How to thrive on a non 240v site!
Due to difficulties migrating the original thread, which was massively interesting and popular with members, I am starting another one until the original can be found and migrated to the Forum. I apologise to the original OP but I think this is far too important not to be available. Personally, I think, because of the massive moves in technology recently, this subject should have a section by itself. I don't suppose the CC would think about that? So, anything about Solar Panels, LED lighting, Inverters, Safefill even. Anything that assists the caravanners to go off grid in fact - and saves money!!
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I too have looked for the original post! I got some good advice before purchasing my solar panel last year
My set up is a 150w panel, did use a Safefill cylinder (15ltr), garage now closed and other garages will not fill it!! now use a 11kg Flo gas cylinder.
All LED lighting in caravan, small inverter for charging phone, Avtex TV uses just under 3amp so moderate usage is OK, use temporary holiday sites, rallies, 5 van sites, summer and winter, no EHU. A good cheap way to caravan. In summer 11kg of gas lasted 19 nights, cooking, hot water, BBQ, no heating of course. In winter when I used the Safefill and with heating used around 12ltrs for 4 nights. Never had a problem of the 110amp battery running low on the winter photo and 12nights on the THS.
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Merve
I have made this thread sticky for you. I have slightly edited your first sentence to give it a more positive sounding start to your new thread. Some additional posts on this subject have been made in this thread which is now locked.
David
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Thanks David. Chris, don't give up on your Safefill. Many things are in the pipeline. To have non EHU caravanning, a Safefill is a great addition to save money. I really believe that the safefill cylinder will be the default cylinder for caravanners in the future. 150w ia a nice size SP. I would say, if you want to do non EHU caravanning seriously, 120w is the starting point. Notice I say seriously! If you don't want to use your microwave and toaster, vacuum and blender then smaller ones will do it.
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It's great that a new thread has been started. Thanks to Merve for his fortitude in keeping the old thread in the forefront of CT migrators' minds.
I have ordered a new caravan with 100w SP and I'm also going to equip it with a Safefill cylinder. Our needs are relatively simple and if I can charge the phones and IT on 12v then I'm happy to use the microwave as a bread bin!
Please keep contributing as every day is a learning day!
DD
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Please do not take this the wrong way but your 2nd photo looks like a travelers site with the gas outside etc.
so glad I'm not on site along side you
The issue with filling gas weather safefill or gaslow will not get any better as garages pull out of the market, only way it will improve is if dealers start selling it alongside calor/Flo gas.
We have 130w solar panel, 2*85amp batteries and gaslow (with calor backup) but use EHU when we can, charge most things thru a USB and see no need for an inverter as we can do without 240v appliances but who knows that may change.
From your gas usage it looks like it costs around half the cost of having EHU at around 3 litres a day @55p/l versus around £3 for EHU average so not such a huge saving compared to the cost of install etc. but it gives you flexibility and wider choice of sites.
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Well done wye- it's great to know that others have found that spending on equipment and modern tech is not necessarily a way of just spending money- do it right and the money comes back to you in savings- a win win situation if ever there was one!
Pippah- how are you- hard to believe that we are nearly at the next show as we met and talked in the autumn. How are the owls? Equipment I have is 135w SP ( always been fine but you know me- always wanting something bigger- now I would go for 200w) I added a second 110ah battery and a later a 2000w pure sine wave inverter from Falcon. This allows me to use microwave, toaster, blender and vacuum. All of them are not used for long and that is free power- why use gas when the sun provides the power. (even if it is Safefill gas at 25% of the price of swapped cylinders!!) The inverter is controlled by an illuminated switch at the end of the bed box so we don't have to lift the bed up - it's easy to switch on when needed and easy to kill when not. (An inverter continues to draw power when switched on). The system is protected by a 100amp fuse. What would I like in the future? Two Li ion Batteries which weigh half of what I have now and they hold more charge and of course the 200w SP. A compressor fridge which uses very little leccy- mmm - I'll have to have a word with the boss!
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MichealT hi. I think you will find that Safefill will continue to get sites. Neil and John at Safefill are working extremely hard to bring this about. Keep the faith. It will happen I'm sure. It's too good a product not to become a massive winner with campers, caravanners, boaters, plumbers, roofers- the list goes on and I haven't even mentioned gas BBQs!!- how many millions of those are there? People power and demand will win in the end. When a garage has turned away the tenth person in a day wanting to fill their SF cylinder, they will start to think about the money they have lost. If they allow themselves to be dominated by Calor or Flo then that's up to them but in the end, there is absolutely no reason not to fill a SF cylinder. For me, it sits alongside SPs, LED lighting and USB charging as a Godsend to us lot!!
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We also lost a very good thread on "Alternative Energy," I think somewhere in that thread was a pointer to a spreadsheet for calculating the size of the solar panel.You estimating your 12 volt power consumption over a 24 hour period and input your estimates and battery size into the spread sheet. Fortunately I have a copy and I have made this available to download or open >here<.
