Supermarket fuel
Comments
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I can remember my father putting a couple of squirts of Redex in the tank when he filled up. Subsequently I believe that it has been proved that it did no good whatsoever.
The petrol situation is the same as supermarket food own brands that are actually from the same factory as the branded goods and identical in every way e.g. Cornflakes. People still convince themselves that the branded goods are better.
Write your comments here...
In the case of fuel it is better. It can be proven on the dynomometer. If you go to Goodwood theres a petrol station near by. Theres a speical pump there with racing fuel. Stick that in & tell me theres no difference! I've been involved with motor racing
& engine developement for years. If you want to deny the wisdom of profesionals like the AA man go ahead. It will be your wallet that suffers. I know because I have tested my Porsche on the dyno on stock pump fuel & on shell V power. Guess what it made nearly
20hp more on the V power. If you don't believe me try it yourself. The difference is massive. Oh and my aged Audi still makes 140hp just the same as it did when it was new. But only on nitro. The economy improvement is clear to see from the onboard computer.
And it's not my imagination that it runs perfectly on nitro. And in limp home mode on supermarket fuel. It's a fact. Proven on the dynomometer. I originally was blaming the turbo. So much so that I took it off the car & stripped it down to check the variable
vanes were working correctly as I was convinced that they must be sticking. But the Turbo was working perfectly.0 -
I can remember my father putting a couple of squirts of Redex in the tank when he filled up. Subsequently I believe that it has been proved that it did no good whatsoever.
The petrol situation is the same as supermarket food own brands that are actually from the same factory as the branded goods and identical in every way e.g. Cornflakes. People still convince themselves that the branded goods are better.
Write your comments here...
In the case of fuel it is better. It can be proven on the dynomometer. If you go to Goodwood theres a petrol station near by. Theres a speical pump there with racing fuel. Stick that in & tell me theres no difference! I've been involved with motor racing
& engine developement for years. If you want to deny the wisdom of profesionals like the AA man go ahead. It will be your wallet that suffers. I know because I have tested my Porsche on the dyno on stock pump fuel & on shell V power. Guess what it made nearly
20hp more on the V power. If you don't believe me try it yourself. The difference is massive. Oh and my aged Audi still makes 140hp just the same as it did when it was new. But only on nitro. The economy improvement is clear to see from the onboard computer.
And it's not my imagination that it runs perfectly on nitro. And in limp home mode on supermarket fuel. It's a fact. Proven on the dynomometer. I originally was blaming the turbo. So much so that I took it off the car & stripped it down to check the variable
vanes were working correctly as I was convinced that they must be sticking. But the Turbo was working perfectly.If you are talking petrol, then I will (and have earlier in this thread) agree if you have a race tuned engine, see benefit from the fuel with additives in.
But cannot accept what you are saying about diesel, it's just not correct.
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There is a difference between supermarkets and branded fuel.
That's a fact. But the difference is ONLY in the additive pack, the base fuel is exactly the same.
Assuming the branded fuel is superior to supermarkets fuels, which themselves use different additive packs, then its claimed to be of benefit to the engine only over a high mileage.
Which is why i only usually use supermarket fuels, my favorite is Morrisons, but usually we use Tesco because it the nearest and cheaper than Shell locally. Least favorite is Asda, i'm sure their additive pack isnt as good.
Basic BS EN 590 only has the same additives for lubricity etc, so for the base fuel they are all the same*. We have small additive tanks for the premium versions of the branded versions, as other have said, these are metered into the road tanker during loading - all other additives are added at the blenders before coming to the main RTW loading tanks.
If you buy the Turbo-Nitro-Carlos-van-Dango version, then yes you are getting a brand specific additive to the standard fuel. Typically at the ppm level, which equates to around a spoonful in a full tanks fill, for which you will pay perhaps £5?
If you have a performance petrol car, I would agree these are perhaps worth the extra (if you feel you need the extra), but diesel vehicles are quite indifferent to additives and operate on a much broader calorific range - as I have said before, my old 90 runs fine on old veg oil, the only difference is that it smells like I'm cooking chips.
