Are Coachman caravans going downmarket?
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InaD - the dealer who specialises in swapping the dometic toilet for a Thetford is ALV at Tebay ( not too far from you), I’ve booked mine in for the work, the only slight problem is they can’t do it until September due to catch-up work resulting from the lockdowns. The chap to speak too is Mike Wysocki.
A lot cheaper than having to change what is a great van for a new one!
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In all the LVs we have had (many of most types) we have most times disconnected the shower and capped the tap in case of accidently turning it on, and used the shower as add storage (OHs overflow wardrobe)
It is only since covid and what it has given us, that we now have the shower in this c/van reconnected,, which has given a problem as OH has had to "compromise" on the amount of clothes she can bring
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ALV changed our Dometic toilet in our Knaus Starclass, five months after we got it because of all the problems we experienced. I have posted on here at great length in the past just how useless that toilet was and how it was spoiling what was an otherwise, near perfect van. Indeed it was me that put Paul onto ALV.
I have all the experience of the switch and what is involved if you are interested. For example, it is not possible to fit a Thetford with a header tank because the fillers don't line up and therefore the water has to come from elsewhere (inboard tank in our case).
With regard to an earlier comment about the facilities in the bathrooms of European vans, I have to disagree. The bathroom in ours is absolutely huge with two large wardrobes as well as a very decent sized shower and is quite luxurious. I was also interested to see that Knaus have designed the shower enclosure without any sealant between the shower walls and the tray - because the shower tray has an upstand of about 8" inside the shower walls to prevent any possibility of leakage. I am unaware of any other manufacturer that does that - and Bailey certainly don't as I found out to my cost with our last van!
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To PaulfromPontefract - Thank you so much for those contact details, I appreciate it very much. As I said, we asked our own dealer, plus 2 independents, none of whom were interested. We will contact them tomorrow, understand there is a wait for work to be done, but as you say, it's better than buying a new one. Thanks again!
To RichardandRos - Thanks very much for your post too. After our problems started, I did actually read some of your posts in which you described having your toilet changed. I couldn't find the post which had the dealer's details in unfortunately, hence our enquiries elsewhere. Which got us nowhere. I seem to remember the cost to you being £650. No doubt it will be more expensive now, but even at half as much again, it'd still be worth it to us. Yes, we are very interested in reading what is involved, if you are willing to spare the time.
The van is out of warranty this coming August anyway (3 year Coachman warranty), so no problem from that side of things.
We'll just have to be careful until the time we can get it done. Have booked CLs with toilets for later this month and June! Need a plan B if the worst happens
Thank you both very much
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You’re very welcome, it was Richard who pointed me in Mikes direction. I’ve told Mike to expect a call 😀
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I've tried to post 2 replies to thank you, Paul, but neither has appeared for some strange reason. I did include your post as a quote, so in case that was the problem, I'll try it without.
Thank you very much for that, it's very much appreciated
Edited: well, those took a good few minutes to appear
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InaD - have attached some photos of our installation. The first one shows the cassette locker door. You will see that the Thetford cassette locker is slightly smaller than the Dometic, therefore ALV fitted that surround you can see. Unless it was pointed out, I doubt that anyone would notice and it looks very professionally done.
The second pic shows that they have created a perfect seal on the inside - indeed it looks neater than the original!
Just to put your mind at rest - at it's second service this January, all the damp readings were 5% or less - so there's been no hint of any leaks.
Next two are the actual toilet. To all intents and purposes it looks almost identical to the Dometic but the header tank is a dummy. The flush water comes from the inboard tank but I see no reason why, having plumbed into your existing water supply to the bathroom, it can't come from the Aquaroll. Despite all the hype from Dometic about their fabulous flushing system, the Thetford is far, far better!
A couple of downsides. The filler cap remains on the outside of the van but is blanked off and redundant. No big deal and no one knows but you! I was glad to see the back of it because, filling 'horizontally', it was a stupid design anyway and invariably ended up with water and additive spilling down the van - unlike our previous Thetford which filled 'vertically', if you understand me. I also like the idea of having one less thing to fill up! The reason they had to go down this route is that if they had used a Thetford with a header tank, the position of the filler caps don't line up.
The shape of the Thetford toilet at the base is slightly different from the Dometic, therefore there will be a slight gap between the base and the fitted carpet(less than 1") in places. Again, unless it was pointed out, I doubt you would notice.
It's now about 18 months since ours was fitted and touch wood, it's been perfect and has taken away all the stress I experienced every time I went anywhere near that dreadful Dometic.
Hope you manage to get it sorted.
