Price Shock
We will be taking delivery shortly of a new camper van having been out of the market for 18 months and not used a Club site for a couple of years. Thought we would do a two day shakedown trip to York in April only to find the cost is £115 for two nights, 2 adults and no awning. Can anybody tell me whether this includes breakfast and evening meal?
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Welcome back. There are 33 sites listed on line within 5 miles of York and the price range is pretty variable, though if you can afford that smart new camper van I am sure you can afford the dearer ones. Good wishes.
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York is expensive, especially at peak, it is very popular and they are able to charge those sort of prices. If it’s just a shakedown pick one of the sites listed in the latest newsletter with 10% off in April / May. They are less popular and therefore cheaper anyway and now get an additional 10%. You have to stay for 3 nights but could stay, at say Graffham Water, for £97.74 even over Easter.
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Can anybody tell me whether this includes breakfast and evening meal?
In your absence they've decided to change a habit of a lifetime and consider the notion that "The customer is King/Queen/LBGT+/Non-binary etc" and not only will you be getting breakfast and evening meal but a full unit wash before leaving.
They've also managed to move the calendar and treat all of April as the 1st.🤣
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No, but it does include dedicated and secure 24hr city centre car parking for not only your car but your caravan and awning should you wish it. I’ve stayed at a few city centre hotels and car parking is extra and in some cases a right pain. Yes, it’s pricey but look at what you get!
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Hitchglitch, you are not alone. At £115 for two nights I'd need prescription medication to cope with the shock. Even Graffham Water at £97.74 for 3 nights makes me want to cry. I'm obviously a couple of decades short of reality.
Colin
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Site fees are only one element of owning a motorhome but somehow you tend not to get people complaining about fuel/servicing/insurance which probably add up to a lot more than a few nights on a campsite. There are always cheaper alternatives but when you get a campsite in a unique location costs are bound to be high. Lets face it, none of us have any idea of how much the running costs are of the York site are. If people are determined to spend less Cherry Tree Cottage (no facilities but on a regular bus service into York) will probably cost half. But you could argue that despite its value it is not as convenient as being right in your. A couple of weekends ago we spent £86 for one night in a Premier Inn, but that did include breakfast. My motorhome would have been more comfortable!
David
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Wise words David. It's all about the best fit for the situation and that will always differ from one camper to the next.
Colin
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Thank goodness for CLs - and if they get any more expensive, I'll not be renewing next
september, after 45 years !
And before anybody tells me that he club don't set CL prices, I have had first hand a number of reports that Club inspectors hav advised that owners should be charging more !
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Advice from a volunteer inspector is just that, GT, and not the same as CAMC setting prices.
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I have read these reports too. Some from regular posters on CT.
It is not in the interest of members for volunteer inspectors to advise CL owners to increase prices, so if this is indeed happening, that is not good.
There are still reasonably priced CLs out there, even near York, we have booked one for a week in April, serviced hard standing, £22 per night I think, OH makes our bookings, but it is not of course as convenient for a MH owner as being close to the city centre.
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YRP seems to be showing Full or Low Availability for most of April so clearly enough people think the price represents good value....
Why would the club charge less.....?
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I’m sure those volunteer inspectors will engage in all sorts of current tourism related chats with owners. I see no reason why pricing and related costs should be excluded from these ‘friendly’ discussions. It’s in the interests of concerned to consider all implications and issues effecting the business. That’s what businesses do.
Many of us it seems are willing to pay higher prices for the convenience of being in those places which most likely incur higher running costs. City centres are notoriously expensive places to live or run businesses in.0 -
Friendly chats are fine, but suggesting higher prices to CLs smacks of trying to make Club sites seem less pricey IMO.
I have seen some CLs asking for £30 per night, and not offering other than EHU. I do wonder how much business they get.Are there many CLs in expensive city areas?
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Could it not be that a conversation along the lines of "Your site is very good and I reckon you could ask another £5 per night like the others in this area" is actually looking after the interests of the CL owner?
I think you see conspiracies and ulterior motives where they probably don’t exist.
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These volunteer inspectors are probably the only face to face communication CL's get with the Club. Whilst the Club have clearly said that they don't recommend prices it would be foolish to think that subject of prices is not discussed on these occasions. The trouble is that automatically people think the Club is trying to influence prices when the reality is that these conversations are probably seeking general advice. So if I was a CL Inspector how should I react if the CL owners says to me that he is struggling with the fees he is charging. Surely the Inspector would ask have you considered putting your prices up? He could throw into the mix the fact that nearby CL's are charging XYZ for the same facilities so the owner has a ball park figure to consider. What would be wrong would be for the inspector to suggest they put their prices up without any prompt from the owner. I suspect those charging £25/30 a night, especially if they are offering everything a larger campsite would, without the benefit of scale, have done the maths and worked out how much they need to charge to not only recoup the investment but also make a reasonable profit.
David
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There seems to be a slight suggestion that some sort of pressure is placed on CL owners to make club site more attractive. That seems like a conspiracy to me and I cannot believe for one moment that would happen. I’m sure the CL owners would see right through such a covert attempt to ‘rig’ prices against their interests.
