Booking ahead is unfair at some sites
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Talking of gas!! Just had comms. from upstairs and I think it's on FB as well. Calor have an urgent recall on butane 4.5 bottles. Some valves of a certain age have the potential to leak when open. Check your bottles folks
JK
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As AD mentioned earlier, the shorter the trips the bigger the impact of the ferry on the overall total...and vice versa...
we do six weeks or more in the late summer but three months in Spain in winter.
So, the big difference for us over your touring is that we tour Spain in the wintertime, I don't think you've visited yet?
Although the Uk is a lovely place (and we've done plenty this year) for us it's far nicer to be in the warm than in the cold..
the uk touring (from Cornwall to Kent and Norfolk etc) required booking with all the newbies (and snowbirds) on tour here...whereas, as you say, more sporadic and impromptu touring is far more the norm.
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It’s also possible that people have had to cancel at short notice because they’ve had to self isolate because of Covid or being a contact of someone with a positive test. This in addition to other domestic, health, bereavement and other family issues.
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Surely the Club have those procedures in place already? It is more than possible that the no shows/late cancellations are not the real problem? Not suggesting they be overlooked but it would be the easiest thing in the world for the Club to put in place greater punishments. The problem is what if that is not the real problem? They could beef up the current cancel by date but what if that is not the real problem either? I could be completely wrong but thinking about what has been said in the two discussions but it increasingly looks as if the problem is that too many people are booking speculatively and then cancelling (within the rules) within the required time period. You could extend that period to a week or a month but it wouldn't stop people booking more than they will genuinely use and cancelling later. They only constraint on that is either to limit the number of times you can book the same site which still might mean people booking speculatively up to a year in advance or introduce deposits. To me if I was making that decision the logic would suggest that a deposit large enough to put off later cancellation would be the way to go. When we talk about the club booking system we are talking about millions of bookings so everything has to be done as automatically as possible with as little human input as possible?
David
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I like to stay at a site for a number of days and do the touring around the area in the Land Rover without the caravan. Quite often, once the dates and location are agreed with family it is not possible to book the site for the whole period I want, so I book what is available and keep going back to the booking system to try to fill in the missing days. This has been successfull on about half the times I've done it - though multiple consecutive bookings are a nuisance to me and wardens alike.
When I can't fill in the missing days and the 72 hour deadline looms I phone the wardens and if they can't assist then I cancel all the bookings I have for that site and go elsewhere - though that has usually been a backup plan hundreds of miles away rather than a different fully booked site nearby. So suddenly there are more nights "free" at that site ( apart from the nights that stopped me making a continuous booking ) which may well affect the appearance of vacant pitches.
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The fundamental issue is that the Club now have too many Members chasing too few pitches in a quite condensed period of the year. It’s lost quite a few Sites in the last ten years (two last year in Fakenham and Market Rasen), Staff told us Marazion only got a reprieve this year as it was so popular.
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mbee......are you young? Say maybe under 60? Still working?
We older, retired members do appreciate the way the Club operates at present, the ease of booking, amending and even cancelling is indeed a USP when you get to our age ( 79 and almost 73), even though we still feel 18 in our heads!
We tour, usually 4-6 week tours 3 times a year now we are not going abroad. We never make a booking we do not intend to take up, but at our age, as they say, "life happens", especially if you have health problems.
Personally, I usually feel fit and stay active, but have just been laid low due to a broken arm. Tripping over the caravan drawbar of all things! We had nothing booked, van is now winterised, but it will be at least 3 months before I will be up to towing again.
Being on a pension, we need to watch our spending, so would not like to be losing significant deposits for something like this. We are already using more CCC sites ( less expensive) and CLs than CAMC sites, so deposits with draconian Ts&Cs would certainly mean we would use even fewer Club sites, and I do not think we would be alone in deciding on this.
No doubt we would be in a minority, plenty of younger members to take up the slack it seems?
