Looking at Buying A Motorhome. Advice Welcome!
We have started to look at holiday plans for after the pandemic and are moving to the notion that touring within/outwith EU might be easier by motorhome than by car + touring caravan. We don't want a Pickfords Removal Lorry [no budget either], but something that will be comfortable for the 2 of us for stays of up to the 90 days EU Limit, without having to eract/dismatle awnings and all the paraphenalia every time we move site.
We like the Swift Escape Compact C404 at 5.99 metres, BUT there doesn't appear to be much storage for the obligatory external dining table + 2 chairs and I don't want the challenge of trying to stop them sliding up and down the living area whilst driving.the 120BHP engine seems a tad underpowered for shifting something with the aerodynamic profile of a loaf and the max load is limitd to 3300kg
We've seen [online only] a low mileage 2017 Swift Lifestyle 622 [seems to be a Dealer Special based on the Escape Range] that has a 130BHP engine and a 6.29m length and an external 'cupboard' rather than garage for the table and chairs and the layout is essentially our Swift Challenger caravan bolted onto the Fiat chassis. The slight increase in length might make all the difference and we have the comfort of knowing that the same caravan layout was quite comfortable for our trip to Spain 15 months ago.
Has anyone got any thoughts/advice/experience that will steer us in the right direction, please? We won't be committing to a purchase until we have the chance to see the motorhome at the Dealership and do a physical check to confirm that the configuration etc workfor us.
TIA
Steve
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The biggest mistake people tend to make when swapping from caravan to MH is to try to replicate their caravan in the MH body. The result is usually a MH that's big and unwieldy and no good for taking to places for sightseeing, so then they start towing a car..... Small is beautiful, big is not necessarily best.
A rigorous rethink of the equipment carried will be necessary and most of us dump around half of the gear we carried in the caravan because storage in a MH is more limited. Why is an outside table essential? Is there not one already in the MH which you can carry outside when needed?
The performance of the various engines differed with the base vehicles and with age and emission standards. For instance, the 2017 2 litre Peugeot 165 Euro 5 engine was a flyer. The equivalent Fiat was lumpier. The 2020 2.3 Fiat 140 Euro 6 engine is nearly as lively as the 2017 Peugeot. You will need to try them to see.
PS. Welcome back.
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Steve
You don't mention whether you want to take bikes with you? If not any motorhome with a bike rack can accept a Fiamma Back Box which (within the weight limits) can take things like chairs etc. We often use the shower for storage whilst travelling, we have nothing in the living area whilst travelling. I think you do have to reconsider everything you take with you. For instance do you need an outdoor table or could you use the one provided for internal use. In my previous motorhome I had a 130HP engine which seemed to lug the 7.5metre motorhome around perfect well! My now Bailey Alliance 66-2 has 165HP engine and is more than powerful enough. Personally I don't think I would entertain a motorhome which had an all up weight of less that 3500kgs. If you are prepared to look at European makes of motorhomes you could well find one of around 6 metres in length that had a garage for storage but the downside (from my point of view) is that the main sleeping bed would be higher up. In normal circumstances I would suggest to anyone thinking of buying a motorhome that they went to one of the NEC shows where they could see a massive range of different models but unfortunately due to COVID that is off the cards for the foreseeable.
David
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I'd go along with the addition of the Fiamma box. For many years we took small fold up camping chairs but have now swapped to full height chairs and these fit comfortably into our secondhand ebay purchase fiamma box. As also suggested you can use the van table inside or out but if you're out you might be glad of a roll out awning and maybe a side panel too. We've also got a roll up camping style table, it's full height and can replace the heavier van table (you could leave it at home for some trips.) The table is similar to this Argos one ...table LINK
We've never had a large motorhome, much easier with the smaller types especially for parking.
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I know, I know, but conversions on the Sprinter are not that readily available other than AS and you do pay a hefty price for them.
The new Fiat TC gearbox is a belter, though.
