Use of service points
I think this may have been discussed before, but is there any rethink that this club would change their policy on the use of motorhome service points for a fee? Other clubs allow it, but not this one. Please don't reply saying that I should stay the night, this is not the point, we do stay, but sometimes this is not possible if the site is full. Being rejected from a club when they are full and refusing use of the service point when we are out of water feels churlish to say the least. Happy to pay for it!
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This very question was asked at the last AGM and this was the official Club response:-
Given the national lack of facilities and the increasing popularity of campervans and motorhomes, should the Club permit the use of water and waste disposal facilities on Club sites and CLs for members who are not staying (for a suitable charge)?
As Club members we need to encourage responsible tourism. With the exception of Scotland, in general terms, you must stay on licenced sites, or with landowners with permission by law - wild camping is not legal. Therefore our focus is on providing a range of full facility, and non-facility sites together with CLs and centre rallies to meet the needs of all members.
I suspect its also not quite as simple as you imagine. In order to pay the reception has to be staffed and they are often closed for a couple of hours in the morning whilst staff clean the toilet blocks. I doubt they would want people using such a service at the busy arrival time so therefore the hours in which this sort of service could be offered is very restricted without a reorganisation of the staff day and then one would have to question if for the small amount of money it would bring to the Club whether it was worth it?
David
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Don't blame the members. It's the hierarchy you need to convince.
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M on T, have you ever tried approaching a CL owner and asking the question? My gut instinct is that they could be far more amenable.
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David, another example of the club staffing model (and regimented timetabling of duties) preventing any other form of model, even one that would generate cash.
the site I'm on now (in France) allows this practice, as does innumerable others.
a van pulls up outside the barrier, chap walks to office and pays Madame, the barrier is raised, the van drives the 50m to the MHSP, empties and fills and then moves on without disrupting a soul on site.
you mention 'busy times' but surely this a creation of a strictly adhered to arrival time, everyone arrives at once...in France there is no 'bow wave', the site might be 'busy' but the arrivals are spread throughout the day with Madame rarely having to deal with more than one (possibly two) at once...and one of these might be someone wishing to spend money on a refill.
on the site website it lists "technical stop for motorhome @ €6.20". With the (super thrifty) French prepared to pay this sort of fee, surely the club is missing a big trick.
again, a limited Club understanding of motorhoming requirements leading to poor design of MHSP and their placement makes this seemingly simple task (elsewhere) beyond the club's comprehension.
Bizzare.
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"again, a limited Club understanding of motorhoming requirements leading to poor design of MHSP and their placement makes this seemingly simple task (elsewhere) beyond the club's comprehension."
Hi BB, I am often told, by MH owning friends and acquaintances, that all one needs, to make it work compared to towing a van, is a little more planning-site location, shopping, public transport etc.
Yet posts in this thread seem to suggest that people don't want to plan, when using "officially designated motorhome stops" but rather want others, the club, to plan to cater for their needs.
Like you I use my van abroad and value the freedom from rules & regs, but I don't expect what I experience abroad to be replicated here.
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Allan, I think what's being said here is that those (like yourself and many others on CT) have a wide ranging experience of how things are done in many places.
I don't see anything wrong with folk pulling together all the best elements they've come across wherever that might be.
you can't believe how frustrating it is to have a club MHSP sited just beyond the office on the one way system and you have to drive all the way round the site to get there to use it and then all the way round again to get off site...and the club wants to reduce site traffic? The use of many French and Spanish sites have revealed the optimal point for such a service that allows not only incumbents to use it on the way out but for passing traffic to use it without bothering guests.
this is just one example of best practice wherever it may be...
I use all sorts of sites during the course of a year, and even on a single trip, from full fat sites to parking spaces, but have never once needed to resort to the sort of habits some will have us believe is de rigeur for those who dare drive a MH..
MH users need far far less in the way of infrastructure than those in caravans yet the offering from the club is their all or nothing.
I see nothing wrong with members of their own club requesting to use the MHSP of any club site...perhaps at a certain price, perhaps at certain times...
I find it annoying when MHers are cast as pariahs for 'wild camping, leaving waste everywhere' yet when they wish to make proper use of waste facilities at their own club (which has many, many such facilities) the club doesn't want to be involved.
possibly a 'season ticket' over and above the membership could be offered to those wishing to 'drop in' at their club for a few minutes...but I doubt it.
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It is wrong to say the Club won't allow you to use the motorhome facilities. All you have to do is to pay for a one night stay and you can use the motorhome service point as much as you like and stay as long as you like within that 24 hour period
OK I know nobody would really do that. All I did with my post above was to point out the known Club attitude to the original questioner, plus adding a bit more information on what the probable difficulties would be. My own personal views are not necessarily opposed to the idea. However the people that want such changes seem to expect the Club to change its whole MO to accommodate an undefined demand. As BB points out many sites don't lend themselves to easy use of such facilities even for those staying on site! I don't think the Club's staffing model is going to change anytime soon so further discussion on that is a bit pointless. The Club is a bit like a large tanker which takes ages to stop or to change course. I think there would have to be a lot more evidence that there is a demand, from members, for a change in the view on this subject expressed at the last AGM.
