Holiday Blogs or Site Reviews?

JohnM20
JohnM20 Forum Participant Posts: 1,416
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edited November 2018 in Caravan & Motorhome Chat #1

My apologies if this has been covered previously but we all know what the search facility is like on CT.

I have just spent much of yesterday and part of today looking for suitable CLs in four different parts of the country ready for next year's holidays. Having looked at the details of numerous CLs the next natural thing to do was to look at reviews which can or should give a lot of additional information but why oh why are the vast majority of them just mini holiday blogs with almost no reference to the CL itself? I don't want or need to know that you had a nice meal in a pub on a day visit to Margate or that you spent all evening watching a couple of bats flying around or that you made a tasty omelette with the eggs that you bought from the farm. If I read "we spent X days at Y CL and had a great time. The owners were lovely" once I must have read it or very similar wording 50 times. I don't doubt that they are the facts but I bet 99% of all CL owners are lovely and most of us always have a great time whilst we are away.

What I want to know are the nitty griity bits about the CL such as, it's a long way to empty the loo, the grass is very boggy, toilets and showers are immaculate / very dirty, pitches are quite small / very generous, noise from barking dogs from kennels next door etc etc. I'm sure you get my drift. These are the things that a CL owner is not going to put on their information.

So my plea to anyone writing a review about a CL (or a main site) please at least start with details about the site, good or bad and, if you must, let us know that the owners horse is called Rosie  or that there was a flower show in the local church at the end.

 

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Comments

  • DavidKlyne
    DavidKlyne Club Member Posts: 13,860 ✭✭✭
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    edited November 2018 #2

    John

    The problem is if we don't encourage people to write reviews by making to many stipulations on what they should write about then I expect we end with no reviews? I am also not sure people are very good at reading instructions anyway as we even get reviews posted in the Story Section! You could look at it another way. If someone does write what  you might think of as a sugar coated review rather than a subjective review we can be fairly sure that nothing during their stay actually upset them. Personally when I read a review, like you, I want the facts about the site so I can make up my own mind but I am not sure how we get people to do that unless we have a system of moderation of reviews prior to publication which I am not sure is the way we want to go?

    David

  • JohnM20
    JohnM20 Forum Participant Posts: 1,416
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    edited November 2018 #3

    The trouble is, David, reviews will be / are about as much use as the magazine has become, especially the letters section. Bring back En-Route !

  • Tinwheeler
    Tinwheeler Forum Participant Posts: 23,142 ✭✭✭
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    edited November 2018 #4

    Perhaps a series of headings such as -

    Are the pitches level and tidy?

    What facilities exist and are they clean?

    Are the directions accurate?

    Is the grass cut and picked up?

    - and so on but I suspect we would get answers along the lines of "yes" and "lovely" which wouldn’t be a great deal of help.

     

  • brue
    brue Forum Participant Posts: 21,176 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    edited November 2018 #5

    I tend to regard reviews as a snapshot, what is one person's experience may alter for the next person, even "immaculate facilities" or "nicely mown grass" may not be the same every time. I'm pleased to see people writing as they want to, I think it's best left as it is, good or bad.

  • eurortraveller
    eurortraveller Club Member Posts: 6,829 ✭✭✭
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    edited November 2018 #6

    John M20,  I can only find one review from you. Might it be a good idea to write some more reviews of your own as an example of the right way to do it? 

  • Takethedogalong
    Takethedogalong Forum Participant Posts: 17,046 ✭✭✭
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    edited November 2018 #7

    EuroT does have a point John, you have to contribute as well! 

    sadly quite a number of my reviews on here were lost/Deleted User when the forum upgrade happened a couple of years ago, very annoying at the time, but I suppose if somewhere has a lot of reviews, then the most recent are the ones to read.

    To get the best out of reviews, I think you need to try and find someone whose likes and dislikes, wants and needs are similar to your own. You then know that you can trust such reviews, and share sites that have what you want. I am lucky enough to be in contact with a few other users of CT who do very informative reviews and happen to have similar wants and needs. There are some folks on here that put together some very good, succinct and trustworthy reviews, and are willing to share more details if you ask them. We have just got back from a recent tour having been helped out with two CLs we now can’t wait to use again, (thank you Nellie!) and a Club Site, Warwick Racecourse that DK posted a link to some photos for me, and that met our needs perfectly. 