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Back on the original theme, yes, Club sites offer great facilities and the location of Rowntree is exceptional and, yes, I can afford it but that wasn’t the point. Two years ago Rowntree was fully booked, now it has space available. Two years ago we stayed in Honfleur at 18 Euros a night (it’s probably a bit more now). Walking distance from town, hedged pitches with tap and waste, heated sanitation blocks with hair dryers. The Clubs business model is all wrong and it will cease operating if it doesn’t change.
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I didn’t realise Honfleur was convenient for visiting York 🤔.
You are making the classic mistake of not comparing like with like, HG.
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I agree TW. York is at least 20 times the size of Honfleur, notwithstanding the the differences in country.
I think Moulesy hit the nail on the head with his per person per night breakdown. The last time we thought about visiting London we thought the pppn at Abbey Wood to be great Value for Money. Circumstances prevented that trip. As nice and as beautiful as Honfleur is there is no way that a like for like price with YRP would be VFM. Apples and Oranges.
I think you should expect to pay more for city sites. Look at the alternatives for immediate access not at where you would have to travel in.
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Of course Honfleur and York are different but they are both massive tourist attractions. How can the Honfleur site do it. Well, they have fixed rental cabins and various leisure facilities, pool, restaurant etc. The business model is totally different. How do petrol stations make money - they have mini supermarkets which I believe make more money than the fuel.
The Club’s business model is to have excellent facilities with wardens who tend the site and staff the reception. They cater for a dwindling band of discriminating caravan/Motorhome users with ever reducing budgets. Is that a “going concern” as they say in business?
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I agree with your generalisation but that doesn’t alter the fact that comparing Honfleur with York is not comparing like with like. York is York and as unique it its own way as Honfleur is in its. The financial structures and operating conditions in the two different countries make it impossible to pretend the two sites are comparable. As you say yourself, they are two different business models.
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I assume the site in question is Camping Du Phare? I can see it as a more attractive alternative to the Camper Aire across the river. However the site only has a short opening period, end of March to the end of September. All grass pitches rather than hardstanding. Obviously can't compare facilities but are they of the same quality as Rowntree Park? Price now off peak is about £22 but if you have a couple of dogs that would increase to about £27. The trouble with trying to compare UK and French sites is that we have no idea of the cost basis on which the site operates under. The fact that Rowntree Park is open all year probably adds a lot to the running costs. How do the French tax things like campsites, I am thinking either Council Tax or Business Tax? Likewise how do they staff the site, not sure how many full time staff Rowntree Park have but its probably a minimum of 4. We know from past history of the Club Accounts that the site network does not always show an operating surplus so how quite the Club could reduce its costs to get anywhere near the French site I have no idea?
For those able to go abroad I say take full advantage whilst you can.
David
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La briquerie. 19 euros per night off season. Arrive early!
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How do the French tax things like campsites, I am thinking either Council Tax or Business Tax?
DK..we stopped at a Municipal Site for one night a couple years ago where the owner asked for cash as he could not now afford a bank card reader. He explained the card reader charged 2% for every transaction which on top of his taxes didn't leave much change from the nightly fees...
Giving him the €15 in cash, he continued to explain by counting out the Euros per tax...one for le Maire, one for Regional tax, One for local tax, one for tourist tax...and finished by throwing his arms in the air and muttering something which we didn't quite catch but probably on a par with our thoughts on taxation..
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GTP
Thanks for the insight. That sounds to me as if the campsite is charging an unrealistically low nightly fee? I just wonder if you would have been willing to pay and extra 5 euros a night for that site which might have eased the owner's financial worries? The other side of all these cheap sites in France is that clearly a lot of them are uneconomic but there seems to be an over supply of pitches so they have to try and survive as best they can. In our latter years of touring abroad we noticed sites being taken over by companies that converted them to all static accommodation. I understand that many Municipal sites have been sold off, some to be converted into motorhome only stops. Going back to cost comparisons I assume how much a campsite charges, be it in France of the UK has a large element of supply and demand about it. If there is a ready supply with restricted demand prices will be lower. Whereas in the UK, certainly at certain times a year, throughout the year, demand seems to outstrip supply so just on that basic economic question prices are bound to be higher?
David
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Interesting comment in most recent Motorhome Matt podcast, he was commenting on more (motorhomes) not wanting to stay at big traditional sites and that the aire type stop was and needed to expand. More councils were beginning to understand their part in this. But he also commented that lots of sites were now just too expensive and that they were going to need to examine their cost basis.
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That’s no different to what certain folk have been saying on here for years and years and years, Hja. 🤷🏻♂️
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A lot has happened in recent years regarding over night stops for motorhomes. Can't at the moment recall the name of the group but there is a Facebook Group that suggests various pubs all over the country which seems popular. Some of them make a small charge which they will forego if you eat at the pub and others work on the basis of free over night parking if you buy a meal. Obviously if people are really intent on spending the minimum on a stop over the requirement to have a meal might too much for some? I think there are encouraging signs that some councils are making an effort to provide over night parking. It was posted on here about Bude but I suspect the £20 fee will too much for some. Campsites have a long tradition of providing a safe stopping place but that has taken years to reach the stage it is now at. It will probably be a fair while before those that want cheap or free stopovers will be satisfied?
David
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