Toyota RAV4 Hybrid as a towcar
Does anyone tow with a Toyota RAV4 Hybrid?
We currently use a RAV4 2.2 auto deisel AWD as our towcar and are extremely happy with it but we are becoming increasingly concerned about the future of deisel cars and will need to change it soon anyway. We love the RAV and wondered if anyone has experience of towing with a hybrid, and in particular the RAV4 2.5 Hybrid AWD introduced in 2016. We currently tow a Bailey Pegasus Genoa (MTPLM 1365kg) and are unlikely to go much above this weight in the future. Any thoughts / advice would be much appreciated.
Also does the club have any plans for doing a towcar test using a hybrid?
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Hybrids are not generally noted for their towing abilities, indeed some are not type approved to tow. However to debunk some of the anti diesel hysteria; any changes to tax etc will not affect EU6 compliant engines which are as clean if not cleaner than petrol. A recent WHO report raises increasing concerns about emission problems with particulates from the high compression turbo petrol engines used to achieve theoretical good mpg figures...... And what about the impact of mining the Lithium for the hybrid batteries and environmental impact of disposal of the batteries at end of life?!
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Hi MartinOrd1
i have a 2.5 Rav 4 hybrid. We tow a Sprite major 6td which is around 1450kg. From memory the Rav can tow 1550 or 1600 kg.
i'm happy with it as a tow car, comfortable to drive with enough power for towing.
I've had it since last September and it's been fine.
hooe that helps a bit
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Hi
I spoke to Toyota dealer last week on subject. I was interested in Hybrid as potential replacement for Honda CRV due (in part) to health risks from NO2 and focus on dirty diesel at present (Longer term higher tax likely, effect on diesel car values etc). In theory high low speed torque of electric motor should be an advantage.Dealer response was that early hybrid models (of which Toyota have some experience) was that the engine management system is focussed on economy. Dealer commented that engine/auto gearbox management system (i.e. magic box of electronics and software) can now recognise when the towbar has trailer plugged in and attached. Electric motor response is adjusted accordingly - so improving tow capability. Previously, the motor tended to overheat, as it was required to do all the work at low speed on a unit of much greater weight than designed for in the car without caravan attached.
Technically plausible, but likely to just be salesman chatter. It would be interesting to get our tech experts to comment on potential for hybrids as tow vehicles - it seems that there are increasing number of these vehicles becoming available.
Like most folk I use my car for commuting, in town, and for caravan towing. I am interested in a Hybrid as a less polluting town car than high NOx & particulates from a diesel engine vehicle, and believe that the electric motor drive could be of some practical use when towing, but is unlikely to be of much benefit overall in fuel consumption.
Over to the tech experts for comment.
Martin M
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"Technically plausible, but likely to just be salesman chatter."
Reality probably, Some cars with 6,7,8 or even 9 speed autos will pull away in 2nd gear but will use 1st if a trailer plug connection is detected
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Have towed with a Mitsubishi Phev hybrid no problems not far on electric though made up for it though being able to plug it in on site to run around towed bailey unicorn Vigo
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But essentially, can it tow minimum of 175 miles in a day pulling a 1650 Kg caravan, and then be refuelled overnight on a 6 amp municipal site EHU, and then be able to do it all over again the next day?
If it can, great I will buy one job done! But if not I will stick to my 3 Litre Diesel.
TF
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I also tow with a RAV4 2013, 2.2 diesel. Soon my other car, a 2.0 diesel Avensis 2008 will need replacing so looking into the hybrid option to keep ahead of the game. Toyota like Volvo are doing away with diesel in the near future for hybrid or electric only, so it would be nice if someone would do an in-depth review on the RAV4 hybrid. It's the fuel economy of the 2.5 petrol engine that worries me not the hybrid eliminate. The RAV4 is not the most frugal on fuel, solo or towing but at least I know it's limits, but with a petrol/electric hybrid, currently this is unknown so a thought test would be a great help from the Club in coming to a decision.
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I have no interest in a hybrid as a tow car. When at home for 8 months of the year the tow car does little mileage and so, from an economy point of view not worth the faff of plugging in to an outlet. It probably does 4 miles every 2 weeks to keep it moving and maybe a fortnightly trip of 10 miles each way. The main mileage is when away in the caravan and I would have no desire to plug in on site.
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Since the original question was posed by MartinOrd 1, only one person has given a relevant answer
We took a Rav4 Hybrid out for a test drive albeit solo last Wednesday.
