Club Vouchers
Comments
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Yes same here. NT, Cadw, RSPB. We have annual passes to our local wildlife park, they have been up front and honest, explained that at the moment an extension is difficult, and they are concentrating efforts on the care and welfare of the animals in their charge. They are however doing an offer for NHS staff as a thank you.
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Sorry but I disagree with that. If the club dumped CL's it would be finished in no time. CL's are perfectly capable of getting their excemption certificates from other sources. We are members only because of CL's. We used to insure the caravan with the club but have voted with our feet over the tax dodging which gives the club the unfair competitive position in the market which they have trousered. We used to regularly use the club for site booking overseas and also ferry bookings until recently when we lost our deposit because of a rule weve never seen published.and so we will never use them again for that. Cl's are the Jewel in the Crown.
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Whilst I agree with a lot of what you have to say Obber I'm afraid you are mistaken with regard to the "tax dodging" element.
I explained this in the thread about insurance a while ago. The tax is not trousered, to use your words. It is a taxation that HMRC levy on insurance transactions and insurers merely act as unpaid tax collectors. This money is sent to the government. It is the same as VAT. There are exemptions to paying VAT and there are exemptions for certain insurers. The club fall into the exemption category simply due to how they have had to set the business up, something which they didn't understand at first.I am certain that HMRC would prefer it if the club did charge this tax but the rules say that they are exempt. It is up to the law makers to change that law. It is the Government that you should take exception to if you do not agree with not paying Insurance Premium Tax. You could always send them a cheque for the 9%.
There may be some clients who find the price more competitive without this tax but that assumes that it makes a difference in the first place. I am not one of those who is a big fan of the club and even have my own caravan insured elsewhere.However I do whole heartedly agree with you about CLs. If the club stopped supporting them then we would leave. I happen to agree with Ttda about club sites as well. Too many of the type we like have been lost or neglected and I disagree with DK about the Clayton site. It wasn't needed and there are areas of the UK that need club sites more than there.
I only have an emotional tie to one organisation and it isn't this club
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If it were a true business it would probably ditch CL's as beyond providing an element of membership they don't add to the bottom line because the people that use them tend not use other Club sites or services so what is the point unless the organisation is something more than a business? Any business would certainly not keep open some of the smaller sites that probably make a loss but a Club would. To me it's a funny kind of business that ignores key business priorities.
A section of DKs post.
I ran my own business a few years ago. The profit making element of this business came from Business clients. If I only dealt with those businesses I could have managed with just 1 or 2 employees. However those businesses also had spin offs which I had to handle so that the main business was protected and thrived. These spin offs were at best a break even for my company, at worst a loss as they needed more staff and infrastructure by way of bigger office etc. to deal with them. They entailed more work during the year than did the main sector.
However they were deemed necessary. One cannot always just concentrate on the bottom line for every part of a business. Supermarkets and other retailers have loss leaders. Insurance companies, Energy companies etc. all have some part of their business which makes a loss.
As the sites seem to need big investments and maintenance with high employee costs maybe the club should just concentrate on Insurance and Holidays abroad and sell all of the sites?
Sometimes one has to look at the bigger picture and accept that there are some parts of the business you just have to accept.
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but they are putting themselves at a competitive advantage operating the "cover" scheme.
wow a business giving themselves a competitive advantage who would have though it and what is so wrong with that? And of course its customers benefit as well, shocking capitalism at it's worst. The club should play fair and not do this of course.
That equates almost exactly to the 12% insurance premium tax.
Not sure what you're saying here, as WN said the club merely passes on the tax to the HMRC, you're making it sound like Obber that it is keeping it to make its premium cheaper which of course is total nonsense.
As for your dig with proper insurance that is nonsense too, Remember more people have stated on here the club has paid out fully and promptly than those with other companies who sadly said their insurance did not pay out, 3 to 2 I believe it was.
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good dodge but then why state your £60 is the same as the 12% and the competitive advantage. you posted?
A dodgy product, by whose defintion? Well the evidence with three saying the club has paid v the two who the non club company who did not pay out seems to suggest that the others maybe the dodgy ones.
I assume they changed the dates as they were so popular?
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My apologies. I'm still living in the past. The tax rate has indeed risen to 12%. See what happens when you don't keep up to date?
I'm still happy with Saga, who to be even handed did in fact settle my claim last year to my satisfaction. As it was a total loss it wasn't a small matter either. the premium at renewal only increased due to the increased value of the replacement caravan. I didn't even consider looking at alternatives.
I hope the thread can now get back on track.
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I assume they changed the dates as they were so popular?
That does not make sense to me. Surely the further into the future they are used the better for the CC. If prices have risen by the discount, there is little affect, over someone who just turns up and pays with a credit card. Plus they have had the advantage of the money in their bank for two or three years.
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Personally I just think someone "cocked up"! Apologies for any offence.
If the magazine stated an expiry date then this date was fixed before the website advertised no expiry date. Someone made a mistake, several times if they got the information about Giving Change and that denominations of £5 could be obtained. So 3 mistakes.
