Rock ‘n’ Roll
Hiya folks.
I tow a Bailey Senator ‘Arizona’ with a Ford Kuga. The MIRO is around 1250kg’s and it won’t be much more than that all-up, I don’t load it up. The Kuga is stated as around 1700kg’s. As I said in another thread, I need to put what little I have inside at the back (bathroom). This includes one gas bottle. This is because I need to get the noseweight down to a little under 100kg’s. Ok, that’s the background. The problem I’m getting is that over uneven roads, the outfit lurches, not massively, but significantly. Is this because of the way it’s loaded, or do I need to look at up-rated dampers/shocks? The Kuga pulls the van easily, and there’s absolutely no issue with general stability, but I would like to sort this problem. Any ideas please?
Cheers, Freddy.
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I’d say it’s due to the way it’s loaded but you’d need to experiment to prove it.
I’d certainly not carry the gas bottle in that manner. It’s intended to be carried securely in a ventilated locker, or maybe you’ve drilled holes in the washroom floor.
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What you have created is comparable to a bowling ball on the end of a broom handle. I'm surprised it hasn't gone off to visit a ditch already.
Weight is concentrated, but away from the axle. If you were carrying MORE kit, and it was nearer the axle then much of that particular problem would go away. The gas really does have to be in the locker designed for carrying it. Not just the holes, but the (sort of) fire resisting bulkhead.
This does not help with the noseweight though. My Senator has the same noseweight problem - sometimes! I do have a gas bottle in the locker, and a emergency Gaz bottle, and two wastemasters but when on the motor mover the jockey wheel can lift off the ground. As the Land Rover I use has a maximum noseweight of 150Kg I have no concerns, other than it is reputed the chassis/hitch is only rated for 100kg.
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Thanks for the replies 👍The gas bottle thingy was never intended to be a permanent solution, more a way of getting over the problem with the noseweight. I don’t think there’s any way I could put the gas bottle in the locker, in the car possibly? That said, I take on board what’s been said about putting on more weight closer to the axle, so that may well change.
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I wouldn’t carry the gas bottle in the car either unless I wished to endanger all the occupants. Your insurance company would probably be delighted as, at the first opportunity, they'd use that as a reason not to pay out.
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i would empty van and weigh nose and see what it is. then start loading with all the heavy stuff on the axle and work around that. keep checking nose weight as you go till it's what you require. then test drive and see how she responds. if all ok you could even take a pic on your mobile for future loading.
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Surely all the dinette floor is behind the axle?
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Yes, the wheel arch is boxed in under the table.
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Happy to.
I have a gas tank! When we had a caravan we always bought gas bottles on site.
There's also a world of difference between transporting a gas bottle half a mile to fit it in a van and towing the length of the UK or into Europe at 60mph, or whatever, always with the gas bottle in the car. Ferry operators wouldn’t be happy either.
I'm surprised you needed to ask.
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Vertically in the footwell behind front passenger seat with some padding and passenger seat pushed back to restrain it in my case. Not a common occurrence though as I exchange on site normally and so carried in the caravan. Also in the car behind passenger seat from reception but less fussy about packing to constrain at 4mph
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Us too. I’m on a site now, without a source of replacements, so we’ve had to go to an outlet, off site, as indeed we did before we came away and have done to ensure full bottles before continental trips. In fact we’re no strangers to carrying replacement bottles in a car, sensibly secured. We also carry volatile liquid in our car fuel tank, which helps to propel it. Like the gas, and I’m mindful that some vehicles nowadays run on gas, sensible transportation being the key.
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so why ask for advice if you knew the answer?
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The poster told us that he wouldn’t transport gas in his car unless he wanted to endanger the occupants. As many of us have a need to replace our LV gas cylinders from locations too far away for us to transport them without a car, I simply asked him to share his solution to avoiding that risk. I don’t have an alternative to my own solution, which he tells us is unsuitable because it will endanger the occupants. A practical alternative will, I’m sure, be welcomed by many readers.
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A great twist of words there. I ain’t rising to that one.
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+1 TW
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Here’s another twist - we’ve been publicly advised that ferry operators and car insurers won’t be happy about gas bottles being carried in cars. From which, should we deduce that campers with tents, not trailers, are no longer acceptable? Or maybe, just maybe, should we deduce that the advice that gas cylinders shouldnt be carried in cars was somewhat ill considered.
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Thought I’d resurrect this thread. Picked up the new van yesterday. I’d previously checked the noseweight, which came out as 60kg’s. I meant to bring it up to around 85kg’s by putting the gas bottles in the front locker, but I forgot. The thing is, it towed great, with no Rock ‘n’ Roll. Yes, there was some lurching on uneven roads, but it was nowhere near what I had previously experienced, even though it’s heavier. I realise there might be other forces at play, but it does make me wonder if a higher noseweight is always best?
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Some years ago we had a heavy coachbuilt van but it had a very light noseweight. So light you could easily lift the hitch with one hand. It towed like a dream and it’s my guess that the van was 'properly' designed, built and balanced.
Hope the van serves you well.
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“Hope the van serves you well.”
Thanks. I will of course try different noseweights to see how it handles, but I’m suspecting (at this point) that the noseweight isn’t everything. It may (or may not) be the fact that the new van has shock absorbers that is having an influence, I don’t know. You may remember I started a thread about shock absorbers, and it was the stability aspect I was really interested in without trying to influence, I was fishing 😉 😀
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don't Safefill owners do exactly this when driving off to get them refilled?
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Freddy, your outfit will be much more stable with the nose weight as near the maximum as possible and with it loaded correctly to reduce the pendulum effect with heavy stuff low over the axle and tyre pressures set correctly. In your case I would aim for 90kg + nose weight (I assume hook and car are rated at 100kg). I tow a 1326kg caravan with a VW Tiguan with about 95kg nose weight, a very stable combination with little pitching or swaying.
Re how to carry gas bottles when exchanging. I put one in a dustbin 'secured' by bungees in the boot space of the car (an SUV) as I would not want to risk marking the upholstery. We use so little gas that this is a once every 18 months event anyway! A Gaz 907 cylinder (for the BBQ) travels next to the gas bottles in the caravan front locker. I would never travel with a gas bottle in the car other than when exchanging one..
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