Towing a car with a Motorhome
Hi my husband and I plan to retire this year and travel around Europe. Can anyone share advice about towing a Smart car on a braked A-frame. Are they legal, and has anyone had problems towing a car with a Motorhome.
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My understanding is that A-Frames are not really legal anywhere (no type approval?) but in the UK and perhaps a couple of other countries in Europe a blind eye is usually turned to their use. Spain seems to be the country where they tend to clamp down on them particularly and people can be fined on the spot. I have heard reports of people being stopped in Germany although the police there can be a bit more pragmatic. If you do take a chance and use an A-Frame then you will have to be prepared to disconnect and drive the car separately if the police tell you to. The best way to tow a car in Europe is a proper trailer and you often see Smart cars transported in that way.
David
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We have in the past towed a small Kia Picanto on an A frame. It is as DK says some countries will tolerate it others will not. We have been stopped in both Germany and Belgium. We no longer take the car with us but do take 2 ebikes to get around on and for pleasure, much better experience riding bikes over there. If we need a car for any reason we would just rent one.
I would advise to take your time and don't jump in thinking you will need a car, you may not. It is much easier to get around with your mh over there. Also you mention a smart car, if its automatic can it be put on an A frame? We were warned against buying and A framing a Smart as they are rear heavy and can bounce around especially when pulling away on a bend. If you decide you really do need a car then my advice would be put a smart on a smart trailer then you will be legal everywhere. Things may change with Brexit who knows.
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There are different schools of thought on the subject.. I towed a Seat Marbella on a "car-a-tow" A frame for five years or more, then a Fiat punto for a few years more, the chap who fitted it for me used to give you a sort of legal do's and dont's which explained to who ever has pulled you over that the A frame and towed vehicle become a "braked trailor"but I must admit I never towed in France or spain cos of a few bad stories involving their police with other towers, so there you are you pays your money and takes your chances...H
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we've seen a couple pull into sites jn Spain but they have definitely taken a chance in doing it....perhaps they are happy with the risk if they have two drivers...?
however, it isn't legal as stated above....
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A frames are not legal on the continent. They are tolerated in the UK, but current legislation require that the A Frame Towed car has to have extensive modifications to be considered legal.
Much better IMO to use a proper twin axle car trailer where you don't need any modifications to be done to your car..
K
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Twin axle trailers are not required for a Smart car, bit like using a sledgehammer to crack a nut
However I do think that given the cost of the 'new' type A frames that if we were going down this road again we would use a trailer, the cost can be equal to and in some cases less than an A frame and conversion.
There is a but of course and that is how fit are you, are you able to lift the A frame to attach it to the vehicle, or on the other hand are fit enough to push a trailer +car onto a pitch
Of course some pitches are big enough and flat enough so no problem reversing or not
however as those who travel abroad know, that no 2 pitches and sites are the same. Some are in awkward corners, some have trees on, some are small or uneven and some have a small curb that you have to mount.We had a trike on a trailer for a few years so have experience of all these issues. Lets not forget that with a trailer you have to secure the car, this can be a bit of a faff if you are not confident or competent.
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Yes you can tow a Smart car using an A-frame, many people do. I wouldn't recommend using an A-frame outside of the UK for reasons already stated and agree that there is less need for the use of a "toad" abroard.
There are several trailer manufacturers making small compact trailers specifically for Smart cars and other small city cars, ie Fiat 500.
There can be a problem with over loading the rear axle of the MH though when towing a trailer.
My 3500kg Bolero 684 runs with the rear axle pretty much at its maximum weight of 2000kg so adding the noseweight of a trailer would not be an option.0 -
If you don't buy the Smartcar, or the A frame, or the trailer, and don't pay the extra ferry or tunnel fares, and if you save on the extra fuel costs of towing the car around, and don't have the insurance cost for the Smartcar, you can just hire a car in Europe when you need one, or take a taxi now and then.
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I’m with EuroT. Save your money and save yourself the hassle.
