Raptor Persecution

mickysf
mickysf Forum Participant Posts: 6,474 ✭✭✭
2,500 Likes 1000 Comments

I think I can guess what will happen to this despicable person. Another atrocity! When will it end?

https://www.birdguides.com/news/wiltshire-gamekeeper-charged-in-largest-english-raptor-persecution-cas/

We go out into the countryside to enjoy the great outdoors, what drives them?

«1

Comments

  • neveramsure
    neveramsure Forum Participant Posts: 712
    500 Comments
    edited May 2022 #2

     

    These are heartless people with no regard for the law or the love of wildlife. These cases make my blood boil. When are we going to set an example with one of them getting a hefty jail sentence?

    Here is another example of a flawed system.   https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-nottinghamshire-60156311

     

     

  • mickysf
    mickysf Forum Participant Posts: 6,474 ✭✭✭
    2,500 Likes 1000 Comments
    edited May 2022 #3

    Like is an inappropriate word, agree would be far better! Totally heartless and lacking of an understanding of nature! 

  • mickysf
    mickysf Forum Participant Posts: 6,474 ✭✭✭
    2,500 Likes 1000 Comments
    edited May 2022 #4

    Oh no, not again. The shooting fraternity really do need to sort these horrific incidents out once and for all! This one it seems has royal connections!

    https://www.birdguides.com/news/goshawk-trapped-in-suspected-persecution-case-on-norfolk-estate/?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=newsletter160522&dm_i=73DM,69IW,ZVCQL,QAOG,1

    We love going to the Norfolk CAMH sites to enjoy the wildlife. Shame on the privileged Van Cutsems!

  • Pliers
    Pliers Forum Participant Posts: 1,864
    1000 Comments
    edited May 2022 #5

    I was quite shocked to read that the gamekeeper involved is a 21year old man. 
    I’d always assumed (wrongly obviously) that this attitude was just with older people, carrying on their traditional ways. 
    Beyond belief  in 2022. 😱

  • ABM
    ABM Forum Participant Posts: 14,578
    1000 Comments
    edited May 2022 #6

    Pliers,  it is not a 'new' case ~~ I understand that it is over 2 years old !!  So the Gamekiller was about 18 or so at the time.

  • mickysf
    mickysf Forum Participant Posts: 6,474 ✭✭✭
    2,500 Likes 1000 Comments
    edited May 2022 #7

    This really makes it so much worse. The fact that a young man has been guided, mentored and supported in these despicable actions by shady others. As such he was deliberately abused by his elders, those in authority, those who show no decent and respectful role model and care little for him and more about their own hides. Dreadful!  as for the birds, well they in their eyes are just in the way of their ill gained profits.

  • Wherenext
    Wherenext Club Member Posts: 10,586 ✭✭✭
    5,000 Likes 1000 Comments Name Dropper
    edited May 2022 #8

    The only way this is going to be stopped is from the top downwards as us "lower" people haven't had much luck in changing attitudes of the landowners.

    Pressure needs to be brought to bear on the Royal family to shame Van Cutsem into changing what is obviously now inbred into him and his like. Until landowners are publicly shamed by the law by hugely significant fines and even prison for repeat offenders then I'm afraid nothing will change. Don't stop at prosecuting the gamekeepers as the owners almost certainly know exactly what is going on.

  • mickysf
    mickysf Forum Participant Posts: 6,474 ✭✭✭
    2,500 Likes 1000 Comments
    edited June 2022 #9

    And it goes on and on! It’s about time the shooting fraternity sorted this out once and for all!

    https://www.cps.gov.uk/wessex/news/gamekeeper-found-nine-dead-wild-birds-and-loaded-shotgun-has-been-sentenced

    Despicable behaviour!

  • mickysf
    mickysf Forum Participant Posts: 6,474 ✭✭✭
    2,500 Likes 1000 Comments
    edited August 2022 #10
  • nelliethehooker
    nelliethehooker Club Member Posts: 13,636
    1000 Comments Name Dropper
    edited August 2022 #11

     Despicable behaviour by NE!