It is easy to play around with scenarios until you think you have a good idea of what size panel you might fit or have fitted. Have fun.
peedee
P.S. The spreadsheet contains my estimates and I did fit a 120 watt panel which even in the winter is keeping my battery charged when parked up.
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my 120w roof mounted SP also is well able to keep everything charged when parked up at home...
one other point re: safefill/gaslow.....dont forget that a set of adaptors will allow LPG refilling all over Europe, at an equally low price....
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One point about the European adaptors for safefil. I think so please check. But safefil need a special apdaptor because it needs to screw into the LH thread of bottle. Safefil sell these but they are more expensive than the standard ones, which is why I said check just in case I am talking cobblers.
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Merve
My comments were aimed at refillable in the whole not just safefill, it will not be of any use until there are plenty of sites to fill up, having a 50 mile round trip is not sustainable and garages are loathe to stock it due to poor demand!!
Also you have to use enough gas to make it worthwhile my BBQ at home the cylinder is about 6 years old and still 3/4 full, when we caravanned a cylinder lasted over a season so hardly an issue.
We had Gaslow fitted in the MH as we felt we would stay in Aires etc. more so it would be handy especially abroad plus it was included in the deal
.I do not believe the market is as big as you think as the set up costs are prohibitive, if the cylinder to buy was in the region of say £50 then it would become viable for most people but only if there was somewhere to fill it so for that to happen I feel the dealers need to sell bulk as well as bottled gas, I am sure Calor and Flo gas could supply the tanks etc. but not sure the dealers would want to do that with all the H&S hassle that would come with it as well as having a pump fitted and attending it but lets see.
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To add to the above, some garages and I think BP are stopping selling gas which is a little worrying because it sounds as though it could become more scarce. Anyone contemplating buying a refillable system it may be wise to only buy one refillable with a standard bottle as spare.
peedee.
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Peedee, i use the system as you describe.....
i have one Gaslow 11kg refillable....
my second bottle hose has a std 'butane' fitting, just right for a French bottle, i also carry a Spanish 'jumbo' adaptor so that i can use a Spanish bottle should LPG be difficult to find.
however, ,y own experiences are that LPG is far easier to find in France/Spain than at home, with many large supermarkets selling it in France, along with umpteen Repsol/Cepsa stations in Spain.
i hope i have most bases covered....
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That was the system I had in my last motorhome but with a calorlite as standby. I currently have a double 11Kgm Gaslow sytem. Iif gas starts to get scarce in the UK then I will just replace one of the re-fillable with a standard bottle. Currently my local garage still sells it. Where did you get the Spanish jumbo adaptor and is it for use with the butane tail?
peedee
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Has anyone ever filled their safefill bottle abroad? - The last time I checked on the Safefill website they had very few filling facilities in mainland Europe.
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I'm sure they have! The refill sites I believe are more numerous abroad as they are much more educated about refillables. At the moment, I don't go abroad but I would have no worries about taking my SF cylinders together with adapters. I always check if there is a refill facility near to or en route to my destination. If not ( which as yet hasn't happened) I make sure I have enough gas to get me through easily.
MT, thanks for your comments but I maintain that the LPG market, although shrinking due to the failure of LPG powered cars, is still vibrant. The refillable cylinders have opened up a new revenue stream for the independents. Safefill are very busy at the moment fulfilling orders for cylinders. I agree that if you don't use much gas then obviously the purchase of one doesn't make as much sense or not as much sense as someone who does use plenty but the only difference is that you'll get your money back over a greater timescale- but you'll still get it back - which is more than you can say about the 'contract ' money you have to pay Calor.
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Hi PD (are you ok with the abbreviated form...?)
here is a link to the gaslow version at £15 which, as you suggest' screws directly onto a butane pigtail, hence the simplicity of the system.
like you, for the uk i have a local Countrywide Farmers depot only a mile or so away, bit for all trips south and east, i pass a filling station with very cheap LPG....
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For the benefit of those,who like me,have had trouble filling Safefill cylinders due to the plastic shield fitted to pumps fear not.I had a call yesterday from them after querying the problem and a solution is on the way in the form of an extension piece.As soon as they let me know when it's available I'll pass it on.
Mike
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I would like to fit permanent USB sockets on my 'van. I know I can get the 12v plug ins but I would prefer to have fitted USB sockets so that the 12v sockets can be used for other things. Not the type you can buy integrated into a 240v socket, but a stand alone socket that you can actually fit next to the sockets already on the van. I'd like to have a couple up front and a couple down near the bed. Does anyone know if these things exist? I have searched but cant find them.
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Have you looked at " Maplin" or " City Electrical" ?? 0 -
Have a look at this website and just type in usb in their search box and it brings up a couple of different types.Not cheap but still.
http://www.12voltplanet.co.uk/
Mike
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