If you buy bog standard, then its just bog standard!
*When I say same, see my comments previously - its slightly different week to week based on what goes into the blend and its different summer to winter (if you have a jerry can, fill it in winter, winter spec fuel has less water in it) and also will vary refinery to refinery subject to what distillates they make and also what 'bio' components they blend Ethanol or Methanol or both, to enable them to get the best 'government incentives'
How do you know what the additive packs contain?
As far as i know Esso, Shell, and the supermarkets generally keep their additive packs a close secret.
Yes the base fuel is the same, but not the additive pack added into the tanker at distribution. That's even been televised in the past.
If you have a link i'm more than happy to say i'm wrong, but having read posts from OTHER people that work in the industry they admit to using branded fuel simply because they say the additive pack benefits the engine LONG TERM.
I don't bother because my cars have less than 30K miles on them when i change.
I should also point out than some cars are designed to run better at 98 octane, that's another FACT, it was provided in print when i owned a 1999 Audi A4 Quattro petrol.
The car produced 180 BHP when run on 98, but could be used with a lower octane with a power reduction.
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My local AA man may not work in the fuel industry however in conversation with him many months ago I noted he owns an Accord and Passat diesel and his comment was he always uses premium brands. When asked why his response was simply down to overvation of
problems over the years from car owners using supermarket fuels.accepting that is subjective response and putting that to one side what can CJ tell us about cetane values in diesel? do they vary and can additives improve values?
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The fact that performance race cars use special fuel has been put forward to draw the conclusion that supermarket fuel is rubbish.
However as far as I know a formula one engine has a life of about 1000miles, before they are scrapped and mpg is poor as well. . So therefore you can come to the logical conclusion that the fuel they use is rubbish as the engines don't last may be they
would be better filling up at Tesco's?On a more serious note I can't remember when I last had a mechinical engine fault at least 500,000 miles ago. I use almost exclusively Supermarket fuel and that 500K miles includes two Passat's and an Accord and I gladly trade a bit of performance for longevity
and reliabiltyAt the end of the day it is your money and your choice.
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When ever I fill up with supermarket fuel, my diesel Santa Fe smokes on start up. When I use branded fuels it doesn't.
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Maybe the bad reactions to Supermarket fuels is down to the Diesel engine fitted to certain vehicles, maybe not as robust as others. The engine does seem to be a common denominator. I've never had a problem over the years & I use S/mkt fuel exclusively.
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When ever I fill up with supermarket fuel, my diesel Santa Fe smokes on start up. When I use branded fuels it doesn't.
does the Smart get the full fat petrol?
Yes it does, and the supermarket ones are fine!
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There is a difference between supermarkets and branded fuel.
That's a fact. But the difference is ONLY in the additive pack, the base fuel is exactly the same.
Assuming the branded fuel is superior to supermarkets fuels, which themselves use different additive packs, then its claimed to be of benefit to the engine only over a high mileage.
Which is why i only usually use supermarket fuels, my favorite is Morrisons, but usually we use Tesco because it the nearest and cheaper than Shell locally. Least favorite is Asda, i'm sure their additive pack isnt as good.
Basic BS EN 590 only has the same additives for lubricity etc, so for the base fuel they are all the same*. We have small additive tanks for the premium versions of the branded versions, as other have said, these are metered into the road tanker during loading
- all other additives are added at the blenders before coming to the main RTW loading tanks.If you buy the Turbo-Nitro-Carlos-van-Dango version, then yes you are getting a brand specific additive to the standard fuel. Typically at the ppm level, which equates to around a spoonful in a full tanks fill, for which you will pay perhaps £5?
If you have a performance petrol car, I would agree these are perhaps worth the extra (if you feel you need the extra), but diesel vehicles are quite indifferent to additives and operate on a much broader calorific range - as I have said before, my old 90
runs fine on old veg oil, the only difference is that it smells like I'm cooking chips.If you buy bog standard, then its just bog standard!