    Unfortunately, the review section on this website doesn’t have the capacity to upload photos, but you can find them on other forums if you do a search. Some contributors on here also have their own blog sites which give a lot of information, including photos.

  • DavidKlyne
    DavidKlyne Club Member Posts: 13,860 ✭✭✭
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    edited November 2018 #8

    I wonder if Tinwheeler's suggestion of a more pro forma approach to reviews would get a response more inline with what the OP is saying? If a review required several named sections to be completed with each section having an open question which could not be answered with a simple yes or no answer?  At the end of the day it depends entirely on what the Club want from reviews and perhaps they are happy with the non specific approach? I also imagine it would be quite a big job to rewrite that part of the website? 

    David

  • Hedgehurst
    Hedgehurst Forum Participant Posts: 576
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    edited November 2018 #9

    That seems a good idea, as a guideline.

    I'd like to add "Is it quiet at night?" among some others.

    I confess however, that I've not posted reviews here, as we've not yet tried a CL, though I do regularly post on UKCampsites, where I find the reviews more useful for the sites we do use. Maybe one reason we've not used a CL yet is the remarkably vague nature of many reviews, just as in the OP's point.

    I'd also welcome more images on the CL entries, there's a great number with no image available. Do most owners not bother, or is it too complex to achieve this?

  • Tinwheeler
    Tinwheeler Forum Participant Posts: 23,142 ✭✭✭
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    edited November 2018 #10

    You’ll find a lot of CL reviews on UKC, HH.

    I don't pay a lot of attention to reviews unless the same negative (to me) points keep recurring. I find it much better to look at a map and Google Earth and make my own decisions. 

    The suggestion in my earlier post is simply a thought. I can’t see it leading to anything more useful than we currently get. Perhaps a few words printed somewhere asking people to comment on the permanent features of the site rather than the weather or their noisy neighbours might help.

  • Takethedogalong
    Takethedogalong Forum Participant Posts: 17,046 ✭✭✭
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    edited November 2018 #11

    I think the owners can submit a photo, but there doesn’t seem to be any way visitors can add photos to a review. It surely isn’t too onerous a task for the visiting inspector to take a general photo, and have at least that put onto each CL page? Digital cameras, so easy to use nowadays?

    Agree TW, they are so diverse, and no visitor tends to have exactly the same likes or dislikes. One CL owner we recently spoke to who runs a very nice CL got nothing but moans and groans from a particular visitor who was fed up with the weather! Not sure how helpful a review from that person would be!

     

  • Tinwheeler
    Tinwheeler Forum Participant Posts: 23,142 ✭✭✭
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    edited November 2018 #12

    As I said to HH, David, I don’t think it would be productive as I outlined it. You’ve developed the idea further and maybe with a few words of guidance per section it might have legs. 

    Something like "Say why you consider this site to be suitable or otherwise for you". 

    A huge undertaking though and one I guess CT's software may not handle.

  • Oneputt
    Oneputt Club Member Posts: 9,144 ✭✭✭
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    edited November 2018 #13

    If reviews became prescriptive I would’nt  bother to read or, indeed, write any more.  

  • Tinwheeler
    Tinwheeler Forum Participant Posts: 23,142 ✭✭✭
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    edited November 2018 #14

    There’s prescriptive and there’s giving a bit of guidance, One. A fine line between them, I agree. 

  • Oneputt
    Oneputt Club Member Posts: 9,144 ✭✭✭
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    edited November 2018 #15

    I read reviews if travelling in the U.K. but both reviews and folks blogs when travelling over there.  I quite like the Acsi reviews as you get a fairly good indication of the facilities etc from the scoring method

  • Traficlady
    Traficlady Forum Participant Posts: 99
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    edited November 2018 #16

    I try to write reviews of sites objectively and describe the facilities fairly - I don’t like reading that the showers are old, I want to know if they work! I generally also put a bit of local info i if I can, such as whether the site is on a bus route or near a station etc., walkable into a village or a local attraction, which are things I would want to know.

    When I read reviews, I generally read the poor ones first and work my way up to 5 star, but so often you have to read between the lines too.

    Nora

  • JohnM20
    JohnM20 Forum Participant Posts: 1,416
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    edited November 2018 #17

    All I'm asking for is that an invited review of a site is just that, of the site not of someones holiday activities.

