Steamer Quay refurb removal of non EHU pitches
Comments
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What CY states about solar energy being less as you move north is definitely true judging by web sites I have looked at, but I wonder how much difference this makes in practice. Presumably nothing like enough to cause any trial in the north to fail as he suggests earlier in the thread.
One site I read states that in the south west, solar energy generated is 30% more than in Shetland. So in the north of England, presumably not that big a difference and, anyway, even 30% doesn't sound like enough to me to mean failure.
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So really then you've disproved your idea that the club is (CAMC) deliberately setting up the trial to fail so that they can say "Nobody wants non EHU" ?
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I'll take that as a no?
Actually you've already answered the same question to me that even a £5 difference on any club site wouldn't tempt you so, although entitled to your views, why not leave it to those that do use club sites and market forces?
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Please let me reassure potential visitors to “the North” we do get copious amounts of sunshine up here😁 Your solar panels will be fine😁 We invested in a quite large pool this Summer, it was cold filled, no heating, every day, but sun warming had us just step into it and spend hours at a time in it👍
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It's beginning to look (a lot like Christmas?) like the Club is slowly ironing out all the 'interesting' sites in its portfolio, moving towards a single model that has a 'template' of HS/SP electric pitches.
despite the requests for more members to 'please use less electric' the club is removing the very sites where no electric is used....work that one out🤷🏻♂️
the once slightly quirky elements of the network are disappearing fast to be replaced by something far more bland, vanilla and far less interesting.
oh well, the club burnt its last remaining bridge with us earlier in the year and the current trend of more clones will do nothing to entice us back, certainly as these redevelopments will add to their prices....
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Again you appear to be the judge of what is 'interesting' or quirky and replacing them by something far more bland, vanilla and far less interesting, or more clones.
That's just your view though, it is not the truth or in anyway a fact, or in anyway applies to all those who actually use club sites?
Who know but perhaps these quirky or less interesting sites just weren't viable? That maybe not enough people found them as interesting as you claim? Maybe the people that pay to use use club sites (and even you admit a lot do in their thousands) actually like the way club sites are with their single model template? It's not for you now you say so why not leave it to those that do like and use them and see if the club has got it right with this redevelopment?
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It's not for you now you say so why not leave it to those that do like and use them and see if the club has got it right with this redevelopment?
It would seem the club don’t have much choice. Wasn’t it a stipulation of the tender that the site be improved and made suitable for all year use? Whilst that might not need SP’s it does require HS and EHU. Your not going to get many takers using Calor in the winter months. Wether the EHU is metered or not isn’t that relevant, as posters on here who want to use their solar don’t seem prepared to pay the price of even a standard pitch sans EHU.
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Yes but BB was talking about all the 'interesting' sites
But that aside yes what you post is all true as well about the tender and the council appears to be keen on the idea that it will be open all year and bring in money for the local business. And of course and if the site is going to be open all year it does require a minimum of HS and EHU as you say. As I said it's now on my list.
And +1 to your last sentence.
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Its unimaginable to me that the Club would spend £1 million plus to refurbish this site and still retain "economy pitches". Only a guess on my part but I reckon as many members have been disenfranchised over the years because the site did not have EHU us those that used the site. Installing EHU to all pitches disenfranchises no one as all can use the site. Of course it's going to cost more to stay there, the same as it costs more to stay at Morn Hill since that was upgraded. Full marks to South Hams Council for recognising that it is important to have a modern campsite in the town. Just a shame that Councils in Bristol and Crystal Palace don't have the same attitude.
David
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... it I though I read that SQ was 'busy' all year round without the upgrade? If true, then it's the location and value of the site (also 'value' as in a different proposition to the usual fare) that attracts them.
if the site is usually full, then a refurb can't make it 'more full'...in which case it's only by raising prices that the cost of the refurb be recouped🤷🏻♂️
ergo...pointless exercise😉
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No perhaps incorrect on a few things.
Firstly a few more pitches will be added so potential extra income there, and it might make more money in the future than at present that will not only cover the cost of the re-development but then even a profit that can be used for other uses within the club. Also you don't know if the site was losing money in the first place?
And lastly it was not open all year round but as it will be now that will certainly bring in more potential income.
As said it's also what the local council want too. But if you've burnt your bridges with club sites it won't make much of a difference for you?
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Trying to shut you up? Repeated attempts? Not at all I assure you BB, I'm simply pointing out a fact that you often post about that you won't be using club again and it won't affect you in any way.
Rather than make personal remarks and be rude why not reply to the points I raised countering your ideas about it being pointless exercise to redevelop the site?
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" ...as ever with CT, this is a discussion forum of which I'm a member and it's a subject I have interest in .....
.... so, I'm still happy to participate in the forum."
Well said, YT - I wish some other members would show a similarly enlightened view to those of us who are happy to contribute to threads we still have an interest in. Sadly some are rather more blinkered in their outlook!