David
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With.the already vocal minority complaining about club site costs and the restrictions that the WTD already have on when staff are available .to enable what is envisaged would mean more staff and the cost that go with them
As for service points many sites in the network are decades old and to put most where some motor caravan owners would like them to be would be even more expensive than it already is for one side of the membership if. It would be for members only
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Unless there is something specific we want to visit, We are not that concerned with public transport and many National Trust / English Heritage / Private Estates allow MH parking. The main thing I look at, is exactly the same as when we had a caravan. Ordnance Survey map or IGN in France, what walking is there immediately available from site. We are not bothered about shops as we only stop for a maximum of four days and re provision on moving day. Apart from the fact we move more often and don’t use a car for shopping, not much has changed since we had a caravan. Oh of course we can now use Aires, which is a big plus.😀
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Given the itinerant nature of many motorhomers, doing a "one nighter" for the purpose of using the "dump & fill" facilities is mostly a non-starter. Motorhomers and caravanners alike bemoan the lack of short notice availability. Is it really feasible to pre-book numerous stopovers in case I need to "dump & fill" only to find that I had followed a different route on my travels and was nowhere near those rebooked stopovers?
What is so terrible about allowing a "dump & fill"? Will the world really spin uncontrollably out of its orbit?
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Unfortunately not the 2 or 3 I've suggested it to when staying on their CL.
Trying to get them to understand that for some folk being able to roam and stop where they please is a foreign concept.
I've tried explaining how it works abroad and that it fits in very well alongside campsites and Aires, another concept that those I spoke to couldn't get their head around.
Maybe the last 2 years might have changed their minds but I doubt it.
Lots of MH stops springing up around the country but we still lack the services to go with these. Even getting LPG at fuel stations is getting harder in some areas of the country, what chance do we have getting the CAMC to agree to what has been proposed.
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WTG, If I knew what you were talking abut I could maybe offer a more detailed response however, what you posted was;
"there are posts showing evidence that there is a growing number of officially designated motorhome stops."
and then;
"And then come along all the reasons why allowing access to service points cannot possibly be done: reception closed, staff cleaning loos and so on. Just as on the ‘electric thread’ there are reasons why metering wouldn’t work – staff reception hours and so on. This shows the rigidity of the thinking in the Club."
So, that appeared to me to suggest, and thats the word that I used, that you wanted the club to change its position to suit you.
Like it or not the clubs position, as posted by DK, does appear reasonable and I would expect any potential use of services, by passing MHs, would be so restrictive as to be useless anyway.
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"I see nothing wrong with members of their own club requesting to use the MHSP of any club site...perhaps at a certain price, perhaps at certain times...
I find it annoying when MHers are cast as pariahs for 'wild camping, leaving waste everywhere' yet when they wish to make proper use of waste facilities at their own club (which has many, many such facilities) the club doesn't want to be involved."
Hi BB, I agree with you entirely, there is nothing wrong with asking, I just don't think that there is a snowballs chance of MHs being able to use facilities in anything like a reasonable, convenient, manner.
Whilst there will always be the van v MH debate, divide, whatever, I personally see no issue with MHs being allowed to use site facilities but wonder, does this reflect what you can do 'over there?
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As a caravanner can I just say that I have no objections to Motorhomers coming on site to empty and fill, for a fee mind, say £5. This could be achieved by restricting it to a time when one of the wardens was in the office, (to raise the barrier), say between 3-5pm. This wouldn't impinge on their WTD. Membership cards to be shown to avoid non members using facilities.
Why doesn't the club trial it at a suitable site or two?
I can't see CL owners being too happy with this arrangement as quite a few will be using cesspits. Paradoxically, I would object as a user of a CL seeing unknown vehicles coming onto the CL. Strange really and maybe illogical but that's the truth.
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As I see it we have very little evidence, as far as I can tell, that there is a large demand from members for this sort of service? The occasional person asking for this sort of service does not mean that the demand is widespread. If I am mistaken in my view that the demand for this service is limited I think the best option for those that want such a service is to write direct to the Club so they can assess what the demand would be. I also don't believe that someone leaves home for however many nights away and doesn't plan where they might need to empty their toilet or waste water. Places where you can do this in the UK, other than campsites, are exceptionally limited. Some demanding this sort of service are very dismissive of the impact it could have on Club site arrangements. Even if the Club decided to offer this service but limited to certain times of day there would be protests from those that want everything to fit in with their agenda rather than the practical issues experienced by sites and their staff.
David
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WTG, No, it’s not a case of not understanding, it’s rather that you don’t seem to like my saying that your posts suggest you want change.
You talk about “rigidity of thinking “ and “intransigence” yet for reasons unclear to me take offence at my saying that this “suggests” you want change?
As I say, personally I have no objection but think DK has, again, summed it up quite well in his last post.
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We’ve used one. It was outside the Aire, a former municipal site, which also allowed caravans. There was access to water inside but you would have had to fill the tank with a watering can. For 2€ it was easier to fill at the service point, which was of course available to those just passing by. One such was using it when we arrived.
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Some of those coin operated service points also include automated toilet cassette cleaners, now that is luxury!
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