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We switched to. MH in 2019, after extensive research and visiting several shows. Our must have list was fixed beds, a proper cooker and a garage. Initially for some of the stuff that used to travel in the car and to give us safe storage for electric bikes if we decided to get them. In the end we opted for a Hymer Exsis t at 6.94 metres long on a Fiat base with 150 HP euro 6 engine. Although considering the smaller version of the same layout at 6 metres, I rejected this as I just couldn’t get the driving seat back far enough to achieve a comfortable position. One thing we decide early on was to cut down on what we took, both for payload basis and limited work surface compared to our caravan. Having opted for refillable gas we decided to dispense with the electric kettle, toaster and coffee make. Makes for much quicker packing up and means 6 amps at many continental sites is plenty for everything else. I have found the 150HP gives plenty of power and not found it wanting. Although the beds are high due to the garage, a staircase between the two singles makes for very easy getting in an out.
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Thanks for all the tips and advice. plenty of food for thought! Perhaps a Sunlight or similar would be a better option.
We will take bikes [for exercise and shopping trips].
Rethink on chairs and tables too.
Cooking tends to be by Remoska and/or slow cooker so 6 amp power supply is fine. We have low voltage kettle, toaster etc and are used to monitoring what's plugged in and the current consumption. We've got lists galore for this type of info, if only to avoid the 'Do you remember what we did last time?' questions.
We do tend to pack too much stuff. An unwitting duplication of food packing and a Mercadona Special Offer led to our having 26 packs of coffee last year, but we used it all eventually ...
We have plenty of time to find what we want, and time spent ruling some models out will help to avoid expensive mistakes.
Steve
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When you have an idea of the sort of layout and size you want why not hire a similar van to try out? It may save an expensive mistake and will certainly give you food for thought. In addition you will get a much broader range of advice and help if you join MotorhomeFun. Nearly 50,000 members world wide provides a very large pool of knowledge and experience.
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Hey, I am the ultimate no paraphernalia man!
We travelled long distances without an awning, Aquaroll, wastemaster, barbecue, satellite dish, outdoor lounge furniture, bikes, remoska, microwave or extra freezer. And no indoor shower either.
.You can certainly travel far and fast without them - whether it’s with a smaller motor home or with the smaller caravan we chose - just 4.2 metres internal space.
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Perhaps not such a big leap for us. We have never had an awning and the associated items that tend to go with then. Although there is quite a lot less space in the MH, cutting down on internal clutter means we don’t feel particularly cramped when living indoors. The big major plus is, that the seats are so much more comfortable than either of the two caravans we had.
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My first MH after the caravan was a Marquis Majestic 125. 150BHP Peugeot Euro 5 engine. More than adequate unless you are taking on the Stig or Clarkson. Moderate height transverse double over a reasonable sized low height garage that took two folding bikes plus table & chairs and the other odds and sods. Lounge wasn't massive but adequate and all on 6M. Had mine up-plated to 3500 but never used all of it. Never spent longer than a month though view of the jungle back home.
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Think outside the years of caravan experience would be a good start.
Exactly what you want to do, and how you will choose to use your MH will be the key. Using it for proper touring, quick set up and pack up? Move on more frequently than with a van? Use it for getting around daily off Site? Or......
Have lots of comforts around you? Pitch up and leave it on a pitch? Rely more on walking, cycling, public transport once pitched up?
Nothing wrong with either choice. Slightly smaller outfit will be best for first option, getting around, carrying less, much more mobile. You will have the benefits of your private loo, your mobile catering options, your dry, warm nest wherever you go through the day. Second option, size of outfit won’t be as crucial as it’s just left on Site.