    It doesn't matter how many reviews I have written, that is totally immaterial as is finding someone who has similar likes to me. If the CL is as described by the owner then there is nothing constructive that I could write in a review and I like to think I have done my homework well enough before we go to sort the wheat from the chaff.  What I'm looking for are the negative aspects of a site that the owner will obviously not publish or the positive points that, perhaps, the owner has omitted.

    We don't use the caravan as much now and most of our nights away have been over the channel but next year we are staying in the UK, hence the task of trawling through many CL reviews in four different areas. Then followed up by 'viewing' possible CLs on Google Earth to check location and access.

  • EasyT
    EasyT Forum Participant Posts: 16,194
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    edited November 2018 #18

    I agree John; far easier to let somebody else doe the work isn't it.

  • Tinwheeler
    Tinwheeler Forum Participant Posts: 23,142 ✭✭✭
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    edited November 2018 #19

    Look at it this way, John. By not writing a review you are not helping others by confirming whether the site owner’s description is accurate. There is always something constructive you can add even if it’s only to say the site description is spot on, to comment on cleanliness of facilities or grass cutting. 

    Frankly, your attitude is not helping the very situation you complain about. Do as you would be done by and set an example. 

  • JVB66
    JVB66 Forum Participant Posts: 22,892
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    edited November 2018 #20

    One thing that stands out with reviews is when there is a negative review amongst mostly positive ones,which means to me that the reviewer has probably had a self inflicted "problem? "and that goes for both main sites and cls

  • Takethedogalong
    Takethedogalong Forum Participant Posts: 17,046 ✭✭✭
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    edited November 2018 #21

    How can a preference for certain common aspects be useless John? I’ll give you a couple of examples

    Dog ownership. Search filter will tell you if a CL takes dogs. That’s a reasonable start. But it won’t tell you if the dog walking is safe, in a sheep filled field, along a busy road, fit only for a chihuahua! A review from another dog owning reviewer might give you more information!

    Noise, in the day, at night time. Very individual. Some folks never notice a busy road, trains passing by, stock living on a farm, aircraft flying overhead, a school located close by, etc..... Noise is the only thing ever to have had us leave a site. We did our homework, yes we didn’t mind the aircraft overhead, but the boy racers and huge trucks thundering past on a long straight B road caught us out. Unrelenting and very loud. Others on site weren’t bothered, we found it horrendous.

    By completing a review, mentioning things like the above, you are likely to help a few others with similar tastes.

    Give me a clue on what you are looking for, where and when and I might have an idea for a CL. We have used quite a few down the years.

  • SteveL
    SteveL Club Member Posts: 12,303 ✭✭✭
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    edited November 2018 #22

    Personally I think the blog bits of reviews are often the most useful. Especially when they deal with items of information that would be difficult to find out by other means, such as concessionary routes that would not show up when I check my OS maps. Also info on phone and Wifi, which networks work.

    Yes general comments on the facilities should be included, clean, tidy, well laid out etc. However, so much about a site is subjective, so that unless you know the reviewer are not terribly helpful. A noisy road, aircraft, railway line, I have seen them all on reviews. I would not have even commented on them they were so unobtrusive.

  • Tinwheeler
    Tinwheeler Forum Participant Posts: 23,142 ✭✭✭
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    edited November 2018 #23

    I don’t consider the items you describe as ‘blog bits’, Steve. They are useful items and things I include in my reviews if I can.

    I see the ‘blog bits’ as being such as “we had lovely weather and our friends came to visit” or “the people on the next pitch were grumpy and didn’t speak”. For me, the distinction is whether the events/items described are likely to be the same when I visit or whether they were fleeting occurrences. 

    Likewise, numerous reviews complain about dog owners but the chances of those people being there when I visit are minimal so I disregard them. However the review complaining about a site owner’s dog wandering around a CL could be a different matter for some people. 

  • JohnM20
    JohnM20 Forum Participant Posts: 1,416
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    edited November 2018 #24

    Sorry but it seems that some are missing the point. What I'm asking for members to write a review of the site / CL not that the weather was nice during your stay or that cousin Mary came to visit you or you had a nice meal in the local town or that there were roadworks on your journey there. These are nothing to do with the CL.