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+1
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Well done CAMC for modernising the Totnes site.
To me it’s incredible that there should be UK campsites in tne 21st century without an electricity connection. I believe there are also still some UK sites without flush toilets and showers and I find that incredible too. It is not like that in mainland Europe. A campsite like that simply wouldn’t get a licence to be allowed to operate.
I’m afraid that in some ways Britain is way behind the times.
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...but on mainland Europe there is often an option not to take the EHU and to stay at a reduced price...
nothing to do with being 21st century, other than in the thinking that's applied, in that the customer gets an easily managed choice in one place and not the other...
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As there is/will be choice at Totnes. The choice will be either the club site with full facilities and EHU or the car park outside with a rubbish bin. 🤷🏻♂️
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Well there were two we stayed at this year that only had flush toilets and showers part of the year. They were previously municipal sites and now operate as non facility for 6 months of the year.
I suppose that would be an option for SQ if they installed some barrier technology so it could operate without full time managers.2 -
But that's not the same as having that choice inside SQ...
perhaps if meters are installed then that will be achieved, but more cost so don't see it happening.
as Steve says there certainly could have been the opportunity to add even more 'tech' with card controlled barrier entry/exit alongside metered bollards which would have reduced the long term running costs, making the recouping of the redevelopment a shorter term task.
however, despite the 'green' rhetoric, the club doesn't seem to be moving towards lower cost, lower price, less 'impact' sites....in fact, it's the complete opposite.
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For the last 20 years at least, South Hams council have only given annual leases, whilst they decided on various redevelopment options, all of which were robustly dismissed by the local people, many of whom do not want the area further gentrifying. The site is one of our favourites, but was getting run down and it is good to hear that the club is moving swiftly to improve the site. Only possible grumble is that fully serviced pitches will be more expensive, but I will be very pleased to have hookups.
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I’ll Ieave you to it as much of your post is not in reply to mine but I too am glad to see you understand that folk who don’t use club sites can still have an interest in what goes on.
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No it isn't but why should that choice be offered at all? If you want an SP and EHU use SQ if not have the minimal 'site' outside. A clear easy choice for everyone and catering for different needs?
You have mentioned card entry systems before but I can't see any advantage over ANPR systems and why you mention that system in a number of threads?
There are already card entry systems in place at club sites with barriers (all the ones I've used have them) so not sure what you mean by keeping costs down?
But it does involve you holding the card next to the reader and that means stopping completely, opening your window and losing heat and if it is raining getting your arm and bits of your vehicle wet. With an ANPR system there's no stopping and no winding down your window? As I said can't see any advantage for a card system, especially now we have the ability to be pre-paid before arrival.
Again if the green aspect bothers anyone then use a site where one's beliefs can be put into practice. As you posted once before shouldn't we all try and keep energy usage down no matter if we're told or not?
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...metered bollards which would have reduced the long term running costs, making the recouping of the redevelopment a shorter term task.
I've already posted about why possibly an entry system won't reduce costs.
But why would metering reduce running costs? Electricity used has to be paid for, either by the club with 'our money' in the overall night's stay or by the club taking the money from those using the meter.
It might, might possibly, reduce consumption, might reduce the cost to someone using a meter, although that's been debated before and not assured, but not the cost of electricity used?
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The ones in France were MH only in the winter and I couldn’t understand why. If SQ went down that route in the winter I don’t see why it shouldn’t be for any RV’s with on board facilities. Lots of caravaners use non facility sites, which is basically what it could become in the winter. Costs would be lower and it could therefore operate at less than optimum capacity and still make a profit.
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Removed by me...
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Steamer Quay would be the idea site to try metered electricity because there is currently no EHU infrastructure. As they are starting from new the addition of metering would probably be of minimal extra cost compared to converting and existing site. Steamer Quay also has the advantage of having relatively few pitches which would further reduce costs but provide useful information on how the Club proceed or otherwise with metering on other Club sites. All that metering will do is remove the cost from the Club to the user, so overall the average Club member is unlikely to notice much difference but those that are happy to rely on their own power generation might benefit from a modest cost saving. There is also the assumption that electricity prices will continue to remain high which I think is wrong. Whilst we don't yet generate all of our electricity from renewable sources that element in years to come will increase and should lower costs which will add another question about whether metering has any cost benefits to Club/Members?
David
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But listen why not reply to the questions I asked? How will metering and entry barriers reduce costs?
In the scenario I suggested above, metering wouldn’t but intelligent barriers would mean the site could be run as non facility in the winter months with minimal manager input. Perhaps they could employ someone local to sort out any problems and for cleaning / checking service points. The site could then perhaps run at a profit, even with reduced numbers.
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Yes and I liked that idea when you posted it, I don't know the area so is there a concern that it won't get used over the winter? I got the impression that with the new HS, SP and EHU it would attract people all year?
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