We have a small AS monocoque (no leaks😉), we are both tall, like our comfort, and tour with big dogs, carry ebikes, and a large chariot for our elderly dog. We tour all seasons, so well used to cold and wet as well as hot and dry. We spend weeks away, hopping from place to place, vehicle goes out with us usually. Tables are integral, store nattily behind one of seat backs, clip together to be freestanding for outdoors. We carry two comfy but light chairs that slip into bathroom during transit, or in Fiamma box if we aren’t carrying bikes. Floor space behind cab is free for dogs, pull up catering. We have clothes needs down to a fine art, everywhere has a laundry of some kind for longer trips, we don’t carry too much. Any bulky/ heavy storage goes under side seating to spread load, not that we have much. Fitted with a roll out canopy.
Life is easy if you travel light, keep clutter to a minimum, use your storage wisely. Set up takes 10 minutes, pack up takes 10 minutes, but we have comfort, warmth and easy access to bathroom and cooking at all times. Think totally different to a caravan and it becomes very easy.1 -
Funnily enough, David, most of the M/H owners we encountered in the dim and distant past of Nov 2019 spent a lot of time showing how much stuff they could each cram into their vehicle. Not quite 'and the kitchen sink' but certainly the obligatory rechargeable full size Dyson [we only have a Shark, does this ostracise us?
]We do intend to travel much lighter to enable quicker getaways. Our caravan was bought the day before we left for France and Spain and was 14 years old at that stage. The logic was that if we didn't like towing a full size van, there wasn't a great deal of money lost and we would have plenty of time to see if the layout works. We had 89 nights in 'Swifty' and, assuming we have to crush it and use it as a paperweight, a complete write off of our investment will have cost us £37.38 per night!
Pack down is a pain, because of cleaning the towball, fixing the mirrors, reloading stuff into the car etc whereas M/H owners seem to just wash up and go!
Swifty is a small 2 berth so the usable space is probably not much less than a M/H has, but the reduction of 'associated kit & caboodle' AND the looking ahead to the time when the towcar needs changed has pushed us towards the convenience of a Motorhome. A European Tour or even into Scandinavia/Baltics is on our wishlist, and, whilst we could do it with the caravan, I suspect that the experience might become more endurance test than holiday.
Nothing is cast in stone yet, and if this year's holiday season is curtailed, we may stick with Swifty for a little longer
Everyone's advice and suggestions has given us a great deal of food for thought, so thanks to everyone who has 'chipped in' with Replies. This is not going to be a repeat of the Swifty 'buy Thursday AM, start holiday Friday AM' escapade.
A final thought; I had a heart attack in Spain in late January 2020 and the thought of just jumping into a M/H instead of pushing & pulling a caravan for the last couple of feet has an appeal!
Steve
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Yes, I've done it too, just with a rucksack but then you need a few facilities to make it more enjoyable...
We previously had the same small van as Deleted User and it was a great little van with cavernous storage because it was high off the ground and the under bed storage was deep, it was an excellent design all round. Good storage makes a difference, vans with outside lockers are better.
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Our 16 year old 'Swifty' is 6.21 metres overall length, but, at that great age, she needs the equivalent of incontinence pads, zimmer frame and other aids to keep going, so there's a decent amount of kit carried for any running repairs [locked out of caravan in rainstorm because of worn lock springs to mind]. Remoska earns its keep, cooking cakes, stews etc.
Steve
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Steve, you'll find the same appeal with the lack of a need to wind corner steadies or fetch and carry water too.
Travel light and the packing up routine certainly is wash up and go (and unhook the EHU).
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Good point re the EHU, TW!
Our ideal holiday would be pitch up, wind out a canopy for sun protection, table & 2 chairs for eating, then tee shirt & shorts and off on the bike to explore.
Need to lose the 'complete Anal Retentive' label a former work colleague awarded 'in her professional opinion' that compels me to load another 1/2 dozen 'just in case'.
I know those foreigners buy food and household consumables, because we see them doing so when we are in the local supermarket ...
Steve
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I hope you are making a good recovery Steve. I am sure you will find a MH less stressful across the board than even a small caravan. It’s one of the reasons we decided to buy our MH, so much less to do and think about than readying a caravan, and it sits on our drive ready to roll on a whim. All we do before setting off from home is basic safety checks, put some water in, put the bag of techy valuables in, shove the dog in and roll. Incidentally, we kept our old van. Intend (honestly😂) doing it up to use as a bolt hole left somewhere, but we just haven’t got on with it partly because we are out and about all time in MH. It should have been our lockdown project in truth, but others things took priority.