The least the club could now do to stem the flood of criticism is to acknowledge the error and refund those members who bought the vouchers and wish to return them due a change in terms. However the club do not seem to do themselves any favours by letting the matter fester. says a lot about organisation. Even with people working from home there must be someone who is in charge. Isn't there?
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I think you are taking what I said too literally. Many people seem to be of the view that the Club is just a business whilst others like to think of it as a Club. I was just contrasting the two views. If the only motivation of the Club (business) was to act like a business and pursue profit as it's raison d'etre it would look at all areas of its operation. What I was pointing out was that if, as a business, it was looking to maximise the profit it makes, as is usual in a business, I was suggesting that CL's don't have any financial benefit to the business except keeping a number of members onboard because they prefer that type of camping. It would be perfectly logical to come to the conclusion that it should concentrate its efforts on its main sites whilst also looking at opportunities to diversify into static accommodation. Now the reality is the the CMC is not a business as I have described, it is a member organisation so being such an organisation it wouldn't contemplate what I set above. I am just trying to point out that the views of some on here are misplaced in suggesting the CMC is "just" a business. It might be a hybrid. It also has a duty to ensure that the Club can continue so it will engage in activities we, as members, want it to.
I think others have explained the insurance situation better than I can. However this move probably comes from a situation in the recent past there the CMC was losing market share for caravan insurance. So being able to provide cover mutually means they can be more competitive which I would have thought was a good thing for members? Also worth pointing out that it only applies to caravan cover. Unfortunately my motorhome insurance through the Club is still subject to the insurance tax as is car and household insurance.
David
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Someone correct me if wrong, but I cannot find the digital May magazine online yet, so if this was the early medium used to announce the voucher scheme and it’s conditions of usage, it still hasn’t reached those like us who opted out of the paper copy. 🤷♀️
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No, I can’t see anything. I am logged in, but latest mag it shows is the April one. Any chance of you posting a link for me please?😁
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I don't think it's possible to post any sort of link but I can post screenshots. Two photos, one full page showing the advert the other an enlargement of the small print, showing it only refers to the web T&C's and doesn't give a specified date.
I realised that the paper copy arrived the other day, so checked that. In place of the 120 for 100 offer there is an advert selling gift membership. So presumably had not been thought about when that was put together.
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you could be right, I thought that people could have bought quite a lot and use them over a longer period the club would be losing out on any price rise, but it's 'epidermic' as Del would say
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Thank you Steve, I managed to find it. I will have a browse through later. I don’t think I have read April yet either.
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Hi, so. I'm the OP for this thread and just catching up on the latest posts. I was categorically told by the lady I spoke to that there was NO EXPIRY DATE to these vouchers. My husband has just retired and we have spent a lot of money on these vouchers, bought purely with the knowledge that as there was no expiry date we could use them at our leisure when the current corovanirus situation changes. I shall be on the phone first thing in the morning demanding a full refund. What a shameful way to treat its members. This change in T and C's has left a very sour taste in our mouths.
Are there any legal bods on here to say where we stand legally with reclaiming our very hard earned money.
Thanks
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Crookie - I'm no legal expert but is there not a piece of legislation about "distance selling" which entitles you to a full refund for anything bought on line or over the phone which turns out to be not fit for purpose or not as described? I think you'll be ok but doubtless someone will confirm that?
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Crookie, if there is no date shown on your vouchers and the club confirms to you in writing that there is no expiry date, then I would think you are safe in assuming that will be the case but do not take anyone's verbal assurance that there is no expiry date. Carry that written confirmation with you each time you visit a club site with the intention of paying by voucher.
If you do pursue a refund, insist on a refund of the postage cost as well and also that the club arranges return of the vouchers at their expense.
If you paid by credit card, you may have some means of recompense from the card company if things reach that stage.
I am no legal bod but that's my interpretation of the situation.
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That's not what I was saying. What my post was meant to convey is that any price rises that were planned before the virus struck will be increased due to both the loss of income because of the close down and because they have issued the vouchers and need to get the "discount" back.
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If it were a true business it would probably ditch CL's as beyond providing an element of membership they don't add to the bottom line because the people that use them tend not use other Club sites or services
Definitely not true, David, as many members that mainly cause CL's also occasionally use club sites, as pointed out by tda, and also use other club services, so they certainly do add to the bottom line as you put it. I think that you too have a very blinkered view regarding the club.
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DavidKylne wrote "Perhaps the use of the word Club is a bit old fashioned and perhaps a Member Organisation would be a more fitting description."
I'd love to know the rational or rather, the thinking behind this statement. The club in my experience is a hard nosed business, there to maximise profits. To say anything else is disingenuous in my experience.
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It’s the Club practising joined up thinking.
What I want to know now, is how will the Wardens know what’s in date, out of date, unless of course, a second round of vouchers have been produced that have dates on them? If it’s coded to an individual account, what happens if vouchers have been bought to share?😉
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