    I know that assumption is the mother of all f*** *ps but in real life sometimes assumption is all that can be used. If no-one writes that there is a problem with a certain feature of the CL then one must assume that it is generally acceptable and may even be exceptionally good.

    Just as a comment in reply to Tinwheeler.  If everybody wrote a review about the CL whether positive or negative there would be hundreds to read through. If they were succinct and purely about the CL it would be a much easier task but unfortunately many of them aren't. Assuming the average stay on a CL is 7 nights (which is possibly on the high side) and the CL is full, that is a minimum of 130 reviews for just a six month period. Without going back into them to check, from recollection, the average number of reviews per CL per calendar year is, in my estimation, less than10. So whilst it would be nice to have all the facts about a CL confirmed by everyone visiting it I don't think it will ever happen.

     

  • brue
    brue Forum Participant Posts: 21,176 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    edited November 2018 #25

    There are certain things you know will get repeated about particular sites, the love or hate issues with trees, trains, planes, the surprised remarks about farm noises on farms, the wind on exposed sites etc etc.

    It is true, the small remarks about things are often more revealing and personally I'm always interested in the true distance to a bus stop, shop or pub etc. A half hour not so easy walk to a hostelry or village and no footpaths tells me a lot more.....

  • EasyT
    EasyT Forum Participant Posts: 16,194
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    edited November 2018 #26

    Sorry but it seems that some are missing the point.

    I think that the point, for me, is that I have no sympathy that you find the reviews less than perfect John unless you take the trouble to provide reviews for others, which you apparently do not. 1 review and none in the last 18 months. Don't you get out much or do you expect others to do all the work whilst you gather the fruits?

  • Takethedogalong
    Takethedogalong Forum Participant Posts: 17,046 ✭✭✭
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    edited November 2018 #27

    I think there has to be a degree of thought given to the CL owners. Most try very hard to be welcoming, provide clean, tidy places to stay, at a reasonable price for the location. After that, facilities, provision of services can vary enormously. What I consider a perfectly adequate and clean shower on a £10 Site might not be the next visitors ablutions nirvana. That’s why there is always such a lively debate when anyone tries to compare any kind of site, we are all very different in our expectations and preferences, and I suppose in what we will tolerate. A nit picking reference to something that might only have occurred once, or outside the control of the owner is not that useful.

    Where are you thinking of visiting John?

  • Tinwheeler
    Tinwheeler Forum Participant Posts: 23,142 ✭✭✭
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    edited November 2018 #28

    “… it seems that some are missing the point…”

     

    I think there’s only one person missing the point.

  • Hedgehurst
    Hedgehurst Forum Participant Posts: 576
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    edited November 2018 #29

    Inspectors' photo - yes, agree.

    Weather - I agree in general, though if it's a particularly exposed site so that in windy weather it's a real buffet, or in wet weather it quickly becomes a quagmire, I'd take that into account.
    And I recently posted a review (ukcampsites again, sorry!) including the comment that even in cold windy weather the unheated shower area still worked because the water's so hot and abundant, which I also reckon to be relevant to potential visitors.

    I reckon that we can probably cope with reading round a few accounts of Rosie the sheep/hen/dog and extract for ourselves the general flow, though. It's usually obvious from the first few sentences what sort of prose it's going to be!

  • mickysf
    mickysf Forum Participant Posts: 6,474 ✭✭✭
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    edited November 2018 #30

    The problem with some reviews is that they are only really judgemental snap shots in a moment of time. That noisey neighbour, that pet left unattended, that problem with the EHU caused by the last clumsy occupant, that exceptional weather event. Also those characteristics which some find delightful which others don't, like the 'interaction' with the wildlife which we share our countryside with, that heritage railway running adjacent to the site, the church bells which peel the hour, the lack of lighting on site which allows us sight of the beauty of our dark skies. Afterall, one person's delight is another's poison. Fine line between blog and review me thinks, it's up to the reader I guess to pick the bones!

  • Wherenext
    Wherenext Club Member Posts: 10,607 ✭✭✭
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    edited November 2018 #31

    So, let me see if I've got this right John.

    You are castigating fellow members for not leaving more informative practical information in their reviews but you can't be arsed to leave any reviews yourself? Mmmm.

    I think I'll just sit this one out although I expect a fellow CTer will along in a minute to tell me off for not making myself clear.