I would investigate a solar panel for MH as well, keeps things ticking over, gives you a bit more scope for some very basic stops if you fancy. Mind, we don’t carry a TV or any electrical stuff that requires a lot of juice.0 -
Interesting observation AD. We have remarked that some MH models don’t have decent windows, and can possibly appear a bit too closed in for us. The big windows are one of the things we enjoy about our choice. We often pull up somewhere, get out the bino’s and spend a while bird/wildlife spotting in the dry and warm. Much better than being glued to a TV screen. PVC’s are much more of a compromise, you have to go with what the conversion safely and practically allows, but some have big rear doors, side doors, so still plenty of fresh air and light. Like you, we live outdoors when we can😁
This was our view last Summer. Glorious beach just below dunes. Window was wide open because of heat, we had just got back from a swim, airing out MH before eating outside. It’s UK by the way😉0 -
Which only goes to show how different people are, David.🤷♂️
I'll be the first to admit that having 4 people in our PVC is simply not meant to be but with the 2 of us, we do far better than 'manage', we live comfortably even when confined to barracks by the weather of the Northern Isles. Btw, we've not done away with the TV or outside chairs and have the wind out canopy for the occasional day when the sun shines.
I think it's largely mindset in that we appreciate the benefits of the small van and that makes us willing to adapt. If someone doesn't really really want small, they're never going to he happy in it.
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True Tinny. We were frugal caravanners, even in our 13 foot Windrush. We have always preferred ease of set up/getaway, but have always been comfortable in our very small choices. Won’t suit all folks, we are all different, but it works very well for some of us. And that’s weeks away, not just the odd few days. If the weather was set to be nice in Cornwall, we often just shoved the awning under the van, and lived properly outside in day. Even to point of leaving bed set up. We holidayed with three big dogs in our van as well, but never cramped. You just shoved a dog up a bit😂
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The other consideration is taking it out for the day, whether from home or when you're away. You'll have everything with you and smaller vans are much easier to take to places.
I haven't felt any more cramped sitting with friends in a motorhome than a caravan, I feel they're all a bit cramped for indoor gatherings but some like to meet up and it's fine either way.
Since Brexit you won't be able to load up with consumables if heading to the EU so you'll be joining in a bit more with the locals and carrying a bit less weight in the van!
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It has not been a problem for us getting ready to move, when on a tour with either our two MCs or any .of our caravans before or since our 10years of using motorised caravans, just gives us more places to go when pitched up with a caravan, but we have normally travelled light ,unless when the grandchildren came and we would spend 21 nights on one site usually near the sea
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A final thought; I had a heart attack in Spain in late January 2020 and the thought of just jumping into a M/H instead of pushing & pulling a caravan for the last couple of feet has an appeal!
Steve
Sorry to hear that and hope you are now well mended? Might that be the reason for the relative radio silence recently? Certainly a good reason to be thinking motorhome! Not quite the same situation but we had an incident with our last caravan where the mover wasn't working and we had to get it back into the garden up a slight slope. We realised how futile it was and realised our days of moving a large caravan around by hand were over. I think it was that one incident that tipped us towards changing to a motorhome, we were already halfway there but that is what finally gave us the push we needed. This is our 8th year of motorhome ownership and we do really appreciate the simplicity getting ready to go and arrival or even stopping en route compared to our experience with a caravan in the latter years of our caravanning days, but others will disagree.
David
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Absolutely brue. We were on standby to sorn our MH for another month, but won’t if we can travel a bit further afield for day. It’s the safest day out option by a long way for us, our own facilities, our own eatery. Day trip heaven😁Even in the rain😉 Park up, walk or cycle ride, back to base for a meal, chill out watching birds, head home.
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