  • Fisherman
    Fisherman Forum Participant Posts: 2,367
    1000 Comments
    edited September 2022 #12

    Sadly reported the loss of a Merlin nest of 5 chicks locally. But not by the usual suspects highlighted here. The nest was disturbed by "official" ringers. Subsequently the adults left the nest after interference and the loss of the chicks. We the maligned also feel sorry for the birds but no sympathy for those who know better, preach to us and interfere.

  • mickysf
    mickysf Forum Participant Posts: 6,474 ✭✭✭
    2,500 Likes 1000 Comments
    edited September 2022 #13

    That is sad, you are right fisherman, I’m sure you are not one of these but the carnage and despicable actions of those others whose so frequently reported actions, driven by despicable intentions, are far from caring or compassionate or in any way helpful for nature! 

  • mickysf
    mickysf Forum Participant Posts: 6,474 ✭✭✭
    2,500 Likes 1000 Comments
    edited November 2022 #14

    What is it about Norfolk and which makes such sad news about our Montagu's Harrier population.


    “Intensive conservation interventions are necessary to protect nests from agricultural operations, reduce predation risk, prevent disturbance and the possibility of illegal persecution. The latter, as for many raptors, is suspected to be an issue: satellite-tagging has revealed that two breeding females, including one featured on BBC Autumnwatch, both vanished unexpectedly from the same area in Norfolk in recent years. Last year, Montagu's Harrier was added to the Red List, the highest category of the UK's Birds of Conservation Concern assessment.”

     

  • Fisherman
    Fisherman Forum Participant Posts: 2,367
    1000 Comments
    edited November 2022 #15

    By far the greatest loss of ground nesting birds is  by foxes and badgers.The conservationist are paranoid about not controlling these hence the rapid decline. As I pointed in an earlier post the conservationist themselves by interfering are also a cause ( Merlins)

  • mickysf
    mickysf Forum Participant Posts: 6,474 ✭✭✭
    2,500 Likes 1000 Comments
    edited November 2022 #16

    Much of the imbalance of natural predation is of ‘our’ making and this too needs careful management. I’m also sure, with the very best of intentions, lessons will be learnt from the likes of the unfortunate Merlin incident. However the greatest unnatural and illegal loss of raptors is down to a few repeatedly performing cruel acts for selfish economics and so called sporting ‘reasons’. These despicable folk seem unable to learn their lessons.

  • Fisherman
    Fisherman Forum Participant Posts: 2,367
    1000 Comments
    edited November 2022 #17

    I think your  resoning is based on a few isolated instances,albeit unecessary.The vast majority of "sporting" estates are nature beneficial. The best place for Red Listed birds are on sporting estatrs, like North Yorkshire where management occurs. Nothing is ever perfect but in all my years I have not heard of a single issue with raptor killing- Covids yes as with foxes.Here we have a healthy bird population so it seems to work. If you only knew how many foxes we control in a year you would understand that their population is out of control.

  • mickysf
    mickysf Forum Participant Posts: 6,474 ✭✭✭
    2,500 Likes 1000 Comments
    edited November 2022 #18

    Isolated hopefully, but repetitively frequent in some areas it happens. I however do question the idea that sporting estates are nature beneficial. Sometimes only when certain species are seen as ‘complimentary’ with the demands of the sporting estates are they allowed space and promoted.  Where conflict arises from other species or there is an historical dislike of them, a totally different attitude is adopted, even when numbers of those persecuted species are exceptionally or even dangerously low as we see on an all too regular basis as reported in the news and media. I fail to see how anyone can say they have never heard of these instances.

    Furthermore, there have been studies which show where game birds are bred and released they have a significantly detrimental effect on insect, snake and other reptilian populations, sometimes eradicating some species from the sporting area.

