Smart Alternator Technology etc.
I tow my Unicorn 3 Vigo with a 63 plate Ford Kuga. I have found that on all journeys the van fridge defrosts by the time I arrive at my destination. The cause is the smart alternator technology on the car, which turns the output off when the car's battery is fully charged. This also turns off the direct circuit to the van fridge.
I only noticed this as the fridge is a large one and more susceptible to losing cooling than the smaller ones in my previous Unicorn and Pegasus vans.
No solution from Ford, or my dealer who has carried out circuit testing on the car at Ford's behest.
Although I don't have it, a stop/start system does the same thing as on starting again the circuit to the fridge remains switched off.
Anybody else experienced this or has a solution?
The National Caravan Council issued a paper on this in December 2016.
Comments
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We have a Pegasus iv with the large fridge,and we tow with a Kia Sportage,and have the same problem ,we had the car checked at the tow bar fitters and it showed power to the fridge supply, but of course that was just a quick check,so it might be the same "problem" I feel a deeper investigation coming on!
Where can i find the ncc paper?
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You could connect the fridge feed directly to the car battery, just remember to disconnect when parked with the engine off for any length of time.
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I had the same problem with my ix35. I put an led on the output to the fridge and found that because of the smart alternator most of the time there was no output to the fridge or battery. The easiest solution was to switch the headlights on dip, then most of the time there was an output to the fridge and battery. I have now got a Volvo with a Volvo wiring kit which seems to work okay.
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I'm not an vehicle electrician, but I am certainly confused as to why is this an issue with the smart alternator?
The feed to the van should be from a fused connection from the battery, this should provide power regardless of what the alternator is doing, if there is charge in the battery.
The supply should not be from the alternator direct (the alternator is connected to the battery) and even if it were connected to the alternator, the alternator should not switch off due to the demand from the fridge.
The alternator should just be looking after the battery.
If the supply to the van is switching off with the alternator, then there must be a switched solenoid in the permanent 12V supply to the van, this would be normal and typically be from the ignition circuit, so the fridge cannot flatten the battery in the car when the engine is not running.
Has this solenoid been wired up to a switching supply that is somehow connected to the alternator output voltage rather than the ignition on voltage?
If so, this should be an easy fix by sorting the switching input or by fitting a simple switched bypass.0 -
Single socket or double socket?
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Don't know if my 12 plate Kia has 'smart alternator' technology, however the 12v feed from the 13 pin socket is only live when the engine is running.
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Hope the following link enables you to read the NCC paper.
http://dmtrk.net/WP7-4OFGD-AFFGVSDZ59/cr.aspx
I have a 13 pin socket, and get constant power from pin 9, 12.5v / 14.8v, and no power from pin 10 unless the engine is running, 0v / 14.8v.
There are 3 wires connected to the battery via a fuse.
It is the car's engine management system that switches off the alternator as part of the fuel saving measures.
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Spot on cj it does sound like they have either used a direct power supply from the alternator or the split charge relay is being triggered by the alternator output instead of an ignition switched relay. Either way its an easy fix.
Jeff C LAE MIMI
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You may find the recent blog on caravan chronicles of interest because it discusses this very subject. I found it of interest.
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I had the same problem on my 2015 Kuga when towing across France. If the car battery is OK,the alternator only delivers a charge when I brake. I'm not sure that simple solutions like running a wire from the car battery to the fridge is a good idea. There is some complex elecrtonics trying to control the charging voltages. I qualified as an electronice engineer back in 1967. Things seem to have changed a lot since then.
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I must admit this is something I have never noticed when towing with my 14 reg Kuga.It has has two different vans on the back, and I have never known either of the fridges to "defrost" when towing.Even when using the vans in France.
I do check the blue 12v led is glowing on the fridge before leaving site or home and it is still on when arriving at my destination.
Note the blue fridge light only works with engine running.It flashes when engine turned off.
Re Tony Burton (above post)how do you know the alternator is delivering a charge when you brake?
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Hi Fozzie,
How do I know it only charges the car battery when I brake? The sales blurb told me so! I'm a believing soul!! I think it monitors the battery voltage and only charges continuously if the battery is low. It's very clever!! (I think) The temperature in France was approaching 30 degrees and we were driving for about 8 hours. My wife mopped up the water in the bottom of the fridge as I had driven such a long way.
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Tony Thanks for the reply only I was wondering if you had extra instrumentation on your Kuga to inform you when it was charging.
All I can think of is my towbar fitter possibly used a switched live from the rear of the car rather than an alternator 12v supply.
I to had high temps in France this year and travelling from the Loire back up to Jumeiges, had no mopping up of water from the fridge.
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I had this issue in 2013 and this is what i found.
1/ the battery will charge when braking, or on the overrun, using regenerative braking.
2/ It is possible to see the volts low enough for a Voltage sensitive relay to not pullin, so no fridge feed or battery charging to the caravan.
And even if it does pull in the drop out voltage on my VSR was 12.8 volts, so it can drop out.
3/ Fit a plug in voltage meter, a couple of pounds from amazon, then you can see what voltage the battery is giving.
4/ A way round it is to fit an ignition operated relay instead of a VSR, or put your lights on.
5/ The battery will have some current monitoring fitted, mine is adjacent the negative lead, this current can trigger the the alternator to charge, in practise it tells the ECU to increase the alternators field current, which sends out more volts.
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I suspect ford have updated it recently. I recently took possession of a new Smax and noticed that the fridge stays on even when the engine is off. Queried this with the towbar fitting company who think it switches off after a period of time but yet to test it and will also be with a new van anyway
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I have visited the Birmingham show today and have asked the Tech bods on the Hyundi and Jeep stands also the NCC tech bod and the caravan club( As will always be)techies and all admit it is a problem that at the moment is still being "worked on?"but none would say yes to the directly wiring to the fridge,even Dometic are trying to find a way to solve it ,they all say that it is definatly the not so "smart" alternators,which are all pert of the drive for lower emmisions and higher mpg,
When i suggested driving with dipped headlights, they thought that is possibly the only way round it for now,
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Perhaps we can ask the club's technical dept for an solution to why the same car can have different voltage outputs to the fridge whilst towing.
What does surprise me with all this,that when you think of all the caravanners who tow regularly,why this is has not been flagged up more often.
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I have the Freelander 2 SD4 automatic and the fridge works perfectly. Of course it does not have start/stop but the FL2's that have, will automatically have this disabled when towing if the correct Canbus loom was used so it cannot be blamed on that for this car.
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Having started this discussion, I am now able to report on my various findings.
This week my car dealer has told me that the problem is universal for all car makes fitted with smart alternator technology!! If you can turn off the stop/start function this helps, until the car battery is fully charged, as that is when the technology stops output from the alternator.
I understand that the form of wiring kit makes no difference.
A couple of weeks ago I towed 200 miles to Norfolk and kept the headlights on all the way. At South Mims services, about 90 miles in, I removed the lower grill to the fridge and almost burned my fingers on the exposed end of the 12v element. The fridge circuit was working.
I understand that the NCC has stated that the fridge manufacturers are looking into modified fridge circuit boards to deal with the issue of a low voltage.
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This is similar to a earlier post on here. Can I suggest that a quick visit to this might be of interest.
The post was titled-
Tow bar wiring and smart relay
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