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If you hire make sure you get insurance for hire car damage as the car rental companies are sharks in waiting.
We hired a number of times through Enterprise, but our last hire was an ""education". They kept £1000 on the credit card for a month then We were charged over £500 for a minor ding, probably caused by some one opening a door onto the side of the car.
Had we of known the ding was there, we would have taken an extra days hire and got it fixed for less than £100. Probably l could have sorted it with a rub of cutting polish and a wax.
This experience is making us think that towing a car would be better option than hiring.
rgds
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You're correct. Smarts are automatic, but as discussed here many times as tow cars, there are different flavours of automatic. Smarts use a manual gearbox with automated controls ie electrickery 'presses' the clutch & then changes gear & even though Mercedes cover their backsides by saying you can't tow a Smart because it's an auto, there are many Smarts that have been towed many a mile on the back of a motorhome/etc.
'Proper' torque converter autos are typically restricted to being towed about 30 miles at a max speed of around 50mph before you break them.
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All interesting reading........
We have just changed one of our family sized cars for a Pug 108, which we think will be adequate as a second car. I looked at the cost of having it adapted for an A frame which is around £2k from both of the companies offering electronic braking, so have ordered a single axle trailer, which appears to be adequately rated, and is cheaper than the A Frame cost but allows me to swap the car willy nilly and I will adapt the trailer to carry my motorbike instead of the car if desired. This gives us the flexibility to tour with the van solo, which we do regularly or with a bike or small car behind us.....
Not sure yet how it will work in practice, but I liked the theory of it and have managed to convince the OH so far......!
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Your trailer sounds ideal, TT. As has been said, a correctly rated single axle trailer is adequate for a small car.
Your MH does need to have adequate towing weight allowance for the car and trailer combined weight but you’ll have avoided making mods to the car which could greatly affect its trade in price in future.
Be aware that not all club staff are aware that no extra charge is made on site for either the car or the trailer - at least, that was the case back when we did it.
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Yes TW....
Trailer weighs 350kg, Pug weighs 840kg Total 1190kg
Autotrail rated to tow 1250kg so scrape within the limit.
I spoke to AT tech dept last week about nose weight limits etc....
I shall drive like Miss Daisy's grandmother when towing.....
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No charge for either as long as it all fits within the confines of your pitch TW.
I had a warden try and charge me for my car last year, I know you couldn't make it up
JK
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Sounds like you’ve got it covered, TT. 👍🏻
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I had the call centre charge me an extra £2 p/n on a load of bookings, JK, then each had to be adjusted on site. One particular grumpy warden couple (now retired) argued the charge was right as it was another set of wheels. They only backed down when I said I was taking it up with HQ. It wasn’t the experience I needed on holiday.
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Why push a trailer with a car on it? Surely a motor mover can be fitted? There is a nice big battery in the car sitting on the trailer. I see them on boat trailers so it is not a caravan exclusive item.
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Who's pushing it? Either the MH will move it or the car will be unloaded leaving only the empty trailer to be manhandled with ease. Some trailers must be supported by the towball of the towing vehicle when loaded to take the weight off the jockey wheel.
Don't forget the weight of the mover may add too much to the load and will make the trailer, or the mover itself, that much more attractive to ne'er do wells.
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All comes down to weight I'm afraid, for us personally it wouldn't be an issue as we can tow 2000kg but for some it could take them over their limit. The other thing to remember is the rear axle weight when towing, this is not an issue with an A frame which is why some go down that route.
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We've never been charged yet in the UK, although I believe some none club sites are doing so.
We have been charged in Germany, France and Spain though using Acsi, in Germany the site owner apologised and said Acsi rules sorry and showed me the relevant page in the book. We had a little chat (in german) this was then waived
In France I just appeared shocked and said we had never been charged before it was also waived. Spain (Burgos) no ifs no buts we paid €2.60 per night. In each case it was just the one site in each country. Oh the Netherlands site told us he should charge us but he didn't. On another forum I use there are reports that in Spain some sites are charging as much as €5 per day if its on the pitch.
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