Great car and is certainly well specified to tow our caravan.
Anyone else have experience of actually using a Rav4 Hybrid to tow a caravan please?
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I have just bought a RAV4 hybrid and will be towing my Coachman wanderer with it in March. So of there are no other answers to the specific question, I will update you then...
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It would be interesting to compare the towing performance and fuel efficiency between the Mitsubishi Phev and the RAV4. The Phev has a 1500Kg tow limit and the RAV 1650Kg
It would be good to get some real life towing figures for both these cars as some members maybe considering these new or used as their next towcar.
There seems to be a lot of info on the web, I got curious so here is a snippet of what I have found, please don't take as "read" cos (a), the webs not always right
or (b) I might have got it wrong. and (c) these are damn complicated cars with oil cooled motors and generators running up to 14000rpm and airconditioned battery packs, multi drive modes etc. for example (a)EV mode 2 electric motors driven no petrol engine running, (b)series mode Petrol engine runs at fixed speed but just drives generator which powers battery and one or both electric motors and (c)parallel mode where the Petrol engine is engaged with the front wheels and the rear electric motor can be driven if the battery has enough charge! more Phew than Phev...The two cars have similar series EV/Parallel-Hybrid drives but different Batteries the Phev has Lithium ion 25 Ah 300V and RAV4 NiMH (Nickel Hydride) at 6.5Ah 240V. (from best info I can find) The Phev being a plug in as well as an engine charged car has a short but useful battery only range approx 30 mi The RAV seems to be designed as a Electrically assisted car having a very short battery range solo approx 0.6 mi.
The generators appear to give 50kW RAV-70kW Phev from info on the web.
The traction motors are 2x 25kW (assumption) on the RAV and 2 x 60kW on the PHEV both cars a.c. motors driven through a dc/ac inverter drive at approx 600V
I believe efficiency, mpg and emissions on both cars are gained by the electric drive enabling the petrol motor to operate in its most efficient range. Obviously keeping the petrol engine in the peak efficiency range is much easier when the car is solo. If the generator that is powered by the petrol engine cannot supply enough energy to the battery and electric motors to keep the petrol engine within its peak efficiency range, fuel consumption will be drastically increased. This might happen at full load towing on a long several mile incline where once batteries are demanding full charging current and the electric motors are also demanding a lot of current. From the figures above this situation would seem more likely to occur with the Phev but that is speculation.
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I am interested in some real world towing and solo world mpg figures back to back with a diesel equivalent. And what state the batteries are in after 5 or 10 years use..... My local Mitsubishi dealer doesn’t recommend the Outlander PHEV for towing, advised sticking with diesel.....
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has anybody thought about a motorway crash involving both petrol and battery powered vehicles. one spark and BOOM. was watching the series about the A1 motorway and police and highway patrol would not touch the hybrid in case it was still live and waited for recovery wagon to remove it after a crash. as mentioned earlier 25Ah and 300v. wow.
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Its good that someone actually has the vehicle under discussion so can give us some real facts and practical experience rather than the blether, sorry I mean speculation we normally get on this subject.
Perhaps Liam you could expand a bit on the types of towing journeys, the performance of the car when driven by petrol and battery.
Is the transmission 4wd? manual or Auto gearbox?
Is the battery recharged only by the petrol engine, or can it be plugged in?
Will the car automatically switch to petrol engine power when the caravan is electronically detected, or does it start off with battery power?
Will the car actually tow at all using battery power?
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I have a Toyota Auris 1.8l hybrid and will be swapping for a Hybrid Rav later this year with a view to using it as a tow car. For those who are not aware of how the Toyota hybrid technology works the Auris and the Rav 4 are both self charging hybrids so there is no option to plug either in. The car decides when the motors kick in and are charged directly either from the engine or from re-generation when braking. As far as I understand it the Rav AWD has front wheel drive from the engine and a pair of motors which power the rear wheels with the ECU deciding when and how much drive is put through each wheel. As standard the Rev has Trailer sway control which senses if the load being towed starts to shift its weight and puts power to individual wheels to maintain the stability of the car.
I can switch my Auris to battery only but this only works below 20mph and is only good for about 13 miles then the petrol power kicks back in. There is a "normal" mode which uses petrol only and a "power" mode which combines the engine and motors producing about 140bhp. The Rav will produce about 220bhp depending on which year/variant you have
The info regarding how the power is used by the Rav above needs fact checking but I'm still reading everything I can get hold of and will update if I find any more info. Hope this helps
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