    I totally get that we have upset natural balance and some animals like foxes need their numbers controlling but this particular old chestnut is frequently dragged up as a means to support the ‘indefensible’. That argument is a red herring and not related to the persecution of raptors.

  • Fisherman
    Fisherman Forum Participant Posts: 2,367
    1000 Comments
    edited November 2022 #19

    On a regular basis? I dont see reports that often in the press. Isolated I would say in this enlightened age.

  • mickysf
    mickysf Forum Participant Posts: 6,474 ✭✭✭
    2,500 Likes 1000 Comments
    edited November 2022 #20

    So you have heard of/seen those reports then Fish that do appear on an all to regular basis in my opinion. Yours of course may be different but the fact that it happens at all is clearly unhelpful and wrong! A few a year, every year across the UK is what I witness.

  • Fisherman
    Fisherman Forum Participant Posts: 2,367
    1000 Comments
    edited November 2022 #21

    I do read the press but dont believe everything printed.Personally I have not seen Raptor persecution but I live fairly isolated here in the hills

  • mickysf
    mickysf Forum Participant Posts: 6,474 ✭✭✭
    2,500 Likes 1000 Comments
    edited November 2022 #22

    We may not believe all that is printed in the press and that works both ways. But I do sadly believe the evidence of utter cruelty and persecution we see on that video posted up thread. 

  • mickysf
    mickysf Forum Participant Posts: 6,474 ✭✭✭
    2,500 Likes 1000 Comments
    edited November 2022 #23

    Oh, no! It may be more widespread than we think. 

    Latest Data.     Raptor Persecution 

  • Fisherman
    Fisherman Forum Participant Posts: 2,367
    1000 Comments
    edited November 2022 #24

    I also read the report and if true is worrying. Cant see proper country folks having problems with Kites etc as they are just scavengers and therefore not in conflict with  us farmers. We had an Eagle  here in Mid Wales for years  and we looked after Ospreys quietly before the RSPB made them into cash machines.

  • mickysf
    mickysf Forum Participant Posts: 6,474 ✭✭✭
    2,500 Likes 1000 Comments
    edited November 2022 #25

    Yes you are correct, isn’t it fabulous, from zero(kites), where there had been hundreds if not thousands, to re-established despite all. Well worth promoting as a success and cashing in and funding other persecuted raptors, like ospreys, in exactly the same way as the kites have been saved across the UK, particularly England. As said, they are not a threat to those who persevere them as such but have been historically persecuted nonetheless. Time to shout out where this is still happening, ‘real country folk’, as you say wouldn’t do this but some folk are! Not sure no what real country folk means mind!

  • mickysf
    mickysf Forum Participant Posts: 6,474 ✭✭✭
    2,500 Likes 1000 Comments
    edited November 2022 #26

    Sorry spell checker at error- Perceive not persevere!🤣

  • Fisherman
    Fisherman Forum Participant Posts: 2,367
    1000 Comments
    edited November 2022 #27

    The kites never were xero in Wales. There were some still here in Mid Wales.I remember as a boy seeing them at Dolgoch. We had the Gurkas from Brecon guarding the nests against incomer egg collectors.

  • mickysf
    mickysf Forum Participant Posts: 6,474 ✭✭✭
    2,500 Likes 1000 Comments
    edited November 2022 #28

    That was brilliant, Fish, unfortunately it was not the case for the rest of UK. Those few kites remaining in Wales, and the subsequent increase in numbers as a result of that hard work described gave inspiration for reintroduces elsewhere.  Today we see them all across the UK. Now we need a similar concerted effort across GB to assist them and other raptors chances and stop that persecution we all to often hear of.

  • eurortraveller
    eurortraveller Club Member Posts: 6,828 ✭✭✭
    2,500 Likes 1000 Comments
    edited November 2022 #31

    Raptor persecution is happening here. Someone please tell the raptors to stop doing it. We have buzzards but no skylarks.and far fewer songbirds.