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Richard, thank you so much for such an informative post, we both appreciate it very much. The photos are very informative; as you say, the surround is extremely neat. As for the redundant filler on the outside: we can live with that! Compared with the stress and anxiety we have every time we use the caravan, it's an extremely small price to pay. It will be good to keep this van, as we do like the rest of it.
It will also be nice to have a toilet which you can wheel to the emptyng point, as it is, we have to carry it, as it is just too flimsy. That's of course, providing we can remove it in the first place
We will be giving ALV a ring this morning.
Thank you once again for your considerable help
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"It will also be nice to have a toilet which you can wheel to the emptyng point, as it is, we have to carry it, as it is just too flimsy. That's of course, providing we can remove it in the first place".
And the wheels are too small to be of any use other than on tarmac and once you get it to the emptying point, you need three hands to hold the cassette and press the 'anti-splash' button at the same time.
I would love to meet the idiot that designed this piece of kit - clearly he/she wasn't a caravaner!
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It's unbelievable that it ever got as far as being fitted in LVs in the first place. OH has spoken to Mike at ALV today, he asked for a few photos to be e-mailed to him, which we have done. Now waiting for him to get back to us. It was actually quite refreshing to talk to someone at a dealership who didn't deny there were problems! Our local dealer, even after breaking the toilet trying to get it out, flatly denied of knowing about any problems, when we told them what we'd read on various forums. Obviously didn't want to admit to anything.
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I've just read through the last couple of days postings as I have a 460 VIP 2017 model yet my toilet is a Thetford 260c Swivel. Strange. Everything else would point to it being the original as flush tank etc all standard.
We did have a small bit of trouble when we came to empty it first time as it wouldn't budge ( sound familiar?). However I realise that the handle must be firmly recessed into the little space left for it otherwise it throws a hissy fit.
We quite like the caravan. We bought it as a stop gap after our Lunar fell to pieces but might decide to keep it for a bit longer than we thought.
Good luck you lot with toilet issues and those with Dometics.
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I've just read through the last couple of days postings as I have a 460 VIP 2017 model yet my toilet is a Thetford 260c Swivel. Strange.
WN, not strange, as Coachman changed to Dometic toilets from 2018 models, so you're lucky
As you may have also read, from 2020 models they've changed back to Thetford.Hoping to get ours swapped over, as you've probably also read
so thanks for the good wishes 
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"It was actually quite refreshing to talk to someone at a dealership who didn't deny there were problems!"
Mike didn't hesitate when I asked him about changing ours - they had already done loads and I think he hates that toilet with a vengeance!
Although it means a 300 mile round trip for us to go back to ALV, they are a very good dealership and their technical skills, in my opinion, are second to none. I am sure you will be more than happy with their work.
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Yes, the way he referred to Dometic was far from complimentary, to say the least!
Didn't hear back yesterday, but only sent the photos early afternoon.
Thanks for the reassuring words about ALV; for us it'll be a 120 mile round trip, mostly on the M6, but would have travelled further if necessary. It's cheaper than changing the caravan
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To Richard and Paul
Just an update that Mike rang this morning (he is quite hard to get hold of, popular man!) and the caravan is booked in for the last week of September.
Thanks to both of you again, although it's a while off, at least we'll have a toilet we can rely on
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I have a Coachman with the Dometic toilet. During PDI and handover, the cassette jammed but was then released and fettled with a file and some silicone grease. To date, we have not had any problems (touching wood) and prefer some of the practical aspects. As mentioned, the clearance between the wheels and the cassette body is hopeless for anything but smooth roads and paths.
It would be interesting to understand the percentage of failures versus those fitted. Unfortunately, as a group we are starved of objective data that helps us make informed decisions. Although Coachman don't fit Dometic toilets anymore, was this decision down to reliability, quality or cost - or perhaps a combination? I doubt we will ever know.
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FAO Paulfrompontefract:
I'm resurrecting this thread: we rang ALV and spoke to Mike, just to check all was ok for the end of September. Yes, it's booked in, but unfortunately the Thetford toilet hasn't as yet arrived! Mike is still hoping it will arrive in time and has asked us to ring again in about a fortnight. I don't know exactly when yours is booked in, and whether you have spoken to ALV recently, but I just thought I'd let you know. Fingers crossed!
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InaD
just to let you know we took our van in on Monday this week and collected it today Friday 24 September. We now have a coachman caravan of 2018 vintage with a PROPER robust Thetford toilet, The chaps at ALV have done a great job of changing it, so I’m sure you will be delightedly when yours is done.