*When I say same, see my comments previously - its slightly different week to week based on what goes into the blend and its different summer to winter (if you have a jerry can, fill it in winter, winter spec fuel has less water in it) and also will vary
refinery to refinery subject to what distillates they make and also what 'bio' components they blend Ethanol or Methanol or both, to enable them to get the best 'government incentives'How do you know what the additive packs contain?
As far as i know Esso, Shell, and the supermarkets generally keep their additive packs a close secret.
Yes the base fuel is the same, but not the additive pack added into the tanker at distribution. That's even been televised in the past.
If you have a link i'm more than happy to say i'm wrong, but having read posts from OTHER people that work in the industry they admit to using branded fuel simply because they say the additive pack benefits the engine LONG TERM.
I don't bother because my cars have less than 30K miles on them when i change.
I should also point out than some cars are designed to run better at 98 octane, that's another FACT, it was provided in print when i owned a 1999 Audi A4 Quattro petrol.
The car produced 180 BHP when run on 98, but could be used with a lower octane with a
power reduction.If your talking petrol, see my other comments, I was referring primarily to diesel.
I don't know the specific formulation, but obviously as the chemicals on site I have to have the MSDS sheets, but as I'm sure you would understand, its more than my jobs worth to share that sort of information.
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When ever I fill up with supermarket fuel, my diesel Santa Fe smokes on start up. When I use branded fuels it doesn't.
What branded fuel?
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Happy to use branded, we run a fleet of vans, we ran them on supermarket for awhile and then on branded, we get 3mpg better on branded, our emissions are lower at MOT time, the run better and our servicing costs are less.
You may well do that and have found that, but it has nothing to do with where you bought your fuel!
The only thing you have is anecdotal evidence and have made a correlation where there is no causation.
Unless you have run randomised double blind trials and have statistical data to back it up, all you have is a feeling.
Yep, it's a feeling alright, when I look at the emissions read out, the mpg read outs and the bill for the servicing, strange the feelings you get with your eyes.
Feeling with your eyes....really!
Sorry, but a feeling is all that is, you have not undertaken a proper trial and are therefore drawing incorrect conclusions which is costing your business money.
I know you won't be persuaded, that is the nature of 'faith in ones belief'.
I wish you all the best - merry Xmas!
Happy to use branded, we run a fleet of vans, we ran them on supermarket for awhile and then on branded, we get 3mpg better on branded, our emissions are lower at MOT time, the run better and our servicing costs are less.
You may well do that and have found that, but it has nothing to do with where you bought your fuel!
The only thing you have is anecdotal evidence and have made a correlation where there is no causation.
Unless you have run randomised double blind trials and have statistical data to back it up, all you have is a feeling.
Yep, it's a feeling alright, when I look at the emissions read out, the mpg read outs and the bill for the servicing, strange the feelings you get with your eyes.
Feeling with your eyes....really!
Sorry, but a feeling is all that is, you have not undertaken a proper trial and are therefore drawing incorrect conclusions which is costing your business money.
I know you won't be persuaded, that is the nature of 'faith in ones belief'.
I wish you all the best - merry Xmas!
What, because it's not in your Lab, we have run the vehicles on Supermarket carp for two weeks, we then had poor starting in the winter, more smoke on start up, our emission read outs were higher, then ran on branded for two weeks, the results spoke for
themselves, no smoke, lower emission readout, better starting and better pulling along with 3mpg improvement. Back to Supermarket carp, results again fell away, back on branded and results improved.Take the pee all you want, but the results show us which is better for us.
Merry Christmas
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Sounds a bit fishy to me, all this carp!
http://www.motoring.co.uk/car-news/is-supermarket-fuel-bad-for-your-car-_65626
jury is obviously out!
Very interesting that Mickey Boy, Thankyou. I use S/Mkt fuel exclusively & yet I don't get the same mpg with each tank fill up due to my driving style or hold ups etc, how anyone can be accurate to a few mpg is beyond me, I'd have thought to be that accurate
it should be tested on a rolling road-clinical like conditions.0 -
Sounds a bit fishy to me, all this carp!
http://www.motoring.co.uk/car-news/is-supermarket-fuel-bad-for-your-car-_65626
jury is obviously out!