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I have just made a speculative booking. If the snow at Castleton gets deeper than six inches, we won’t get there.😂
With the VAT reduction still in place, it comes in at less than £20 per night mid week and away from the extended Xmas/New Year period. Couple of caverns, cycle round Ladybower, meal in The George, sorted👍
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We plan to book CAMC Banchory Silverbank for 5 nights late March. We will be up there, but once we hear what the 2022 prices at a nearby CL will be, we may just go there instead, sorry CAMC, cancelling well ahead of course. The change will be mainly because the CL has serviced pitches, which we like.
Beyond that, it looks like it will be CCC sites and CLs for the rest of that 5 week trip.
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You may be right ? but that does not stop them making a call to the site instead of just not arriving even if just to leave a message?
But then it seems these days some people with as most have a Smart? Phone ,is not what it is for, to actually use as a speaking device
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KjellNN - I'm 60 and still working full time.
It's interesting reading back over the thread. I suspect that most people who post on here are older and possibly retired. I get the impression deposits are, generally not liked by them, as it restricts their movements to change plans/cancel at the last minute. In a similar vein, motorhomers like the freedom to move on as and when they like and not be so restricted to having paid for a set number of nights at a particular site
What I don't understand is why members are so against deposits? As far as i know the Club is the only leisure business not to charge one. When you buy a new car you put down a deposit to secure the vehicle which may be tied up for weeks or months whilst you wait for delivery. Same with a caravan or motorhome. Same with a cottage for a holiday. Same with a ferry booking thus I really cannot see an argument for members saying they don't want money tied up in deposits for this Club.
I can only put this down to the fact that deposits haven't been charged for so long and the flexibility to cancel within 72 hours. As I said a few posts ago, what is the use of 72 hours? It isn't beneficial for me or my wife where we need to plan holidays in advance thus it only benefits retired members who can decide to go away at short notice. That's the reason I speculatively book some sites that I know are popular because, otherwise, i wouldn't get a pitch If the deposit, if and when introduced, was only £10 or £20, I could afford to lose it if I decided not to take up a pitch. I'd think again if it was more but, and this is perhaps more important than deposits, the cancellation period was far longer. If it was (say) 30 days before a booking, that would give members, like me who work, the opportunity to check my diary and see if I could get the time off and book it.
Deposits and a longer cancellation period would only bring the Club into line with the rest of the leisure industry and makes far more business and economic sense for the Club.
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I could be completely wrong but thinking about what has been said in the two discussions but it increasingly looks as if the problem is that too many people are booking speculatively and then cancelling (within the rules) within the required time period.
I don't think you are wrong DK, it has certainly been my experience this year especially with monitoring the changes of site bookings for sites I wanted to visit and from being on one site in particular which was supposed to be full thoughout my stay which was certainly not the case, far from it. Along with others you admit that you wait for cancellations to fulfill a site booking. You can almost gurantee that there will be cancellations at almost every Club site.
peedee.
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In my experience MB most older folk don’t like change. If I book £400 worth of site/s & have to pay £50/£100/£200 up front then so be it, it don’t take a genius to know I have £350/£300/£200 to then pay, if I don’t turn up & I lose the deposit-that is on me no one else. Likewise if I have no deposit to pay then £400 will be a lump sum🤷🏻♂️. I struggle to see the issue myself, I just don’t stress it. I do hear a lot of-‘it was much better in my day’ them days are gone it is now the 21st century & we all move with the times or end up angry☹️
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For those interested, the questions and answers submitted to this years AGM, quite a few relating to the inability to get a pitch, and the introduction of new booking conditions and deposits, are now available to read on the website. Click on News and Events at top of page, scroll down then click on the AGM link.
Mod Edit - Link https://www.caravanclub.co.uk/about-us/agm/2021-agm-questions-and-answers/
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What I don't understand is why members are so against deposits? As far as i know the Club is the only leisure business not to charge one. When you buy a new car you put down a deposit to secure the vehicle which may be tied up for weeks or months whilst you wait for delivery. Same with a caravan or motorhome. Same with a cottage for a holiday. Same with a ferry booking thus I really cannot see an argument for members saying they don't want money tied up in deposits for this Club.