ALV managing director spoke to me an d asked why we decided to change the dometic for a thetford, so I explained the issues we all come to be frustrated with, apparently they have a que of people who are doing the same.
good luck with yours, and to anyone thinking about doing the swap I would whole heartedly recommend you to do it...........
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Hello Paul
Thanks very much for the update. I'm very pleased that the toilet has been replaced at last.
As it happens, we are taking ours in on Monday, and are also looking forward to also having a 2018 caravan with a proper toilet 😁 interesting that ALV' MD had a word with you, when OH spoke to Mike Wysocki initially, he also said there was a queue of people having the same done. It speaks volumes, yet Coachman won't admit to anything, although they changed back to Thetford in 2020.
Will let you know how we get on, thanks again for the update.
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Paulfrompontefract
We picked our caravan up last Saturday, gone away in it today, so it'll get tested out! But even just trying to remove the cassette showed how much easier it is than the Dometic ever was. The wheels are another part which look so much better and more robust, no more having to carry it because of flimsy wheels, which look like they could fall off just by looking at them.
As you said, they've done a great job, we're very pleased we've had it done.
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"As you said, they've done a great job, we're very pleased we've had it done."
I'm pleased to hear that InaD - I'm always a bit nervous when I make a recommendation but the fact that both you and Paul are pleased shows that my confidence in ALV was justified. I was speaking to Mike a couple of weeks ago and they've had to put a hold on doing any more conversions for the time being because they are so busy! (Hint to me to keep my mouth shut!!)
It's now two years since they did ours and, despite the cost, it was the best decision I made because we have had trouble free experiences since then and they have put right what was spoiling an otherwise near perfect van.
I just worry about the fact that we have a Dometic fridge/freezer
but, at least, the cooker is a Thetford0 -
they've had to put a hold on doing any more conversions for the time being because they are so busy!
Sounds like we're lucky to have had it done just in time 😁 very pleased about that. It speaks volumes though.
You're one better than us with the cooker, ours is a Dometic, as well as the fridge. So far all is well with those........
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Just to update you all on my correspondence with Coachman regarding the dometic toilets.
Started by denying there was a problem at all, eventually said there were some issues with the dometic fitted in the 2018/19 vans, all sorted under warranty by dometic, strangely they had no record of the problems we have had!
Declined to contribute to our replacement costs for the thetford, no mention of “sorry” just condescending replies that didn’t answer any of the points I raised.
Customer service at its lowest level.
I’ll not be buying another given this experience of customer service, let alone the other warranty issues we have had,
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Paul
Your experience with Coachman is not dissimilar to ours. After the disaster where the dealer actually broke the Dometic toilet trying to remove the cassette, we too wrote to Coachman. Like you, we received a very condescending reply; one of the things they told us that we shouldn't treat the Dometic toilet like a Thetford! The rest was just waffle about it being replaced under warranty. Basically, they didn't want to know. The point we made about the fact that for the 2020 season they'd gone back to fitting Thetfords, which speaks volumes, wasn't even addressed at all.
But at least we've now got a working toilet.
On our recent trip we were next to another Coachman on one site; and heard from the owner that he's had 2 new Dometic toilets fitted in his, and still has problems. We told him about having a Thetford fitted at ALV; but according to richarrdandros ALV have stopped taking on work on fitting newThetford toilets.
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"We told him about having a Thetford fitted at ALV; but according to richarrdandros ALV have stopped taking on work on fitting new Thetford toilets."
I think the problem, InaD, is that thanks to me opening my big mouth they were inundated with requests to do the work, having gained a reputation as one of the few dealers who either had the experience or willingness to undertake the work.
On top of all their 'routine' work, they were becoming over-loaded and had to call a halt - but this might change in the future - who knows?
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That's understandable, they must have had a big backlog after lockdown, and a toilet replacement takes a few days.
I for one am very glad you "opened your big mouth"
our dealer wouldn't entertain the job, and we're both very pleased we've had the work done. It's been really good to go away without worrying whether the so-and-so cassette will get stuck again and also not having to carry it rather than wheel lt.So thanks again from me and OH.
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That’s interesting InaD, I advertised my dometic, had a call from a Coachman owner, not wanting to buy it for spares but to ask where we got it swapped and with which model thetford. Just had a week in the van with out a(as you mentioned) worrying if the darned toilet would function properly.
I cant believe that Coachman have buried their head in the sands and are completely blanking their loyal customers and not recognising the issue.... allegedly customer focussed, what a laugh, my view is they are no longer the van to aspire to owning, and we will certainly look elsewhere when it comes to replacing the van.
Paul.
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