Very interesting that Mickey Boy, Thankyou. I use S/Mkt fuel exclusively & yet I don't get the same mpg with each tank fill up due to my driving style or hold ups etc, how anyone can be accurate to a few mpg is beyond me, I'd have thought to be that accurate
it should be tested on a rolling road-clinical like conditions.Write your comments here...what I have found to be interesting is that there have been complaints against the branded fuel stations too. These reports of contaminated, indifferent quality fuel seems to have blighted both the branded and supermaket fuels
providers occasionally. Not surprising really after what we are told about the origins. Thankfully, these instances are extremely rare but subject to much reporting and speculation when they do happen. Out of this the conspiracy and mythology stories abound
It would seem!0 -
I agree, it's very hard to determine an accurate mpg test when perhaps just going around and about, you do need to drive a particular route in the same driving style under the same conditions, if possible! I use both supermarket and branded diesel, though
in the present situation, regarding low crude prices, my local branded diesel is only 1p dearer than the local superamarket, and is nearer.John C
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.what I have found to be interesting is that there have been complaints against the branded fuel stations too. These reports of contaminated, indifferent quality fuel seems to have blighted both the branded and supermaket fuels providers occasionally. Not
surprising really after what we are told about the origins. Thankfully, these instances are extremely rare but subject to much reporting and speculation when they do happen. Out of this the conspiracy and mythology stories abound It would seem!To me as all the fuel comes from the same refinery the problem has to be at the petrol stations and down to how often they clean the tanks. The only problem I have had was using Shell but I suspect the retailer not the brand but you cannot prove it either
way.0 -
We normallly use the "cheapest" in our area normaly supermarket( Asda) without problems,we have been in Devon for new year and needed to fill up before the journey home and the cheapest was a Shell station 99.9p diesel,so 48lts for 254 mls later i found no difference in performance or mpg,compared to outward journey,
ps weather dry in both directions and no traffic holdups,it was when we were there the weather was rubbish
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supermarket fuel is rubbish, a few of us have proved it, try filling up at the supermarket for a few months, then get branded fuel, see the extra 20 m.p.g.
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....., see the extra 20 m.p.g.
that'd almost double my mpg then
All my cars have almost always been filled with supermarket fuel with no problems at all. I couldn't
tell if 'branded' fuel was any better cos I've not used enough of itMM, I think someone had an overactive imagination. Extra 20 mpg!
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supermarket fuel is rubbish, a few of us have proved it, try filling up at the supermarket for a few months, then get branded fuel, see the extra 20 m.p.g.
Write your comments here...Super market fuel is great, i get an extra 40 mpg using it compared to dearer fuels.
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supermarket fuel is rubbish, a few of us have proved it, try filling up at the supermarket for a few months, then get branded fuel, see the extra 20 m.p.g.
...I think you mean possibly up to 20miles per tank full anything above that is pure fantasy
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supermarket fuel is rubbish, a few of us have proved it, try filling up at the supermarket for a few months, then get branded fuel, see the extra 20 m.p.g.
Write your comments here...Super market fuel is great, i get an extra 40 mpg using it compared to dearer fuels.
..Is that all
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....., see the extra 20 m.p.g.
that'd almost double my mpg then
All my cars have almost always been filled with supermarket fuel with no problems at all. I couldn't tell if 'branded' fuel was any better cos I've not used enough of itMM, I think someone had an overactive imagination. Extra 20 mpg!
I realised than TW ..... my car does low 20s around town & towing. Maybe dakota meant an extra 20 miles per tank
I see JVB beat me to it
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supermarket fuel is rubbish, a few of us have proved it, try filling up at the supermarket for a few months, then get branded fuel, see the extra 20 m.p.g.
Strongly recommend that you read "ChemicalJaspers" post on page two of this thread !!
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