The figure of over £50 deposit you suggested, would have meant an average of about 60% on our recent series of bookings, held for several months. I have never paid a deposit of this size for anything and have no plans to start now. As I put earlier the deposit on our new MH was 2.5%. If we had backed out at the last minute, they would have had a customised registered vehicle they would have been saddled with. A bit more of risk than an empty pitch. If the CAMC go down the avenue of deposits, they have to be set at a realistic rate.
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25 percent of the booking cost is what the C&CC deposit charge is or £25 minimum. In my view the minimum charge should rise with inflation just like mebership fees.
At least three of the questions regarding booking at the AGM were answered with the same information about the future booking system due before 2nd quarter of 2022. So the latest date for changes to be made by would be 31st March 2022?
peedee
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Mmm, very fudgy around the Marazion issue which somebody asked about.
The rest was pretty much as expected.
Thanks for the heads up.
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That ties in with the VAT concession going. I recall DG (I think) saying that Club were lobbying with other hospitality providers to try and get a lower VAT rate if possible, fingers crossed it happens. It’s made a good bit of difference on prices at Club Sites this year. I am reading that CLs and rallies are the option for those not happy with Club prices from those responses. And for those looking merely to empty and refill.
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We have used several C&CC sites this year and thought the £25 ( as our bookings were less than £100) about right. Plus we really liked the contactless check in. What I was less keen on was the booking process, inputting card details for each purchase and the difficulty changing a booking when it coincided with our second covid jab.
As I suspect this clubs deposit level will mirror the C&CC, I am more interested in those factors. Will card details be held, just necessitating input of the 3 digit code as with our tesco order? Will it be possible to amend online, or will it require hanging on for ages on the phone?0 -
Not only that PD (answering the same) but one answer was exactly the same wording as for the AGM Q&A in 2020.
Anyway at least you got an answer to your call for metering of electricity
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Funny you should mention Tesco Steve. They have possibly the most customer friendly online experience going. Once registered, very easy to use, amend. Bit frighteningly clever at times, it tells you what you want/need before you had thought of it yourself🤣 I’m not sure, but I think HM Gov were in consultation with Tesco around logistics early in the pandemic when things were going so wrong getting NHS supplies in place. Never had a problem with Tesco deliveries, but using it does make other online supermarket ordering look a bit “clunky” and less intuitive. Waitrose isn’t bad, I gave up on M&S food🤨
The repetitive answers theme happened with last years questions as well, if a similar question was asked. They are not giving much away at this stage as to how any new booking system or deposit scheme will work. 😉
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mbee.....don't make the mistake of assuming retirement necessarily means one can do as one pleases and go away on holiday at short notice!!
Advancing age often means we old people have to factor in doctor/hospital appointments and check ups, or have grandchildren we look after, or even still have aged parents who need to be considered, as well as the unexpected things like a broken arm.
In our case, we have grandparent duties 2 days per week, which we volunteered for so knew it would limit our trips, so some of our days have to be swapped with the other grandparents and then added to school holidays when Daddy looks after the children. It works well, but does need to be planned well ahead.
We never did weekends or short breaks while working, far too much hassle, we tour for 3-6 weeks at a time and all sites are booked ahead, we generally never spend more than 5 nights on a site.
Not necessarily against deposits, we already pay them on CCC sites, but there we can already book pitch surface, and do find we can leave booking till later in the year. We also get the age discount, which, along with much shorter peak periods, makes the CCC a considerably less expensive option for us.
I think the problem at the moment is that the Club have signalled their intention to re-introduce deposits, but have not said the size of them or whether they would be refundable/movable, so members are likely worried over those details.
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Anyway at least you got an answer to your call for metering of electricity
Not really, no evidence of costs were offered and no mention at all of looking at ways of gradual introduction.The only cost the CLub is worried about is the possible loss of income which would result by not having and all inclusive price.
peedee
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How much would you expect to pay for the installation of possibly Best part of 300meters with possibly new bollards and computer software to implement what you are suggesting, on site that have enough lease left to make it cost effective, then the add costs of an annual calibration of said meters as it would be a commercial point of sale
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