous are probably enhanced by over zealous complaining.
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Is there a general belief in children getting worse, and is it justified?
I know how bad I was as a kid, growing up in the 40's/50's, on reflection I am amazed at how much worse my children were than me in the 70's/80s. However their kids are beyond redemption, so have I become more intolerant in old age or are things getting out of control?
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Don’t blame the children. Parenting appears to be very different than when I was at school. My niece is Deputy Head at the same school I attended as a child, quite a long time ago. Some of the stories she tells us about are heartbreaking, certainly I cannot recall any of my former class mates having to face the kind of upbringing some of her pupils endure. It’s no wonder some of them have such behavioural issues with the home lives they lead. The staff often have to feed the children they are so hungry, and some are given washed charity clothing just to keep them warm, which they get to keep for how ever long it takes the parents/ latest girlfriend/boyfriend to sell on!
Every child needs to be taught boundaries and good behaviour, but it needs empathy and understanding to do it properly and without cruelty. Making children is for most folks very easy. But raising them properly, to become good citizens, to consider others as well as themselves is a lifelong commitment way beyond the capabilities of some, sadly. The news is all too full of parents/ carers who have put their own desires in front of their poor vulnerable children. It’s very sad.
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yes had some first and experience of that just before half term, although at secondary level. I was doing some day supply work and noticed that a really lovely lad literally had a shoe that was falling to pieces. I mentioned it to the head of year (an old friend) who said that they had given the money from the LA to the lad's parents who had simply spent it on drink. To speed things up all the staff had put their own money in and the HoY was actually taking the lad to get some shoes that day.
In the same class was a horrible girl with no manners and disruptive. She was wearing one of those Canada Goose coats, if you don't know how much they cost google it but sit down first! Life really isn't fair is it?
I also used buy food for some kids in my last job.
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The problem is that writing a review with such comments is a bit pointless unless the writer complained to the warden at the time and nothing was done. Incidents of the nature mentioned by the OP are "moments in time" and most of us probably never witness them. I am sure wardens try their upmost to use discretion in dealing with problems. Wardens no doubt do have the power to remove people from a site but I expect that is only exercised in extreme circumstances and the threshold for using that power is probably a lot higher than a single aggrieved member thoughts on the same subject?
David
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In the 1950s and early sixties onwards my Aunt and Uncle ran a fish and chip shop in Hull across the road almost from the Reckitts Factory. They adopted 4 children unofficially. My aunt dearly wanted children and suffered two phantom pregnancies. They had often provided a fish meal or similar for local children whose parents could not or would not look after them. With the parents' consent they brought up 3 lads and one girl from a deprived background over a number of years there was probably a 10 year age range between them. One moved to Australia and another as a nurse in New Zealand. One joined the army and I remember seeing all his boxing trophys. The last one worked in local shops until the death of my Aunt (my uncle having died earlier). Poverty is nothing new
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There was a family with two children, where the children were made to carry out chores and were quickly warned if they came even close to the risk of annoying a neighbour.
We don't know however if it was the parents way of correcting previous bad behaviour
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Reviews are just a snap shot, I'm glad people have the opportunity to write them. Occasionally they let off steam about something they wish to say but often it's only related to their experience not everyone else's. If every review said the same I'd be concerned but most don't. If I was the OP I'd be looking at more reviews and forming a broader view.
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wow, manages to bring in over there even in a thread like this, respect David
Btw I agree with you
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From the few sites that I have read reviews about I would far rather read CC reviews rather than C&CC reviews.
Either C&CC sites are utopian wonders or the reviews published are selective in my view. Can't recall seeing reviews with less than 4.5 stars and so all are ignored
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actually found one by accident when I was looking at Malvern sites for that other thread, it said site staff do nothing about noisily campers
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First two!! Wonder if they will stay?
First one complains of being asked what they were doing and being told that they could not stay as the site was not open. The reviewer shall never return to this site
Second one because the warden would not guarantee an adjacent pitch for their friends arriving later. The reviewer was uncertain that they wanted to stay in an unfriendly and backward thinking club.
Now if they had more reviews like that I might find them amusing
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Agree there’s nothing new about poverty. But it is rather more shocking in this day and age, a good few decades on from my childhood. However, my real point is that it isn’t the amount of income in terms of how a child is raised, (I know of some seriously wealthy families whose children have issues). It’s all about the love, the morals, the guidance, the growing up in a stable environment where children learn from their parental role models. That’s where the issues really lie, and sadly, in some instances, good intentions are diluted every next generation. It’s a very strong child that can emerge successfully from some of the inept, couldn’t care less households nowadays. One hour browsing a few of the threads on Mumsnet is rather terrifying in many ways.......😲
Thankfully a minority, but that minority take up huge funding and attention, and the end results still don’t justify the efforts. First thing I was taught as a trainee teacher, how to spot neglect, physical, financial and emotional. All very different.
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Agree, in any school you will find 'rogue' families where all the siblings exhibit similar bad behaviour so you could say it was a case of parental influence (especially when the father was constantly being arrested as in one case) but more intriguing to me was cases where it was just one child who was horrible and the rest lovely. And looking back there wasn’t a pattern, it wasn’t always the last, middle or whatever child. Nature or nature?
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My OH taught in Birkenhead for quite a while and retired with ill health in her mid forties before later doing other work. There were certainly some children from deprived areas. She was aware of children not decently clothed etc and there was a supply of good secondhand clothing in the school that was kept by staff and used.
But I remember her talking of one mum who lived in a damp and poorly maintained rental property where some of the home was virtually unusable. The lady was a single mum with two kiddies in primary school and no husband and appeared pretty poor. (OH had only been to the house because one of the children was taken ill).
She said that the mother the two children were always clean and well dressed and a couple of the nicest kids she had met.
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I think people who are themselves parents are quickly able to recognise whether another child's behaviour is naturally bad, because attitudes are not easy to disguise. These two children were polite and easy to converse with - when the opportunity occurred, and they were not under close scrutiny. Having them on the adjacent pitch for a week plus, I reckon that nothing untoward happening in that time was sufficient to indicate that they were nothing less than well behaved children.
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Our daughter has 3 daughters, they are all a joy to be with, funny and kind. When we take them out they stand back to allow adults to pass, sadly the adults rarely say thank-you. The girls always say please and thank you and strangers often comment on them being polite, which, while being nice to hear, I find a shame that it is remarked upon as this should be the norm. Recently it came to my daughter's attention ( not through the school) that one of the girls had answered back to a teacher. My daughter sat her down and made her write the teacher a letter of apology. We often find, if the parents are rude, spoilt and arrogant, then so are the kids.But we have found many fun loving polite children on sites too.
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Recently it came to my daughter's attention ( not through the school) that one of the girls had answered back to a teacher. My daughter sat her down and made her write the teacher a letter of apology.
I hope 'DEBSC' that your daughter enquired also as to why her daughter felt the need to answer back to a teacher. Sometimes there lies an underlying story to these things.
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